For gods sake are you really that hopeless?? Do you have a wiring diagram for the Motec? Steve V should be able to do it.
hey!! a good idea from you for once! i have full wiring diagrams....but i have to make sure the lambda sensor i get is a motec compatible wide band one.
Umm, Peter, MoTeC is right in your area... Just ring them up and get a sensor... www.motec.com.au Seems simple enough...
ok...all sorted...i have a wiring diagram, i know where to get a sensor and i have someone who can do it...wooooohooooo....i'm on a roll now it'll be interesting to compare the readings of the sensor in the Y piece and the sensor before where the cats are meant to be.
Hey peepee, don't forget your manifolds have to be in good conditon for true testing... no cracks, no air leaks etc etc. And of course, it's really hard to see because they're wrapped up, and only a large crack or hole will make a noise. There are sampling plugs on the manifolds themselves..one for each cylinder, but in practice, these are a can of worms.
....and why I only even use any O2 sensor to help rough in the maps and do the final tuning on the dyno or track with plug readings. There is no substitute IMO. Also, and I think this may go to the heart the the wide/narrow band sensor discussion, closed loop is no substitue for good maps IMO. And if you have taken the time to write good maps, there is no need to even think about closed loop except at low power for economy and to help keep the plugs clean. The mixture should be about 14.7 there and a narrow band sensor is perfect for the job...I'm not saying a wide band won't work, I just still don't see how it could work as well....although the difference may not really be noticable, I haven't do a back to back.
no more complex? Sure, the LM-11 is the same narrowband technology, but a lsu4 is a completely different beast. Investigate for yourself what a wideband cell is. I don't see how anyone that has could come to that conclusion.
absolutely, an accurate map is required and closed loop is not a substitute. I think there is almost a fad right now to mount a remote lambda gage as if the lambda display is proof of efficient power (or economy). O2 sensors are just a tool, and have their pitfalls. The accuracy drifts with age, response times slow, valve overlap can throw off the accuracy, manifold cracks or gasket leaks throw off the accuracy, exhaust pressure above ambient throws off the accuracy. O2 sensors are most definitely not infallable. Per my original statement, I believe the real advantage to wideband is the ecu can adapt to VE changes over time over *all* efficiency points (due to intake/exhaust upgrades, air filter(s) becoming dirty, combustion efficiency...). Open loop (accurate maps with temp/BAP/etc trims) is a proper baseline, and closed loop will maintain that. Wideband just maintains it better because any target lambda can be specified and *verified* in closed loop. So that newly installed header won't send you back to the dyno for a map update in the open loop region. Or you could guess and add 2% more fuel, or if the manufacturer is nice, they have a OEM ECU update with the kit. For an aftermarket EFI though, your on your own.
that is exactly what I'm trying to achieve. only problem is that now i'm not sure how accurate my base map is...so i'm looking into that. once correct, then my intention is to run wide band for SMALL trimming for the variations that occur in day to day driving.
Also remeber peepee, that your cam timing is slightly different now to what it was before... I don't know how it was when originally tuned, but it may explain some small differences you're finding.
Peter Given you already have rough maps in place, you would be better off doing the fine tuning on road and track IMO.
The Bosch LSM-11 lambda sensor is indeed a 4 wire wide band sensor. It was used for nearly 10 years as a good "lead tolerant" sensor and was used on the first generation MoTeC lambda meter and all M4, M48 and M8 products. Narrow band will simply toggle the 0-1 volt range to keep the engine at emissions levels (14.7 A/F, 1.0 La) Later technology has improved and the LSU or NTK sensors are the way to go for wide band lambda. Have you tried the Q key for "quick lambda'? You can tune the fuel map in a couple of hours using this feature. Just make sure to start with a new sensor. Let me know if you need help with your MoTeC, let me know what your controller is... I know a little bit about their products...
"Q" is what was used to set it up in the first place and it worked a treat. However, if, as ferrarifixer has said, that where my sensor is wouldn't give an accurate reading, then I'll be doing it again. Took about 20 mins last time, so no big deal. If it is accurate, then I won't need to do it again, and i'll just get a new sensor and "fine tune" with wide lambda for changes in barometric pressure, temps, etc. Stephen, fine tuning on the road and track is impossible...i've tried it. Yes...you can log WOT and make last lambda changes, but anything else is impossible....there's just no way of accurately assessing revs/load. Maybe sitting on 100kph can be done, which is 10% at 3000...but otherwise, light load up a hill...lighter load down a hill...just impossible. throttle's never in one position long enough, and the revs are always changing. that's my experience, anyway.
Yes, they do have an additional reference pump cell but the materials and construction are not much different. There is nothing in the construction of a true planar or pump cell lambda that would deem it more fragile. Neither have I ever come across any evidence of a wideband giving a shorter service life. Don't forget that Audi, Porsche, VW and Honda have all been extensively using this techonology for some years now with no service complaints. They all still hate leaded fuels equally but kept in the right environment will survive happily.
