Don't Race 1/4 mile....

It's only a matter of time before the Japanese manufacturers start moving in on Ferrari's road cars. True Honda started with the NSX but, Toyota has plans to move in with it's Lexus brand:

From the New York Times on line:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/10/automobiles/10NUG-LEXUS.html?oref=login

Lexus Hints at a Wild Streak

By NICK KURCZEWSKI

Published: January 10, 2005

Introduced on Sunday: Lexus LF-A design study

What’s the point? Add Toyota’s Lexus division to the growing list of automakers hoping to lift their images with a little sex appeal – in the form of an 200 mile-an-hour sports car that could compete with the likes of Ferrari and Porsche.

Is it real? Lexus is being coy, but reports of LF-A’s being tested on racing circuits suggest the car does not exist solely to be admired on a display stand at auto shows.

The company line: “This car makes you feel younger and richer just looking at it,” said Jim Press, executive vice president of Toyota’s American sales division.

The view from here: The company’s news release is laughably vague, not even mentioning what type of engine is under the hood. But Toyota is eager to reap some benefit from its costly involvement in Formula One racing, and a project like the LF-A could help establish that link in the minds of customers.

What makes it tick? Presumably a V-10 or V-8 engine – Lexus would only say it would be smaller than 5 liters and produce more than 500 horsepower.

How much? How soon? In this class, a six-figure window sticker is expected. But if the fortunes of Toyota’s Formula One team do not improve, there may be no justification for producing an image-leader like this – at any price.

What do you think?

The disguised car photos are from testing at the Nuremburg ring.
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Keeping it simple....if you want to be the "King of the street" and have a super-fast quick car and race other people; you don't do it in a Ferrari. Wrong car, wrong race (uless your Whart....that Barchetta is SICK )

The Ferrari is artwork; it's beautiful, stylish and elegant. To back it up they put some serious hardcore handling behind it and an engine that'll move you around with plen-tay of zip. If anything, Ferrari has the high-speed thing done right...the car is super stable at speeds where most other cars feel like your taking chances with your life. AND YOU GET ALL THIS STOCK.

Sure, you can build ANY car and load the engine up with horsepower and dash down the road in a blur. And no matter how fast you build it, someone else is inevitably going to be faster.

I'm sure it would be fun to have a 1,000 horsepower Supra and know that your lethal to just about anything else on wheels....but ya know what: cruising up PCH, doing the wine-country thing with the top down or just playing around in the canyons on a nice day: I'll take the Ferrari hands-down!

It's a Ferrari thing...if I have to explain it to ya....you wouldn't understand......

 

I completely agree. Even though I dont have a ferrari, I say the same thing with my maserati. Hands down.

 

The Velvet Hammer strikes again......................

I'll stop and shoot the crap with these guys if they want to talk about cars but when it comes to posturing I try to stay cool and let them put on the show, thats their gig, they can have it.. .........................

 

Aaaaarrrrggghhhh!! You're KILLING ME here! You need to start getting some kits put together for us. I have some "hunting" to do.

 

I will. I'm moving in exactly 2 months and the new place will have a nice BIG workshop...I'll try to have a kit by the end of summer. You could get a head start and do the EFI part now. I will be working with a freind, Rob at http://force-efi.com/ he will be making and selling the kits for both the efi and the superchargers. The efi part is really his end, so you can do that now, just be sure and tell him it's a prep for the blower so you can the right injectors and map sensor. Once the efi is done the blower will pretty much be a bolt-on.

 

That is a sad sad thought. In the 60s is when the hemis, 454 and 460 came out, and I think each came well over 400 hp....so it wasn't any easier then.

If you never try because you are afraid to fail, you will live a very dull life IMO.

And last, Ferrari builds cars that are at least as fast as anything else off the showroom floor. The difference is that there are a lot of other brand car that end up with modifications and not many Ferraris that do. Clearly it cost way way less to go drag race a Chevy than it does a Ferrari, and it costs way less to go road race a porsche than a ferrari, as that is what most normal people do. They drag there chevy (or supra or.....)and roadrace there
porsche. It's not that a ferrari is ANY less capable, it just costs more to get the same result so people don't do it. There are a few dozen ferraris out there with heavy mods that can run the 1/4 with most anyone.

 

Why would you alter a ferrari. I built a brand new chevy engine with new block,heads,rods,crank,ect. Not a single chevy part. Paid about half what a used ferrari v12 would cost. Why risk the motor, trans, axle, reliability. Those cars are packed with power but to get that power to the ground you loose comfort and "cruisability". Dont ruin the ferrari to go out and beat cars that are ruined!! By ruined i mean the days of jumping in and cruising are over.

Trust me, 1200+ horsepower is fun to drive up and down Gratiot or Woodward but it's a good thing i only live a few miles from both. The more power the more $$$ and work it takes to keep it on the road.
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If you don't want to race the 1/4 mile that's one thing but not to do it just because you're afraid to get beat in your F-car is not the right attitude IMO. Wouldn't you get tired of spanking "fast" 14 second Hondas all day? I personally don't race my 360 because the car is still new to me and I guess the thought of powershifting my gearbox and missing is too much of a deterent for me. I do commend you guys who, like mk e, who push the limits of their motor but alas for me... I haven't reached that comfort zone yet. I'll stick with pushing my domestic grocery getter for now...... Heck for 8900 dollars I got 300 rwhp tuned by one the best in the country albeit it was a used blower kit... that's what I call bang for the buck.

 

You have a brand new chevy engine and not a single chevy part? I think you are missing the point. I know at least for me.... the whole building process if at least 3/4 of the fun. I could easily go out and buy a car that someone else has built but... it wouldn't really be my "creation". That's the fun in customization. You can ALWAYS BUY a faster car but who cares..... there's ALWAYS someone faster.

 

Stage 1, 2, 3, and 4 upgrades are readily available for Ferraris from Norwood (now in kit form). I have a Stage 2 TR with 606 RWHP and love it. I am seriously considering a 360 Turbo from Norwood. Driveability and reliability are very good and the fun factor is greatly improved. I do not "street race"; not because I am afraid to loose but because I believe it is unsafe and very self centered to endanger innocent people to proove such an insignificant point.

 

How much does a 360 turbo conversion cost? Is you TR turbo or supercharged and did they have to change out the pistons?

 

Is that a twinscrew or a roots? How are you running 22 psi? Do you have an intercooler buried somewhere?

 

Big reason I bought the Maserati Spyder over a Ferrari was I knew even by spending the extra bucks on a Ferrari the car would get smoked by all those tuners and was still only about as fast as a stock $33,000 Subaru WRX STi. I have no desire to be the fastest, Just love driving in a Luxury GT and I think Maserati gives you a little more of that over the sportier Ferrari

 

C'mon.. a STOCK subaru STI? Give the 360 a little credit here... not even close, now perhaps a 50K ZO6 would be a little more realistic.

 

Ok maybe I am a bit off as I don't know the times for new 360 Spyder but the couple year old ones were about 4.5 sec's and the Subaru only slightly slower. But my point was I could care less about those times, Give me a Fine Italian car any day

 

Not sure on the 360 cost, I have not got that far with them. My TR setup is turbocharged with intercoolers, running stock internals and relatively low boost- 10 psi.

 

I did build that motor and car for that matter.

Point was simply this. If you want to go fast 0 to ? mph in a straight line, Ferrari is not the car. If you want to do 150mph all day and drive in style, now were talking ferrari. If you love the sound of a v12 screaming 8000rpm, Ferrari is the only choice. Making drag racers out of them takes something away.

My opinion only!

 

I have owned several 9 sec cars, C5 MTI 422 stroker/NOS 9.71@145, several Vipers including my current all motor GTS 510 stroker [email protected] and a 1000hp Supra 9.81@154mph. My Lexus SC300 [email protected] will outrun most of the Ferraris here, but in the end when you twist the key to your beautiful sounding Ferrari, YOU WIN.. My 550 went 12.89@118, it's not fast but it's cool. I been driving my new 360 around these past few days, and keep wanting it to be faster, but it's not all about a 1/4 mile race or a roll on race, it's about everything Ferrari stands for. There might be some Jap cars that are alot faster but when you pull up to a race or show where there are alot of these cars are in a Ferrari, everyone still gawks..

SW

 

That's all i'm saying!!

 

It's a lysholm (whipple) ax2300 twinscrew. The blower sits as low in the valley as I could get it and discharges up into the manifold. There is a copper/nickel alloy water/air intercooler sitting in the top part of the manifold with two 1" water lines feeding it about 15 gpm. There are 2 dedicated radiators (seperate from engine cooling) mounted up front to dump the heat and an electric pump that kicks on when the air temp goes up over 45C, the boost goes up over 5psi or the rpm is over 4500 and stays on until none of those things are true plus 30 seconds.

I'm looking into changing cams now in an effort to keep hp up and drop the peak boost. Right now the boost hits 15psi by 3000 rpm and stays there until 5500 (the torque peak) then climbs slowly to 17psi at 6500, then climbs to 22 by 7500. I'm pretty sure that is because the cams are so mild and the torque is falling (falling torque means the engine in not filling the cylinders). I think about 10 degrees more duration in the cam will cure that. I had a roots blower on it before and didn't have this condition because the roots blowers ability to pump also drops at high rpm, so it matched the engine pretty well...the twinscrew pumps better at high rpm, so I have a bit of a flow mismatch and therefore rising boost....it's still fast, but if I can get rid the rising condition, I can spin the blower faster, have more power everywhere and still have less total boost, seems like a win-win to me.

 

Didn't mean to be critical, just my opinion. BTW, nice Chevelle.... what kind of numbers were you making with that motor?

 

What did you drop your compression to? Did you consider an air to air setup? I've got a similar setup with the Paxton Novi kit on my Viper with an air to water aftercooler running at about 11 psi on stock pistons. I was thinking about using a methanol injection to cool the charge a little more for additional safety. A 100 shot of NOS would cool things nicely also. BTW, no hard feelings about the previous post.

 

I agree.... SW, are you the one that drives Roof's car at all the V10 national events?