This board is devaluing Ferraris!

This board is making the truth accessible for those of us who always wanted a Ferrari and thought it was impossible.

Hopefully it's devaluing ill-maintained and misrepresented cars, and troublesome models/years, and enhancing the value of well-kept, worthwhile cars. So what if some damaged money pit Mondial on eBay sells for less because of f-chat.

All the sparring and tooth-gnashing over stuff like timing belts, 355 headers, and the cost of TR maintenance has educated a lot of us who otherwise might have overpaid, got burned and bailed forever from the exotic car world. Believe me, a LOT of people think I'm an idiot for not just trotting down to the Porsche dealer and buying a new Cayman or whatever. The only reason I ended up buying the 328 -- and I paid healthy retail for it, to get a car I think is in exceptional shape -- was because I had a realistic sense of what all the bad news would cost on this.

Thanks to f-chat I now have a "wanted" list of Ferrari's that I know I should pay generously for, and less desirable ones that I should bargain hard for, or just walk. Not sure the title of this thread is true. I wrote a check for a car this year that I wouldn't have bought in 2004. If that isn't creating demand, I don't know what is.

 

This site gave me a great amount of information when I bought my 328. Now that i am looking for a 512TR I know what o look for, avoiding nasty surprises. Knowing the truth, the problems, the potential catastrophic failures helps me to assess if I can afford to drive the car or not.
This is improving the value of the car, not vice versa.
Ciao
Eugenio

 

I agree. This is the best place to do your homework on Ferrari's. Period. Hearing it straight from actual owners.

 

I guess you have to be happy that you are not one of the Ferrari owners then, no?

 

I think this board has made it a lot harder to sell a Ferrari on Ferrarichat. I believe this to be true, due to the extreme "nit-picking" that goes on with buyers looking at a Ferrari for sale. However, this board has been most valuable to those that already own a Ferrari, in terms of helping with repairs, etc.

I have listed my TR for sale, in the Chicago thread, since the car is there just finished with all the work needed on it, by the Ferrari dealer. I live in the Green Bay area, and once the car will be delivered back to me, next week, I will delete the Chicago thread. I am giving someone a chance to take a look at it while there for the next few days.

I am a private owner, and not a dealer. I have sold 7 Ferraris in the past, and all have been sold to people who didn't know of FerrariChat, PPIs, and where not overly nit-picky..........never had a complaint. I would rather sell this car to someone just starting out in Ferraris, and who has no idea of what it is like to be ever picky.

In the past, I got tired of people calling me to tell me how "many" of these cars are for sale.........."a dime a dozen". If true, then why do they call me from across the country?

 

Keeping the 328 as well? Love the TR's!

 

I am working on it. Wife does not agree so much. Anyway i will have to wait to be back in Italy or somewhere I can use the damned thing! (My 328 is in storage in this very moment )
Ciao
Eugenio

 

I will say that if it wasn't for the information I got from this site there is no way I would have had the confidence to bite the bullet and purchase a Ferrari. So assuming 'supply and demand' is the driving factor in Ferrari prices and not the viewing sarcastic comments about the cars, I would say this site has increased the prices of honest examples of the marque.

Would a fresh off the lot WRX STi out corner, out run and cost a lot less to maintain than my car? Yep. Is the fact that I typed that going to save the next buyer of a 308 $738 dollars on his purchase because word has travelled far and wide that the F-car is an overpriced, substandard car? I doubt it.

Sometimes honesty is refreshing.

 

This board is devaluing Ferraris!

Would someone kindly email me once this board has sufficiently worked it's "magic" so that I might pickup a nice Ferrari "on the cheap".

Now don't stop, I'm hoping for a great deal soon ...

Bob S.

 

I agree. It is hard to believe that most of the postings are by fans much less owners. So far the 612/430/599 are terrible looking cars that shame the Ferrari brand. Seems it's a little out of hand to me.

 

I agree that the board might be pushing Ferrari values down - but only a few thousand and only towards wholesale prices. This would be because people ask "Is this a good price or not?" a lot and get answers that push an expected price to the low end of the spectrum.

 

I agree. I expect my Ferrari to lose value, but if you are going to sell to a member of this board, expect to get the lowest price out of the potential buyers for your car.
BT

 

Fellows, a Ferrari is worth what someone pays for it, not what the FML pricing guide (in existence for decades), discussion board "mob rule" or anything or anyone else defines.

I mostly enjoy the back-and-forth (and, for the most part, uneducated speculation <very big grin>) by posters on the relative value of a particular model or even a particular example, but when it's all said and done, the decision to purchase is a personal choice made by the person writing the check, not bound by the observations of a bunch of folks looking in from the peanut gallery!

It's been my opinion that this board helps a GREAT deal more than it hurts and, as several posters have said, has given potential and future owners the CONFIDENCE born of well-informed research and a broader experience base to make the wise and untimately self-satisfying decision to pull the trigger. The folks that speculate FChat being a market force are over-estimating their own "hot air." <grin>

In two and a half decades of working "in the business", the most common refrain from people who finally take the F-car plunge is; "why didn't I do this sooner?" They don't quote the nabobs of negatavism on FerrariChat, they talk about how helpful other posters were. Cheers!

Advice (including valuations made by third parties, ANY third party) are worth what you pay for it. Follow your gut and have fun!

-Peter

 

My post was not a general indictment of this board, which has obvious merit and utility for all Ferrari enthusiasts. I also don't criticize anyone for posting an ad seeking opinions on a car, you will get what you ask for, positive and negative. It just seems there is a gamesmanship philosophy that has developed which undermines true constructive criticism. I don't have to give examples, if you are a regular on this board you know what I mean. I am not advocating censorship either, just self restraint. Thoughtful opinions, informed or uninformed, are a part of healthy discussion. What value is nitpicking? That is the question! Maybe this board has no effect on anyone's decision to buy a car, but I can easily imagine someone being disuaded from buying a car that has been flamed on this site, if they read it. Aren't future car buyers one of the target groups for this forum? I don't mean to suggest that the entire FERRARI EMPIRE is going to collapse, or that across the board we are all going to lose our money on our cars, don't be melodramatic guys! If one person's car is devalued, is that ok? Just food for thought. Thoughful consideration, is that too much to ask?

 

I kind of agree with your general premise, but I disagree that it's bad. Before the internet and this group in paticular, there was a lot less "common knowledge" about Ferraris and cars with big but hidden problems probably sold for more than they should have. This is not germaine to only Ferrari; lots of used cars sell for more than they should due to misrepresentation, but Ferraris have some uncommon areas that a buyer should be aware of.

This group has taught people the basics of buying used Ferraris. The PPI, looking for belt change records and records in general are the mantra along with rust for specific models, air pumps, etc. If it's harder to get top dollar for a car that's got major question areas because this board alerts prospective buyers to them, I don't consider that a bad thing.

Ken

 

This board has provided assistance of incalculable value to me as a first-time purchaser. Some people may have the means to buy a Ferrari w/o full knowledge of what lies ahead, but I am not one of them. Without the information and opinions that more experienced enthusiasts provided, I simply would have moved on (Hellooo, RENNlist). It would be nice not to have to filter out some of the childish flame wars, but it's a small enough price to pay.

As to the impact of this board on the Ferrari brand, as a brand strategy consultant I have actually recommended that clients look at this board as an example of how knowledgable customers can serve as an early warning system for impending brand issues. Smart companies see the benefit in not waiting until criticism of the products or service turns into rejection of the brand.

Ron

PS - All of you who were talking down prices can stop now. It didn't work.

 

If the car can be devalued though discussion and observation of its qualities and condition, then it was overpriced. If the car stands up to all the scruitiny, then it was fairly priced or underpriced. The only way a car is devalued through disclosure is if the seller is relying on finding an unprepared buyer -- AKA 'sucker'.

 

And let's not forget that the buyer doesn't _have_ to sell for a low price. They can always hold the car and hope to get more/their asking price.

 

When I was looking for my first Ferrari, F-Chat and FOA were invaluable, I understood the value of a new service (a full service, belts tensionsers, clutch and and all, not just belts and wires) so after a paid a fair price for a 348spider that hadn't had it done I knew I was in for a check-writing party = $12k worth. Drove the car every day, to work, for fun, even one day out in the snow (slow).

You all helped, moaned that I should get at TR or a 512 (12 envey and all the BS). but the info was a help.

I turned the next buyer on with a perfect 384.

I dabbled with a Lotus Elise, joined the Lotus-chat page, got the tiny little red rocket of a thing, had a blast... too small for two to sit in though.
So on the marketplace it went. Posters trashed the car (it had 1500miles, all services and was as perfect as new) for no known reason, Posters said they were going for $10k under market (in July'05), blah blah blah..

All I could think was this was why Lotuses values dropped like a rock; They eat their young. Car sold $3k under list, as expected. But the Posteres crabbed on, attacking everone who put a car for sale... very sad, especialy after I found out the most vocal had no real sports cars, just hondas and the like..

So be accurate on prices, on prior history (we all want to know) and less whinney, it'll help everyone.

Heading to Cavallino this week, expect to see great cars, great company and a love of the breed...

 

This site (and others) has certainly "de-mystified" many aspects of Ferrari ownership, and that comes at a price (good and bad) to both enthusiasts and dealers.