Anyone into bodybuilding/ recreational weightlifting? Need advice?

yes, thank you!

for the love of god please stop the bullsht supplements

 

bigdog is 'spot' on here, eat CLEAN; stuffing junk down your face will only produce junk results. no processed or sugar laden food. and get a food scale.

i started wieght lifting 14yrs ago, 2yrs ago i switched my routine to bodybuilding. they are very different from each other, when i was wieght lifting i only needed to work 3x week but very heavy. now it's 6x a week at 2-3hrs moderate to hevy lifting. results are great but the energy needed is astounding thankfully i don't fatigue easily.

suplement viatamens and protien, for me i like iso pure zero carb protien as i'm lactose intolrent. and sugar will cause insulin spikes. and also egad! i don't chow down on red meat, sure i might have a good steak once in awhile but my dietary protien comes from fish and legums. and please do not forget your green veggies, the roughage will keep your insides clean and your organs will thank you. remember its a way of life not a hobby.

i would recomend arnolds wieght lifting book as it shows proper form for exercises and gives some good routines, however everybody is different so what works for me wont work for you. genetically i'm blessed with large muscle and short tendon insertion. i gain mass quickly but have a harder time getting cut. my biceps are naturally 18" a few bicep groups will get me to 19 3/4" so i don't spend alot time there. my weak spots are what i'm looking for.

 

People with long tendons cannot put on huge muscles, that's a fact. Example: This guy has a pretty long tendon from the right side (of the pic) of his bicep to the point where his arm bends. If he had it at a 90 degree angle, you'll see even more how long it is. That is why his bicep is small, he will not be able to put on more mass there, it's genetics: http://scottmills.ca/gallery/albums/album01/bicep.jpg

 

there's ALOT more that goes into hitting the genetic ceiling than the simple length of your tendon... please don't paint with such a broad brush


i assure you his bicep is small, as you put it, for many OTHER reasons; not merely his tendons being 1.5" or longer

 

What other advice do you have for working on you back? I admit, I tend to neglect it. If you know of any websites that demonstrate the exercise with the name, I think we'd all get a little more from it.

 

Deadlifts, Deadlifts, Deadlifts!

The deadlift is possibly the most perfect excercise, working all major muscle groups... with a good weight and good form you will be AMAZED with the results...

 

Can you try to describe what to do?

 

Please post a photo of your self posing so we can see where you currently stand. This is critical. This is critical.
Thanks, Karen

 

It would be my pleasure!

(stolen from someone else)

The Deadlift

The deadlift is a heavy compound movement that should be included in the exercise program of any lifter. As this lift will strengthen not only the entire back, but the musculature of the hips, abdominals, and legs, as well as work the grip, proficiency in this lift is a must. Like the squat, the deadlift will stimulate a growth response from the body that should carry over into strength and size gains in other areas.

There are two basic styles of deadlifting, conventional and sumo. Each style will be explained, and compared to the contrasting style. While certain aspects of deadlifting are similar, such as the fact that the lifter is basically picking a weight up off of the deck, and raising to the highest possible level without bending the arms, a great many differences in biomechanics occur as a result of the differing styles.

The conventional stance consists of the athlete standing with the feet approximately shoulder width apart, or slightly narrower. To position the feet properly, slide them forward as far as possible without moving the shoulders in front of the bar. The hips should be as close to the bar as possible as well, but the lower back must remain arched. The head should be elevated so that the athlete is looking forward and slightly upwards. The shoulders should be back, but slightly rounded. Retracting the shoulders causes the shoulder girdle to elevate, increasing the distance the lifter must pull the bar. The athlete must grip the bar tightly, and to ensure that the bar does not roll, a mixed grip (one hand supinated, one hand pronated) is often employed.

The true beginning of the deadlift is the set up, or the first phase (as it is known in Olympic lifting), which has already been described. The next step, before pulling the bar free from the deck is to fill the abdominal cavity with air. While drawing in as much air as possible, the goal is to push it down as far as possible, not fill the chest cavity. Filling the chest cavity with air elevates the shoulders, which will increase the distance the lifter must pull the bar.

The deadlift is initiated by simultaneously extending the knee and hip joints. The knee will extend due to the contraction of the quadriceps muscles (vastus lateralis, vastus medialis, vastus intermedius, and rectus femoris), and, during the extension, may move slightly to the rear. The hip joint will extend secondary to the contraction of the gluteus and the hamstrings (biceps femoris, semitendinosus, and semimembranosus). While the entire hamstring is active to a certain degree during the deadlift, the semitendinosus and semimembranosus are recruited to a much greater degree to extend the hip joint.

The bar should be pulled into the body, as well as up. This keeps the athlete from falling forward during the lift, as it helps maintain a far more stable combined center of gravity (CCOG). This is where the placement of the feet is a significant factor. If they are too far forward, causing the shins to be closer to the bar than necessary, the bar must be pulled around the knees, instead of past them. This shortens the lever arm distance and reduces the resistive torque.

During this period, and indeed, throughout the entire lift, the musculature of the upper back and shoulders (trapezius, latissimus dorsai, teres minor, subscapularis, infraspinatus, supraspinatus, as well as the anterior, medial and posterior deltoids) will be undergoing an isometric contraction to hold the bar in a stable position. In the arm, the biceps brachii, brachialis, and brachioradialis will also contract isometrically to stabilize the elbow joint. The forearm flexors are extremely active during the gripping of the bar.

The erector spinae (iliocostalis thoracis, iliocostalis lumborum, longissimus dorsai, and spinalis dorsai) will contract during the lift, along with the intertransversarii, interspinalis, rotores, and multifidus muscles to bring the spine into an erect position. These muscles become more active once the back is extended past a point that would be 60 degrees away from vertical. The inter-transversarii, interspinalis, rotors, and multifidus will also serve to stabilize the vertebrae and discs. In the conventional deadlift, the torso is inclined far more than in the sumo style, in direct contrast to recommendations for a more erect torso to reduce shear force on the lumbar vertebrae (4, 9, 12).

As the bar travels past the knees, and up the thighs, several key points must be noted. It is imperative that the knees not re-bend once they have begun to straighten. In addition to the extra strain this will put on the ligaments and tendons, secondary flexion of the knees (hitching) is cause for disqualification during a competition. Another mistake that is often made as the lift nears completion is the lifter will try to pull the torso back, when it is far easier to simply push the hips forward. This technique will allow the athlete to shift some of the strain from the erectors to the larger muscles of the hips, including the gluteus. At the top of the lift, the shoulders should be pulled back to indicate the completion of the lift. This is not necessary for routine training of the deadlift, but a powerlifter should practice this to avoid unnecessary red lights.

The major difference that occurs in the sumo deadlift is the placement of the feet. They are placed much wider, sometimes even twice shoulder width, although this is an extreme. The toes are turned outward, sometimes to the point where the angle of the feet approaches 160 degrees. There are several biomechanical advantages to this stance. The distance the bar must travel is greatly lessened as the hip angle is on average 12 degrees greater than the hip angles of conventional deadlifters, while the knee angle is approximately 13 degrees greater. (7, 12) The trunk angle is significantly closer to vertical, which, from a pure safety standpoint, the sumo stance decreases both L4/L5 moments as well as shear forces. (4) Furthermore, the sumo stance allows the lifter to keep the bar closer to the body, which shortens the movement arm to the lumbar spine. (12) This stance can reduce the total distance the bar travels by as much as 25 – 40%. (7)

The functional technique in the deadlift is different as well. The athlete pulling a conventional deadlift will push straight down with the feet, whereas in the sumo deadlift, the knees must be pushed out over the toes. This is important, to avoid lateral shear force on the knee, as well as the fact that it allows the lifter to engage the larger muscles of the hips earlier than in the conventional stance. As a function of the bar being closer to the lifter, it will contact the legs earlier. As the bar slides up the thighs, it is important to ensure that the fingers of the pronated hand are not torn open by the friction thus generated. A modest amount of baby powder or talcum may be applied to the legs to reduce the chance of this occurring.

One factor that has not been discussed that makes the deadlift unique among the three powerlifts is that unlike the squat and bench, there is no eccentric (lengthening, or lowering) portion prior to the concentric (shortening, or raising) of the bar. This has the function of negating the stretch reflex, a fact that is often overlooked by many athletes and coaches alike. There is a way of generating a small stretch reflex, which may help when initiating the lift, but nothing like the reflex that can be generated during the other two powerlifts. In the conventional stance, a slight rocking of the hips, which will cause the knees to flex as well, can be employed. The lift should be initiated when the hips are at the lowest point, and this movement must occur rapidly. Care must be taken when doing this, as if the hips descend too far, the lifter will be at a biomechanical disadvantage.

Unsurprisingly, there is a difference when using this technique when pulling sumo. This technique (often called ‘diving’) can allow the sumo lifter to generate a greater stretch reflex without moving out of position, unlike the conventional deadlift. Because the feet are father apart, instead of just raising and lowering the hips, the hips should be lowered rapidly then thrust forward at the bottom of the descent. This allows not only for a greater stretch reflex, but for an even more erect torso than lifters who pull from a static position.

Variations on the deadlift

There are several varieties of the deadlift, and can be used not only to assist in deadlift training, but can also significantly strengthen muscles that can be impeding progress in another lift. Some of these lifts can be used in place of the deadlift during training as well.

One of the most common variations of the deadlift is the partial deadlift, or rack lockout. These are usually performed in a power rack, with the pins set at a variety of heights. Pulls can be done from one inch above the deck to a couple of inches below lockout. As a general rule, the shorter the ROM, the more weight that can be handled. The primary function of the partial deadlift is to not only overload the muscles of the back, as well as increase motor recruitment. (5, 18) At times, the amount of weight that can be handled during the execution of a short range of motion rack pull can be so great that it surpasses the amount of weight the athlete can hold. In this case, it may be necessary to employ straps to secure the weight. (6)

Another common variation is the stiff-legged deadlift (SLDL) which will work the hamstrings to a much greater degree than the conventional deadlift. (2, 10) This lift should begin just like a conventional deadlift, and should be pulled to the top in the same manner. The knees will be stiff, but not locked, as the bar is lowered as far as possible without allowing the back to round. The lower back should remain arched throughout the entire lift, and if the back begins to round despite the best attempts of the athlete, it is necessary at this point to begin the concentric portion of the lift and raise the bar. The bar will travel away from the lifter as the hips are flexed progressively. There is greater torque on the hips and lumbar areas because of the greater horizontal distance from the bar to the base of the support than in the conventional deadlift. (3, 4, 17)

Despite the fact that numerous “muscle mags” often illustrate a lifter performing this exercise while elevated, this should be avoided by all at first and most athletes for the duration of their career. The greater the range of motion, the greater the chance of lifting with a kyphotic (round back) posture. (10) Artificially increasing the ROM will serve only to increase the chances of this occurring. It must also be noted that a comprehensive stretching program is essential to not only athletes, but everyone wishing to improve the ROM of this exercise.

The Romanian Deadlift (RDL) is used primarily to strengthen the hamstrings, gluteus, and lower back, although this technique causes less stress to the lumbar area. Unlike the SLDL, the RDL is initiated from the floor, although the set up is roughly in-between that of the conventional deadlift and the SLDL. (23) During the ascension, the knees should begin to straighten in advance of the hips, with the goal of keep the torso at the same angle as in the beginning of the lift for as long as possible. This should occur while maintaining normal spinal curvature. Pulling in such a manner allows the athlete to keep the bar closer to the base of support, decreasing the strain on the lumbar area when compared to the SLDL. As the knees fully straighten, the hips shall travel toward the rear slightly, then the hips are then powerfully flexed, fully utilizing the hamstrings and erectors to complete the lift. This lift is often performed by Olympic style weightlifters to increase the strength of the clean pull.

Another variation that is not often performed is the Snatch Grip Deadlift (SGL). This version of the deadlift is similar to a conventional deadlift, with the only difference occurring in the placement of the hands upon the bar. The grip is at least one and a half times shoulder width, while larger lifters will often grip collar to collar. A good general guide to novices is to extended the arms out to the sides, then bend only at the elbow. The bar should be held at approximately the width of the elbows. The difficulty of maintaining the grip in such a position, as the mixed grip cannot be used, will require the used of straps for those not very experienced in utilizing the hook grip. This lift will further stress the musculature of the upper back, particularly the trapezius. (19) This lift is often performed by Olympic style weightlifters to increase power of the first pull, making it easier for the athlete to raise weights from the deck.

A simple method of increasing the ROM of a deadlift is for the athlete to stand on a block. Once again, care must be taken to avoid kyphotic lifting posture. The increase in ROM will necessitate a decrease in weight.

Deadlift Training

There are far too many methods of training to improve the deadlift to list here. A few will be briefly discussed.

Periodization. This is a simple yet effective method of decreasing the volume while increasing the weight. This process occurs over a period of weeks or months. It is by far the most common method of training, although lifters are branching out in new directions daily. This method has been discussed in great detail in numerous other works, and will not be discussed further here.

Conjugate Training. This is a system of training the musculature of the lift without overtraining the CNS with respect to a single lift. The deadlift is not trained heavy throughout the cycle, and in some training cycles, may be trained only rarely. This method was first used in Olympic weightlifting by the incredibly successful Soviet Dynamo Club.(24) It was later used by the original Westside Barbell Club in the 1960’s and 1970’s, as well as some lifters on the East coast, including Bill Starr, a former Olympic weightlifter turned coach. (21). It is currently the system employed by the new Westside Barbell Club, of Columbus, Ohio, under the coaching of Louie Simmons, the most successful coach in powerlifting history.(20) This method will involve heavy assistance work for the lift itself, such as partial deadlifts, good mornings, etc. A list of assistance exercises can be found at: www.elitefts.com

An interesting variation for training the deadlift was employed by the great Don Rheinholdt, the first man to squat 900 lbs. in competition as well as being one of the first to deadlift over 800 lbs. He would set up with his opener in the power rack eight inches off of the deck, and pull it. He would then drop the pins one inch every week until the week before the meet, when the plates were just a single inch off of the floor. This allowed him to preserve his lower back while maintaining proper form.

A final word on a couple of myths. Numerous “experts” have cautioned against utilizing the deadlift, incorrectly stating that it is hazardous to perform. This is true, if the above cautions are not employed. While there can be a place for round back lifting in the program of the highly advanced lifter, this is a mistake for most and will not be discussed further. Other self proclaimed authorities state that you must wear a belt when deadlifting. A belt can help increase intra-abdominal pressure, as well as increase the force generated when deadlifting. However, the majority of the deadlifting done by any athlete should be performed without a belt to further recruit the core muscles (abdominals, obliques, etc.).

 

Yo, BIG DOG: You must have an incredible ass.

 

Ahh, Werd from the peanut gallery!

 

You just never have had an ass worth mentioning.

 

OWWW

Incidentally, no one picked you. http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=135606218&postcount=28

 

the women have been known to be fond of the Bigdog's rump

 

Or this...

 

Thanks for all the advice John, Adam, Scott, Mbutner, BigDog, and anyone else I might have missed. I'll start stuffing my face more often, and definately make sure I take in more than I usual.

But a couple members say to just eat anything, and a couple others say to eat right. What should I do?! I'm not a great cook to make the right food, so I usually eat fast food (Typical college student?). But i'll try to learn some easy-to-make meals that are healthier.

I'll definately be keeping up with this thread.

 

it really depends... some ppl believe in the concept of "dirty bulking" and then cut afterwards... me personally (even through college) have tried to maintain as clean as possible...

by keeping a clean diet, it makes cutting much easier than stuffing your face with anything...

right foods?
lean meats
oatmeal
broccoli
tuna
natural peanut butter
brown rice

etc etc

many ppl will tell you to suck down protein shake after protein shake which is not always the best thing... reason for this being is NOTHING is as good for your body as real food...

you won't be able to start eating a ton right away, but ease yourself into it and it'll be 2nd nature

the fact taht you're still in college gives you actually quite a bit of flexibility esp. if you have a meal plan... food is already prepared for you... just pick and choose...

if ya want me to spout more i shall

 

What do you mean food is already prepared? haha I don't have any food! I have to start cooking soon

And yes... spout all you want. I want all the info I can get. You don't happen to have any meal ideas do you?

 

Hey,
I feel your pain on the meal thing... I work 9 hr day then go to classes at night till 10 get home at 11pm. Here is what a do:

Breakfast: Eat High Fiber, high protein cereal (Kashi usually) with fruit. Or Eat NATURAL Oatmeal (alot of it).

Later in morning: Eat two organic yogurt cups.

Lunch: Some type of high protein sandwich: heavy unprocessed wheat bread, stacks of lean turkey, ham, and roast beef w/ spicy mustard. Eat banana or apple. Sometimes also have a salad w/ vinegar.

Mid day: Eat two granola bars (also usually Kashi), and eat orange.

Get home (time for class so no time for food): Drink meal replacement Shake (Metrx 40g protein - over 500 cal with milk).

Get home at 11pm: If hungry eat another bowl of oatmeal or kashi cereal (does not turn to sugar instantly in bloodstream and keeps body fed through night.)

During whole day I am munching on mixed nuts (non salted) and drinking ass loads of water.

I am in pretty good shape for sitting at a desk all day but only get to work out 3 time a week. When I eat like this and work out more consistant, I get very very thick and strong.

Not alot of meal prep, prob need more veggies but I am a student like you with no time. I try to eat real meals over weekends with more veggies.

 

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15510

 

I think their is a big difference between bodybuilding and strength training, they are both very different. With bodybuilding at its best you are really sculpting your shape and muscles.

I only work one body part a week per training session for 6days then off one, I have one day dedicated to each part, shoulders, back, chest, legs, then arms, doing abs every day, works very well for me

I haven't worked out for a few years but already am getting much of my old shape back thankfully due to all the years and dedication of weight training before otherwise it would be difficult.

 

hey man...try this website. it has tonnes and tonnes of tips, news, how to eat, what to eat the the right time, protein intakes, creatine, etc. have a look at the forum too. it's divided and organised very very well.
www.bodybuilding.com

well, u know, i'm a college student too. very difficult to be diciplined and eat the right stuffs. ( i don;t take fast foods at all ) but heck. ur main aim in weightlifting is, never ever leave ur stomach hungry. so, fast food or slow food, dun give a damn. just eat. here's how i split my training days:
monday-- chest, bench press superset with flat d/bell flys. incline d/bell presses superset with incline d/bell flys. i work my tri's after all these.

tuesday--legs. squats, hax squats, leg extension, leg curls, stiff legged deadlifts.

thurs--shoulders. deadlifts, military press, d/bell front raises, shrugs, lateral raises.

fri-- abs. hanging leg raises, side bends ( obliques ), weighted sit ups

sat-- back. weighted chin ups, d/bell rows, seated cable row. i hit my bi's after that.

well, if u wanna share any info, etc with me, add me up on MSN msger. [email protected]
good luck!

 

you're right there is, when i was doing just weight lifting i could move mountains but did not really look the part, deceving how you can be very strong but not look like adonis. the last 2yrs i decided to improve the 'look' as i'm not getting younger and it has been interesting sculpting the body to look a certain way, it can be addictive and hard work. the one thing i have noticed is how i had to cut back on heavy weight to get the needed number of reps for the muscle to define itself. i'm working back up to heavy weights but it'll be awhile.

 

Exactly, and you can look the part but in reality are not that strong since in bodybuilding you are not really building useable muscles in the real world.

 

I was eating more than usual today and counted about 2,600 calories so far. So that means I usually only eat about 2,000 calories a day. I'll try to keep this up, it feels weird being full all the time! I usually have a somewhat empty stomache and don't think twice about it... No wonder i'm so skinny. Thanks again guys. I'll try to stay on this diet for a month and i'll let you guys know what I weigh in at on April fools day... No joke