Chipping my 355 on Tuesday

Do you mean me? Yep...i've had it on the dyno...you can overlay the power curves of my car and a couple of other 355s and their identical. it doesn't drive any better down low, though. it appears to be the same everywhere. waste of time and it's the reason why i don't believe it when ANYONE says they got more HP out of a 355 just by changing chips or exhaust.

 

What did you have done to the motec? who tuned it for you? trouble for me is i don't want to mess with the aesthetics of the car as they are already perfect. what i do want though is a better 2nd and 3rd gear setup. this is either done directly with the gearbox or trying to increase low down torque. the challenge already has a BHP increase over the OBD2 cars cos of the air intake setup. does that mean the gains cannot be had on that car? has ferrari successfully setup the 355 to have absolutely the maximum amount of torque/bhp available whilst using 98 octane? i wish someone from ferrari would answer the question. every car is different though. my 355 with hyperflow cats and capristo exhaust most definitely has more grunt. i just thought the ECU would be the final couple of percent. is there such a thing as a 355 tuning expert on this board who could chime in?

 

What do you mean "what did i have done"? Motec was installed on this car. It was tuned by a man highly regarded and recommended by Motec. Car runs perfectly....exactly the same as a standard one!

WHen you say "definitely has more grunt", you have, of course, measured this on a dyno. what were the differences in HP?

 

nothing scientific. just that the same hills every day before i did the cat and exhaust swap had to be taken in 2nd gear or even 1st gear to overtake people. now i can do them in 2nd and 3rd gear. there was no way in hell i could use 3rd gear the way i do now. that's what i mean by more grunt.

 

Well, that's not very scientific. Actually, it's no proof at all, sorry. It might feel different because it sounds different? Maybe your old exhaust system had a cat blockage or something...who knows. BUT...i've seen different 355s on the same dyno with different exhausts and, in my case, different engine management systems with all pretty much identical power curves. I've posted the graph before, but here it is again.

http://www.pless.com.au/355s.jpg

 

Not just exhaust. I have Hyper Flow cats on now too. It was after I switched the cats to the new ones that I felt the torque. I never said it was scientific, i said the opposite.

So let me get this straight, as you seem to be a tuner, you're saying there are no gains to be had in the 355 whatsoever from CAT, exhausts, chips, anything. The only gains can be had by lowering the weight? Well my cats are lighter than stock and my exhaist is loads lighter than stock. maybe that's what i felt. who cares, it feels better to me. and that's the whole point of this.

 

Couple of side-points:

1. Most "money-back-if not happy" deals are a safe bet for any vendor to offer, as most people won't take them up on it. Most of us WANT it to work out & feel a bit embarassed it it didn't, and then you've often almost got to PROVE that it didn't improve things (hard). I reckon the seller should prove his point FIRST rather than making you disprove him later. Any professional would have independently verified results of multiple before/after tests on the specific car in question to support his case, and not just "no worries mate, you'll get an extra 30HP easy!"

2. How much "come-back" is there to aftermarket chippers regarding the medium/long-term effects on the car? None. Who knows what actually is changed in the ECU setup? Ferrari have done tens of thousands of hours of engine testing on/off dynos, for the road cars as well as the hot-rod specials. Is a lowering of the A/F ratio or an advance of timing at any given point of the engine cycle going to cause some cascading issues somewhere? How does a chipper know - all he may want to do is get a higher torque/HP number at that point & then move on. Guys it's a Ferrari you've got not an EVO or WRX - caveat emptor.

 

I agree with you on this. Just looking to increase power/weight ratio without sacrificing the aesthetics. instead of chipping, does changing the air intakes really have any effect? or for that matter, does changing the manifolds/headers to a tubi give any performance gain?

 

I'm certainly not a tuner! But that chart reflects my experience. Chips MUST be a waste of time, as far as I can tell, from that.

 

FWIW, I think Pless's car runs better than most low down, but it may just be the lighter flywheel/clutch that can be felt.

There are many things that reduce laptime and improve acceleration that cannot be read (or are very hard to see) on a dyno.

Flywheel weight, gear ratios, aero drag, mechanical drag (wheel bearings, brakes, gearboxes), tyres, air inlet/filter efficiency (yes, really)...

Also, removing cats is the biggest gain you'll do to any car without actually adding anything. On 360C (I've tested extensively) it makes a big difference... easily measurable on a stopwatch, if not a dyno.

 

the 355 is my daily drive and cannot remove the cats. it's loud enough now as it is and my neighbours hate it already. i'll check the thread for air filter info.

 

A couple of questions;
Are you sure your original ECU was standard?
What fuel are you tuning/testing for?

 

Removing the cats doesn't ahve to mean much more noise.

Our racing has to be 95db, so I fit small silencers in place of the cats, not just open test pipes.

A road car would be quite ok with cats out, std (or close) silencer, and cat replacement silencers.

I get mine made by my fabricator. It really isn't that hard.

 

Hmmm,, might consider that then. whilst on the subject, i've just been looking at the koenig site and see they do turbo upgrades (no interest at all) but also a short gear setup. has anyone tried this yet? anyone know the ratios?





KOENIG-Chiptuning
for models with 2.7 Motronic
(2 motronic boxes) We need to know the serial-number of the motronic-boxes. We deliver: 2 chips, power increase 21 kW / 28 HP and increase of rpm to 9.000 rpm € 2.550,–





KOENIG sport-airfilter
maintenance-free, 3 -5 % more power, 40% more airflow at higher filter-efficiency
2 pieces € 250,–





KOENIG Twin-Turbo 412 kW / 560 HP /550 NM
complete engine conversion with 2 turbo-chargers (KKK), turbo-manifolds reduced compression (changed pistons), additional oil- and gearbox-cooling, special head gaskets, 2 intercoolers, changed exhaust-system, modified motronic, special air flow-meters, including dissassembling and assembling of the engine.
€ 35.500,–

performance:
0-100 km/h 3,7 sec.
0-200 km/h 11,9 sec.
standing 1/4 mile 11,5 sec.
top speed 325 km/h
driving performance depends on gear ratio

gear ratio up to 330 km/h
€ 3.100,–

gear ratio, short
€ 3.100,–

 

I've never had a standard ECU. All the lines on that graph are from different cars with different exhausts....there were more lines that I didn't put on there at the time. (still the same) Only my car had a motec. mine's always run on high octane unleaded, and was tuned with that.