What is up with Rubens? (Possible spoiler)

True, but the Scuderia didn't really jump in front of him to stop him from leaving. They were quite ok with it.

I'm still torn back and forth about Massa. He screwed up Bahrain race and qualifying in Malaysia. OTOH he was brilliant in Bahrain qualifying and Malaysia race. The guy is darn fast, perhaps the fastest teammate MS ever had. I just wish he'd be more consistent. And I applaud the Scuderia for not using team orders against him in Malaysia. The public outcry over Zeltweg and Rubens did have a positive effect on Todt.

 

It was said in this past weekend's broadcast that Rubens had terrible luck early on in his career when he had #11 on his car. Jenson got wind of this, and gave that number to Rubens. It was originally slated for Button.

I believe his lackluster performance to date has something to do with left foot braking, but how much, I don't know. I wanted Rubens to outdo Jenson, but I have to say that Button has been very impressive so far. If Rubens doesn't get better by mid-season, I will write him off in my book.

 

i agree on massa. like i said earlier, he was flying thorought the race. he was under a bit of pressure from michael, but the fact here is, he didn;t make any mistakes, and he was fast at the same time. i just guess that we all need to give him more time here to settle down. i mean, if u compared to all the other teams whom switced drivers, look how long they are taking to get settle in, like rubens...and look at massa...damn...he has got something!

 

You might take note...........Jenson had no 11 and "gave" it to Rubens as a sign of "team" as Rubens old no. in karting and F2 was no. 11

Rubens might think he's no 1, but he ain't even close to Jenson. Rubens is past his prime, Jenson is just entering his. I guarantee time will show this to be the way.

 

Sorry guys, I just go by the color of the camera on top of the car and the number on the car. I don't pay much attention to the Speed TV commentators, only reason it's not on mute is because I want to hear the cars. ITV is much better imo.

 

Well, he already "lived at Maranello": He spent a year testing for them and drove their engine last year at Sauber while testing in Fiorano etc. So not exactly a big jump for him. Anyway, I hope he'll score a lot more for the team going forward.

 

Do you think the fact that Massa's manager is Jean Todt's son may be relavent?

 

Hmm, interesting thought. Didn't think about that. Would surprise me though. I always think the team's interests are first and foremost. Which is why Montezemolo forced MS out of retirement in 1999 and why Flavio had no problems taking a hard line against Fisico last year.

I don't think Todt let Massa get away with it because of his son, but rather because of the negative reaction Zeltweg has caused. Just my $ 0.02.

 

what retirement? u mean the broken leg?

 

yes

 

Why did everyone think Rubens was fast in the first place? Rubens was fast in a dominant car, just another JV. Repeatedly coming in 2nd place to the best driver in the world does not make you the 2nd best driver.

Perhaps it's just my lack of nostalgia for previous years, but doesn't it seem like the drivers in the 2006 season are just much better than previous years? Perhaps it's just that all the best drivers are now driving the best cars, which wasn't neccessarily the case before.

 

well, the thing is, rubens was fast in a good car. take china and monza '04 for an example. he practically exploded after schumi won the driver's title that year. but then, now at honda, he maybe just needs to take his time and settle down a bit. after 5 yrs in the scuderia, and suddenly at honda, there's a huge change of enviroment. some ppl take it slow, some ppl take it fast. well, maybe rubens is a bit on the slower side, i dunno. but i still think he's a good and fast driver at times.give him a lil more space, a lil more time. it's just the 2nd race of the season. let the season progress abit then we'll all see..

 

In the 2004 Ferrari half of the grid would be fast.

 

Exactly..

RB changed to Davisons car, even taking an engine penalty so that he got the EXACT car Davison drove...

and he couldn't get close to a competitive time in it.

RB out, AD in, I say. He's earned it.

 

a bit too early to say that, imo..

 

Maybe, but this is F1, not hobby racing. If you asked all the Honda race fans out there who they'd want between RB and AD... I think you'd be surprised.

It's not like AD is a rookie anymore.

Davidson has done many more remarkable and quick laps than Rubens has over the last 3 years.

 

I say let AD give it a crack, not much to loose at this point.

 

umm... you got this wrong...

The number 11 is a lucky number for Rubens and once Button found that out he offered it to him. And yes the number was originally slated for Button.

 

Er, " Massa is ..... perhaps the fastest teammate MS ever had " , I think Nelson Piquet would have the honour of being Michael's fastest teamamate. Massa maybe fast but he isnt triple world champion yet.

 

Refresh my memory please: When was Piquet Michael's team mate?

If he was, he was definitely past his use-by date and that's really what I meant. Otherwise simply by accomplishments I would of course have mentioned Eddie Irvine, vice champion of 1999. But I'm talking here raw speed and Massa seems to have more of that. Or maybe the gap is closer because MS lost some?

 

i agree...i seriously think massa is the fastest teammate MS had, taking into account this is only after the 2nd race of the season. as andreas pointed out earlier...the tests massa's doing all these years with the scuderia certainly benefited him in the terms of settle-ing down in a new team. i don't think MS has lost any speed tho. it's still early in the season, and i suspect the scuderia is taking a conservative approach at the moment. i think they'll pick things up in euro, or else, even in aussie...

 

Piquet was Michael's teammate at Benneton in 1991 for a few races. He scored 4.5 points to Michael's 4 in the races where they were teamates. But yes Piquet was certainly past his prime by then.

 

True ... Piquet was past his prime. Michael raced for less than half a season starting with the Spa GP. So his 4 points were commendable in a car (Jordan and Benneton) that was not that good.

 

In regards to the original post,

Jenson and Rubens are nominally #1 from the start of the year. But if their performances continue as demonstrated in the last two races, Honda will defer to Jenson's requirements over Rubens pretty soon. Meaning if there is a change to the car or aero or whatever, then if Jenson likes it bit Rubens hates it ... tough luck for the Brazilian.

I think Rubens had some bad luck this season with gearbox issues and other stuff. But I dont think he has ever beaten Jenson on laptimes during testing or on the race weekend. Rubens is not a bad driver by any means. The differences between the two are somewhat akin to that between him and Schumi.

Its basically given me a newfound respect for Jenson. The boy is fast. I always thought Jenson had never aced a better driver. Forget about Villenueve for a moment...

 

Conservative? I can't imagine that all of he aero rules bending they're doing with the "bending" aero they have on the car can be considered conservative. I'll agree with you that it's still early in the season and they might be trying to be gentile on their high strung engines but I don't see this new car as being conservative.

If anyone's been conservative I'd say it's been Toyota. The more I've been thinking about this past race the more impressed by Ralf's (yes I said it) performance. To start from the back of the grid, have a sick car (they were loosing compressed air in the system), and having to run a three pit stop strategy to continually top up the system and finish in the points... tells me they've found some speed. It's become apparent that the Toyota is very easy on tires in comparison to the other Bridgestone runners. So, they'll be operating at the soft end of the tire supply. As the season goes on and Bridgestone makes even softer tires for them and as they learn to make those tires work better they'll just get faster.

But, I'm not sure Ferrari will benefit from these developments with their Bridgestones. Both the Ferrari and Toyota chassis seem to treat the tires very differently.