Dave do me a favor, dont pray for me. That car was being tracked #1, #2 the early signs of wear were there for a while, they had time to be addressed but were not. #3 Having a problem with my Ferraris valve guides should be the biggest problem in my life, don't be such a drama queen.
When the guide goes bad, the valve quits seating properly and eventually caused a hot spot on the valve causing failure. The tracking didn't cause the problem, it was just the final straw on that one valve. I was doing a lead and follow for most of the track time, with only 6 hard laps with an instructor in my passenger seat before we got rained out. Never got it past 3rd gear, and didn't flog it at redline the whole time, so I think the breakage was timing and not abuse. Do I get a sense from you that tracking is wrong? I would hope any Ferrari owner would jump at the chance to get on the track to really experience what the car can do.
Not at all, I just meant that it's generally much harder on the car tracking it than your regular spirited rides. I think that it's expected frequent tracking will definitely require the car to have more service issues.
What are you talking about?? They're only applicable for purposes of this poll if they really require replacing, not if they owner decided to do so for peace of mind without any telltale symptoms, or urging from their mechanics. Partisanship?
DIGMAN52, Was this due to a valve guide? Today I spent a few hours helping with a 355 engine and looked at the "valve guides" and they were just "tubes" that the stem slides into. So could the problem be the stem itself? Hope this is not a dumb question! --tony
In the below picture is the discoloration normal or a sign of a valve problem? Image Unavailable, Please Login
That discoloration is normal and will start to be evident very soon after installation of the headers. Also your picture looks to be cyl #1, or in any case an end cyl prob a front. I have never seen an end cyl burn a header or a valve (I'm sure it has happened but it is unusual). The middle cylinders (2-3-6-7) run hotter and are in normal circumstances the ones to go.
This chat room gets refered to as the source of reason as to why guides should be replaced. "they say on Ferraichat.com it should be updated" I have read all cars fail on Ferrari chat.com" Well some of the threads show a nice suprise and common sense. Ii see many are saying only a few have had an issue which is nice to read as that is acurate. Ferrari built about 10 000 of these cars and have only had repairs around the world of a small percentage. Even if 200 cars had needed replacement; 2% is not an eppidemic.
Well, this poll is not scientific...but we are running closer to 20% my friend, so not inconsequential....especially if you are one of the 20%!
20% is correct and alot of F355's haven't racked up the mileage yet wait until alot of F355's have 40k, 50k, plus miles on them as i said, time will tell personally i don't think there's any hope in having the old style valve guides go the distance this is all just wishful thinking "justifying" so that F355 owners can either sell their cars without getting dinged or so that they don't have to spend any money my 2 cents
It seems none of you read my post above with the attached link I posted. I spoke with the head of FNA, two people at the factory in Italy (one who was head of engine design on the 355) and a host of other experts. If any car would have serious valve guide issues my car would be a candidate. My 95 Challenge car came from the factory completely stock as a street car and was a very early serial number (one of the first delivered to the US). I had well over 13,000 miles when it was sold and nearly half those miles were after it was converted to a Challenge car and driven hard at the track. I am not known for just putzing around the track.........I've matched the official track records at three East Coast tracks. The things to look for are high oil consumption and bad leak down and compression numbers. My car had neither. Read my link, I did a lot of homework on the issue. Regards, Jon P. Kofod www.flatoutracing.net
According to this poll 18 out of every 100 cars have encountered this issue to date. Most high performance cars will generally run into some substantial engine problems at 50K plus miles anyway,(even though it hasn't been proven they will even go bad by than) so I don't think this signifies a 355 valve guide epidemic. An 82% chance guides wont go bad on cars up to 10 years old,(and a portion of them were done preemptively anyway) I'll take those odds any day. Just my opinion.
20% is correct according to Mr. Willaims at FNA. Here were my findings listed in my post/link: Myth #1: All 1995 F355 have valve guide issues and need their original valve guides replaced Fact: Completely false. According to FNA technical director Adam Williams, only about 20% of all 95-model year 355s experienced excessive valve guide wear and needed them replaced. And in fact, about half way through the 1995 model year the factory changed over to a different type of valve guide (the ones that they replaced the old ones with on the early cars). Regards, Jon
I have a '95 355gtb . I have 19,000 miles - 5000 of which I have put on the last year and a half. I do not burn oil, idle rough or blow smoke on accel or decel. I have had no probs w/ valves or exhaust manifold. FOA has done a PPI and confirmed no evidence of either. I am, however, trying to sell my baby for personal reasons. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4531764242 5 emails rolled in today about the car - they all ask about the valve guides! Geez. FWIW R
I have voted already but I am adding my cars year and mileage to help provide more usefull information. - 1995 GTS (December 1995 Build Date) - 21,000 miles - I track the car in the summer (May to Sept) about 3 days each month
1995 355 Spider - 24,500 miles. Just did all valve guides after burning a valve at the track. Also had a exhaust header break at 23,000. Seat rails too. All the classic 355 stuff, but at 8,500 rmp at full howl I forget about those things. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Me thinks Michael355 is terrified of his car. It seems to me..judging by his posts that he would much rather belive that there is not an issue with the valve guides in the 355. The fact of the matter: THERE IS AN ISSUE WITH VALVES GUIDES IN THE 95-97..and in some cases 98 355's. Ferrari would not have needed to upgrade the guides if the old ones were fine. There would be no valves guides that needed to be replaced at 12kmiles. There would be no oil fouling of plugs or rough running cars. There would be no cars that consume more oil then ususal. There would be no need to pull the heads and replace burned valves and washed liners because of oil. The 355 would be just a peachy little car. The FACT of the matter is THAT THERE IS AN ISSUE WITH THE TOP ENDS OF THESE ENGINES!! Why can you not see this? What is the big problem? Did you buy a car that you can't really afford? Are you the typical all flash and no cash living on credit cards? If you're not (as you will say) then what are you worried about? If your car does not have the issue..great go make love to it. If you car does have the issue fix it or sell it. Ferrari makes cars that are mediocurr at best. They are fine looking cars, drive and sound like nothing else on the road..but damn it folks..they cost money to fix. If you don't like it, get out of the game and buy a toyota. Sorry to rant..but this issue has been beat to death. I for one have seen MANY 355 with this issue and have repaired about 4 of them. The latest being a 97. They come into my shop to be PPI..first thing it do..pull the plugsand the number of these cars I have seen with oil crusties on the plugs is quite large, and I live in Canada..you guys have more 355's in the states..so going by averages..i going to take a stanb that 30-40% of the early cars will show some guide wear. Take it for what it is. A CAR fix it or forget it! (flamesuit on)
If you have repaired them , you must know how much it cost to fix it. If you catch early enough do you have to worry about any other damage caused by faulty guides? Is this a $3k, $5k, or $10K problem? Thanks.
It is a costly repair. The guides are expensive and there are 40 of them in the engine. Last price I got was 57 bucks a guide, mind you that is at an inflated dealer price. Other damage that can result if the problem is not repaired soon enough are..burned valves, damaged cylinder liners, piston crown damage, valve seat damage etc. As far as a repair cost..this really depends on what you find once you get the car apart. If it is just replace the guides, and all the valves can be saved your looking in the area of 10-12k based on a 95 dollar per hour door rate. With this very basic quote I have factored in machine shop costs aswell. It is not a cheap repair by any means. I have not included other things like hoses and anything else that may need to be adressed while the engine is out. You could walk back to your car 20k lighter in the wallet by the time you have it back in your driveway. Again VERY rough estimate.
The retail price for valve guides, 15k service, and belt change was $11K from FoA. Just valve guides would obviously come in under this.
1 I personally know about 10 other 355 owners none of which have had a guide problem so far. Ferrari also upgraded thier cam belt bearing and tensioners, that doesn't mean ever 355 has bad ones, just that if they go bad the upgrade is used. Are you the typical all flash and no cash living on credit cards? Yup living on my Centurion card, you still getting cash back on your Discovery card? If you don't like it, get out of the game and buy a toyota. I didn't mind dropping the $4400 in December to do the cam bearing upgrade, but I wouldn't pay for a repair that wasn't needed, trying to convince people of it sounds like the way you drum up business. I hope that flamesuit it pretty thick, your response was totally unprofessional down right nasty (hence a response I generally would never do). 355 guides aren't even relevant at this point, your rude and insulting post is. You sound like a very jealous person who himself is living off his credit cards and wishes more 355 were bad so you can try to cover the mortgage again this month, pretty damn lame.
