Help me troubleshoot my 348 | FerrariChat

Help me troubleshoot my 348

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by PassionIsFerrari, Jul 2, 2005.

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  1. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    I have a 91' 348ts. The car is going to a mechanic next week. Around here, we don't have any Ferrari service centers but we do have a guy that has been working on them for 10+ years and everyone in town that has a Ferrari takes their car to him (unless they ship it out). Here are the symptoms, hopefully you all can think of some things I am not...

    1. Squeeky wheel - the wheel squeeks when you start to slightly move and just about to stop. Once your going like 2 or 3mph or above it stops. Doesn't do it all the time but guarenteed to do it when it is hot outside.

    Diagnosis - I was guessing either a wheel hub or a freezing brake caliper? Is there a test that I could do to find out what it is? Any other suggestions?

    2. Slight intermittent power loss - when i am cruising in any gear with the keeping consistent pressure on the gas pedal, I can feel the car losing a tad bit of power. Not noticable when accerlating or decelerating...only when keeping constant speed. Kind of gives you that swaying back and forth feeling that people get when they have motion sickness. It is very slight but definitely there for sure

    Diagnosis - Freezing caliper again or clogged fuel filter?

    3. Very loud whistle on accerlation of throttle half way down or more. It makes a loud whistle in any gear when I put the throttle down half way or more. Sounds like its coming from the engine compartment. It only does while the car is in gear, if it is netruel and the gas is pressed, it does not do it. It does it independent of RPM. RPM can be at 5K and if i press accelerator lightly it WILL NOT do it, if I press half way or more it will. Same exact results at 2K.

    Diagnosis - Have no damn idea. I have been told that it could be the muffler vents like in the 308s and 328. Before I go and buy a set of $45 stainless inserts, I wanted to get some feedback on this idea as well as any others you might have.

    4. Short grinding noise just after clutch is dis-engaged in first and second. This just started within the last week and is the one that worries me the most. I hear a quick grinding sound after clutch is dis-engaged and the car is in gear...typically only does it in first and second and only for 1/2 second...also maybe 10-15% of the time and only when at normal operating temp.

    Diagnosis - I would guess it is something in the clutch pack or flywheel. Would lack of grease in the flywheel do this? I had the flywheel rebuilt by a shop in Cali but I have doubts on whether they actually cracked open the flywheel and did what I listed them to do on my instructions...which was to re-pack and re-surface the flywheel. I got there name and address from the archives from a previous Fchatter that used them.

    5. Rattle on start-up in the morning...usually lasts 20-30 seconds

    Diagnosis - No idea

    6. Hot start problem - sometimes the car has to turnover over for 3 seconds when hot before it starts up, other times it starts right up. Always fires right up when cold

    Diagnosis - Lack of grease in flywheel?

    7. Engine temp has been running a tad higher then normal. Its been hotter here, like between 90-100 degrees so maybe thats why but my needle used to never go past 195 and would rest right under it. The last two days I have driven it, engine temp has gone slightly past 195 and it looked liked it was still climbing...this was at 3pm in the heat of the day. I pulled the car over and let it sit for a bit so it wouldn't overheat...Radiator kicked on 195 like normal. What is the hottest these cars should be running at? How do you check the coolant level.

    Diagnosis - coolant level low? Haven't had a chance to check it but I am going to check tommorow.


    Thanks guys, car is staying in the garage until I get at least certain problems fixed. If you can answer anyone of these it would greatly appreciated, you don't have to nail them all. Heck, I can't nail any!
     
  2. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    Aaron -

    I am absolutely no expert, but I'll offer some totally random thoughts:

    1. Could the squeek be a dragging e-brake? Maybe you don't hear it above 10mph because the engine noise is more overwhelming.

    2. Power loss could be all sorts of things. Any CEL lights?

    7. Engine temp? Today was 95+ degrees. Mine stayed below 195 the whole time. AC was turned off.

    7.5 My oil temp is considerably higher these days now that I'm on 5w20.



    -Daniel
     
  3. frisbee54

    frisbee54 Rookie

    Apr 1, 2004
    29
    Napa CA
    Full Name:
    Douglas Morgan
    Do you own an old Harley Davidson Topper motor scooter by chance? Doug
     
  4. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    1. Def not a draggine ebrake...even when the car is rolling at 4 or 5 mph it stop squeeking...You could push it fast enough to stop squeeking...it only does it RIGHT as its about to stop or RIGHT is starting to roll..

    2. No CEL lights...Crazy huh! Those things light up at the drop of a hat but I haven't had one light up in about 4 or 5 months..

    7. I'm running 5w30 but i am thinking about switching to 10w40 with this heat down here....
     
  5. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    No, its from the spoof movie with Charlee Sheen. Forget the name of it.
     
  6. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,613
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    1. I would look at the condition of the breaks. Get the car in the air and rotate each wheel until you find the one making the noise. Then remove the wheel and have a look at the condition of the break pad (could be low) and the rotor (could need to be turned, or a new one).

    2. When was the last time you changed the fuel filters? If never that could be the problem.

    3. That's an weird one? Could be alot of things. Your best bet is to trace where the noise is coming from.

    4. The syncros may be on the way out.

    5 & 6. Flywheel grease problem.

    7. Check the coolant level, and rebleed the system. When you rebleed it, you need to have the heater turned on, and set to the hottest temp.
     
  7. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    For #6 & 7, I'd guess that you're running too lean. Rich mixtures start quicker and run cooler, lean mixtures run hotter and take longer to start (especially hot because the cold start mechs aren't operating then).

    #5 is too vague; could be anything from catalytic converters going bad (the old ceramic ones tend to rattle as they die) to a loose bracket somewhere (and heat could make it stop vibrating later) to any number of things.

    #4 could be a bad synchro (ouch). At the very least I'd drain the gear oil, put in something decent like Red Line's synthetic Superlight Shockproof 70W90 (or MTL) or Royal Purple's gear oil, change the tranny filter, and examine the drained old fluid and filter for metal bits (larger = more damage); besides, it never hurts to swap out old gear oil for new gear oil/filters.

    #3 sounds like some form of exhaust leak or emissions air pump failure.

    #1 & 2 could be a warped brake rotor.

    #2 could also be a failing cat (see #5 above) or an a/f mixture that is too lean (see the suggestion for #6 & 7 above).

    Good luck and happy 4th!
     
  8. jkuk

    jkuk Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2003
    259
    Wirral, UK
    Full Name:
    John K
    #5 - check the catalytic converter heat shields (if you have them). Mine rattled until these got warm then all OK. Fixed by crimping top edge back tight again.


    john
     
  9. Iain

    Iain F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2005
    3,310
    UK
    Not familiar with the 348 but I had a squeaking wheel on my 328. There's a metal shroud behind the disk that kind of surronds the hub & it was just rubbing very slightly. Its very thin & flexible. Some judicious use of a small screwdriver to tweak it a bit cured the problem.

    Other than that it could be the start of a wheel bearing going bad or drying out & needing re-greasing.

    I.
     
  10. Dcup

    Dcup F1 Veteran

    Jan 3, 2005
    8,645
    Between 2 Implants
    Full Name:
    Claude Balls
    tmobileguy, this sounds serious !! you should sell the car before it blows up. these are symptoms of your 348 getting ready to quit. i will give you 3500 cash , and i will take over the headaches.lol lol.
    listen to ernie he always bails me out the guy is a wiz !!!
     
  11. rivee

    rivee F1 Rookie

    Jan 20, 2002
    3,731
    Nowhere important, USA
    Full Name:
    John
    Your whistle noise and your loss of power could be a vacuum leak. Have your mechanic run a vacuum test.
     
  12. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Do I get a set of those boobies too? :)
     
  13. Dcup

    Dcup F1 Veteran

    Jan 3, 2005
    8,645
    Between 2 Implants
    Full Name:
    Claude Balls
    yes, i will throw in a set of water balloons AND a box of fruity pebbles.
     
  14. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Update....I had a buddy of mine listen to the car with me to get his input. He is a gearhead type that works at a performance shop. Though he doesn't know Ferrari's, he is one of those types that has a Vette with a blower with 700 hp and built the whole thing from the ground..meaning...he knows cars...

    3. He was saying it could be just a normal sound of throttle plates opening up?

    4. Thought to him like it sounds like a heat shield rattling. I am going to take the heat shield off and see if it still does it...Would this make sense that this happens only when the car is hot?

    7. Add coolant to it and it has been running a lot lower, about a tick under 195 with it idling during the day. The radiator runs constantly but it keeps it just under 195. I added some Water Wetter to see if can get it to come down just a tad more but I think this problem is nipped.
     
  15. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    I am not a mechanic. However, the fans should not run constantly. When the car is moving at speed, the velocity of air being rammed into the strakes should exceed whatever speed the fan is capable of blowing, therefore providing effective cooling. At idle, yes, I can imagine them kicking on.

    The under 195 is good; fans running constantly sounds like a problem.

    -Daniel
     
  16. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,613
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    Don't forget to bleed the air out of the system. The bleed valves are located on the right hand side of the radiator feeding tubes. The ones that run across the back of the fire wall.
     
  17. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Oh, sorry...let me clarify...they run constantly when sitting at idle...Once the car is moving, temp drops down about 10-20 degrees and the fan kicks off.
     
  18. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Does the system need to be bled everytime you unscrew the cap or add coolant?
     
  19. Mike328

    Mike328 F1 Rookie

    Oct 19, 2002
    2,655
    Boulder, CO
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    Mike
  20. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,036
    USA
    #2 My friend had a similar problem with his 348 spider. He cleaned all the various electrical connectors in the engine compartment, and treated them with Stabilant 22. Cured it. Someone posted on the other site that he had a running problem and cleaned/treated the connector to the mass air flow sensor. So I would start there.
     
  21. Miltonian

    Miltonian F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2002
    5,966
    Milton, Wash.
    Full Name:
    Jeff B.
    #21 Miltonian, Jul 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here's my ideas:

    #2 & #3: Check to see if the rubber intake boot tube is securely fastened at each end. The boot should be attached firmly, clamps tight on each end, and nice and straight. If not properly attached, this could cause the power loss and the whistling noise.

    #5: On my 348, the muffler bracket as shown by the red arrow was broken in half, causing a loud rattle when the car was started cold. For some reason, it never seemed to rattle when it was warm. I fabricated a new bracket out of scrap metal stock and attached it around the pipe with a stainless hose clamp (it should have been spot welded on). Check both sides. Hasn't rattled for about 2 years.
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  22. 348SStb

    348SStb F1 Rookie
    Owner

    I experience #1 and #5 regularly. I don't know for sure why they occur.
     
  23. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
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    Mr. Sideways

    We've got 190f or 195f degree thermostats, so you aren't going to get much cooler than 195 no matter what you do, as whatever cooling tricks you use will be competing with your thermostat that starts restricting waterflow from your radiators at that point.
     
  24. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    ok...more progress....#4 seems to have been solved (which was the one that was worrying the most)...I took the heat shields off today and drove the car for a couple of hours and it DIDN'T MAKE THE NOISE! I am going to give it one more day with shield off to make sure. I also noticed that bolt in Miltonian's picture, bolt #13, the bracket that it goes through was broken off. I rebolted it back on...

    The next couple of days the car is going in the air and I am going to figure out the squeeky wheel problem.
     
  25. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Got the car up in the air...turned each wheel but none would make a squeeky noise, however...
    the rear wheels turned with ease and not much resistance...

    the front drivers side wheel turned but after giving it some umph...but during the rotation it had more resistance at some points then other....warped rotor?

    the front passenger side wheel, I had to put most of my strength to even get the wheel to spin and when I let off power, it immediately stopped!...

    Need some help on this one! I'm sure this is not right!
     

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