Renault asks the FIA to let them use their mass damper . .

Some people have attention spans of dodo birds... this discussion keeps moving off topic... this thread is not about my personal pictures...

So racerx3317 and birdodo, any update with regards to the source about Charlie Whiting changing his mind?

 

Well that prety much sums it all up doesnt it

 

OK then i'll see if i can accomodate you then.

 

So I gues Charlie Whiting did not change his mind after all...

******************************************

The FIA's International Court of Appeal has sided with the governing body over the issue of the legality of 'mass dampers' in Formula One.

A statement on Wednesday afternoon confirmed that after the hearing in Paris on Tuesday, four judges overturned Hockenheim stewards' surprise ruling that - contrary to FIA delegate Charlie Whiting's earlier banning of the device - it was in fact legal.


The news could seriously dent Renault's charge to retain the lead in the 2006 world championship, with the now outlawed technology believed by experts to have accounted for about half a second per lap of the R26 car's pace.

Source GMM
CAPSIS International
************************************************

 

And we are still waiting for racerx's quote that charlie whiting changed is mind?

oops never happenned... mass-dampers were always ILLEGAL!

 

I never said i had a quote unlike you with your elite suite pics which you claimed to have but we all know you do not.

 

This thread is not about my personal pictures.. it is however about Renault's unethical behavior.

The FIA has decided that mas-dampers were illegal and that they will be banned henceforth. Charile Whiting never changed his mind and McLaren were the first to complain against the unethical behavior of Renault!

Furthermore, any conspiracy theorists have been proven wrong... Ferrari concentrates on real racing while teams like Renault and McClonk bicker and fight over petty issues!

 

Of course he changed his mind. They were legal at first then he made them illegal. Then he was gonna let them use it till the hearing then the flip flopped again. Sounds like an awful lot of mind changing to me. And the thread is not about your personal, non exsisent pics, it's about how full of it you usually are. Anyway i'm done with the whole subject, someone else is gonna have to feed the troll.

 

Charlie Whiting never changed his mind. If you still feel he did... give us a quote that says he changed his mind?

Rules are rules... all the teams agreed to them before starting the season. The unethical renault decided to use illegal equipment and cheat. The FIA had to enforce the rules and henceforth mass-dampers will be banned!

 

I still feel that he did, nothing has changed. I never said i had a quote in the first place and that hasn't changed either.

You just said it yourself "Rules are rules... all the teams agreed to them before starting the season" The mass damper was legal at the start of the season, approved by the FIA and Whiting so the R26 was desinged around it. So they did nothing wrong. When the FIA fiddles with the rules midseason it's deterimental to the sport as a whole. Thank you for agreeing with me, maybe you're not as twisted as you seem.......................

 

The mass-dampers were never legal. They were an illegal piece of equipment used by the unethical Renault team. The FIA had to step in to make sure that they spelled it out for Renault and told them to stop using it.

All the other teams refrained from using unethical illegal equipment that Ranault were using. Charlie Whiting never changed his mind. He made sure that Renault could not use illegal equipment anymore.

Your feelings do not matter if they are not supported by evidence and fact. The fact is that mass-dampers were always illegal. Renault cheated by using them and then the FIA banned it!

 

They were checked by the FIA in Sept when they were first used and ruled legal. If it was always illegal it would have been banned then. There goes that arguement, try again.

 

Check again... the FIA never ruled it legal.. it was the race officials.

Wrong again racerx... as usual!

 

Who makes the rules at the Start of the season the FIA is it not? The mass damper was legal then wasn't it? There you go, it's you that's wrong again, as usual.

 

No they were never legal. The unethical Renault team chose to use illegal equipment.

All the teams agreed to the rules. Renault knew what the rules were. They chose to use illegal equipment. When the illegal equipment was shown to the FIA it got banned!

Bottom line... Renault have been caught cheating again and mass-dampers have been deemed unethical! Wrong again racerx!

 

Impy mate, you've lost the plot (dare I say again !!?)

nobody would deliberately put something in their car that was prohibited by the rule book at the chance of having their season ruined by points deductions.

If the FIA had ruled mass dampers ILLEGAL before the start of the season then all points would have had to be stripped from the "cheating" Renault team and Michael would be mounting #8 on the wall.

What we have here is someone has come up with an idea that doesn't fit strictly into a black/white situation and there had to be an official ruling to clarify it's use, since been deemed outside the guidelines.

Imagine the hoohaa if they took points off the "cheating" Renault team like they did to BAR last year with the tank issue, all hell would break loose and Ferrari would be coping the flack RD started

 

Impy, you go on and on about the same subject, over and over again!
Can you, please, change the record sometimes, or are you one of these forum facists you wants to have the last word all the time?

Also, why carry on with the 'unethical Renault team' (sic) all the time.
Any team is unethical at time, and they all try to interpret the rules in their favour. That's why the teams pay huge amount of money to their designers, technical managers and so on, to try to make their cars competitive and gain a technical advantage.

As far as I know, Renault didn't try to hide the fact that they were using 'mass damping' (like some other teams) and removed it when asked to. They were not 'caught with their pants down', they were just using a bit of technology that was not specifically proscribed by the rule book. They interpreted the rules, like others I may say, and when told that the FIA interpreted them differently, they complied. What's wrong with their ethics, then?

Probably it's better to close this thread and give you a break before you blow a blood vessel, no?

 

true William but they did cheat a while ago when they used the launch system tied into the jumpstart trigger mechanism ,

 

If you know the F1 rule book so well show me where it says that the mass damper was illegal at the start of the season. The mass damper was inspected by the FIA and Whiting last year when it was just starting to be used and again this year. So show me where in the F1 rule book does it say that any sort of mass damping system is illegal other than some BS subclause they just put in because of the ruling. Go ahead show me. You can't do it.You are wrong yet again. Period. No more food for you, Imperialtroll83....

 

THE RULES THAT YOU REQUESTED

********************************

DECISION OF THE INTERNATIONAL COURT OF APPEAL

The FIA International Court of Appeal met in Paris on Tuesday, August 22, 2006, to examine the appeal made by the Federation Internationale de l’Automobile against Decision No. 8 handed down by the Stewards of the Meeting on July 28, 2006, concerning the T car of competitor Mild Seven Renault F1 on the occasion of the Grand Prix of Germany and counting towards the 2006 FIA Formula One World Championship.

Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court quashed decision No. 8 of the Stewards of the Meeting and ruled that use of the device known as a Tuned Mass Damper is an infringement of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations.

The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Philippe ROBERTI de WINGHE (Belgium), elected President, Mr Pierre TOURIGNY (Canada), Mr John CASSIDY (United States) and Mr Anthony SCRIVENER (Great Britain).

The full text of the International Court of Appeal’s decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris


*******************************

Rules are rules.. the device known as a Tuned Mass Damper is an infringement of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations.

So I have given the quote... we are still waiting for your quote?

It never happenned. Charlie Whiting never changed his mind? You were wrong.. as usual!

 

Whatdoes the Article 3.15 of the F1 Tecnical Regs say exactly?

 

Learn to read brother. The date on that is Aug 22nd. You said the start of the season. Still WRONG! The mass damper was deemed legal at the start of the season, as a matter of fact it was deemed legal last season. Article 3.15 of the regs has to do with a moveable aero device which is the whole arguement we have been having. Many people feel that the TMD isn't a moveable aero device while the FIA does. That's neither here nor there but Impy keeps saying it was illegal form the start of the season when, according to his own post, it's only been illegal from Aug 22nd.

 

3.15 Aerodynamic influence:
With the exception of the cover described in Article 6.5.2 (when used in the pit lane) and the ducts described in Article 11.4, any specific part of the car influencing its aerodynamic performance:
- Must comply with the rules relating to bodywork.
- Must be rigidly secured to the entirely sprung part of the car (rigidly secured means not having any degree of freedom).
- Must remain immobile in relation to the sprung part of the car.
Any device or construction that is designed to bridge the gap between the sprung part of the car and the ground is prohibited under all circumstances.
No part having an aerodynamic influence and no part of the bodywork, with the exception of the skid block in 3.13 above, may under any circumstances be located below the reference plane.

**************************

Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court quashed decision No. 8 of the Stewards of the Meeting and ruled that use of the device known as a Tuned Mass Damper is an infringement of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations.

**************************

Sorry guys, Mass-dampers were always illegal. Renault chose to use them. They knew they were cheating when they were caught, they cooperated to avoid any further punishment!

 

No! Read again...

**************************

Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court quashed decision No. 8 of the Stewards of the Meeting and ruled that use of the device known as a Tuned Mass Damper is an infringement of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations.

**************************

That means, mass-dampers are and always were an infringment of Article 3.15 of the Formula One Technical Regulations. Renault chose to use them knowing full well they were illegal.

Wrong again racerx!

We are still waiting for your quote that charlie whiting changed his mind?

 

Again show me where the rules say it was always illegal. The mass damper is not part of the body work. It seems to fall under a gray area. The TMD in inside the nose of the car. No the FIA is considering something inside the nose of the car bodywork. Ok, call it bodywork as the FIA is doing but reading the rules there was nothing wrong with what Renault did with the TMD. They exploited a grey area in the rules. This was all legal till aug 22nd. So where does it state that it was always illegal?