The continued Saga of the '87 Testarossa...

Thanks!!! You have no idea how tough it has been to find some hard compression data on this vintage Testarossa with a good test procedure. I did not keep track of high/low on each cylinder the way you did, but recorded the average of 2 cranks on each. We did the test the same as you - all plugs out, plenum open, good charger on battery, etc. We tried 2 guages with no real differences noted. So-

your cars: 29K = high 190, low 184 // exactly what I would have expected
42K = 177, 154 // lower and greater high/low, but OK

mine: 51K = 120, 90 // way-T.H. too low, and 33% variation.

Also, it is quite obvious that my 51K test is way,way below the curve if you assume a constant for compression loss between your 29K car and the 41K one. If my numbers were like your 42K car, I would already have a red car in the garage by now, cat converters to be replaced when possible.

However, for this car...I apply my "Corvair rules"...if these 51K numbers were on my old Corvair hotrod, it would be up in the air for rings and valves as we speak. The problem with the Ferrari, as other posters clearly state, is that this engine rebuild could easily go 75% of the car's worth, while probably not putting it's value more than mid-fifties.

Did I also mention that about 50cc of fresh oil came out of the #3 spark plug hole when he pulled off the boot on the plug wire?

I gave up the Santa Claus concept easier than this when I was a kid...

Thanks again, James

PS - post coming for that car person who hizacded my thread about ZR1/LT5!!!

 

You posted -

"I sold my ZR-1 to get my first TR and have no regrets."

This observation is as valuable to me as the compression numbers! Why do you think I am looking at an older TR which obviously needs work?

a. As Bullfighter cleverly revealed - "I am not exactly awash in cash".

b. I could not bear to let go of my 1995 #401 (black/black) with only 29,000 miles to get into a TR. Hence, look at older cars with more miles/problems...
an aside - They only made 448 ZR1s in 1995 and this may be one of the very last 3 or 4 in black/black. It also has the "Dunn" heads slated for the never-built 1996 475hp version.

Maybe I need to do a reality check here - I have had #401 for six years. I keep it under a car cover, drive only once a week. Just like I planned to do with the Ferrari. If I was only willing to let go of it, and to put all the expense this current '87 offers into the balance, would a 10K-12K miles 512TR be totally out of the question?

James - If I keep on whining and ranting like this, I suppose I should become a subscriber...thanks for everyone's interest.

 

Thanks for bumping this thread back around, LucasLaw, JayF, and BPU699. I think I did post that the owner drove it for around 120 miles and had the leakdown redone on #11 and #12. It was still about 20%, but looked like it might have gone down by 1% or so.

I did call on an exhaust system that Joe told me about, but it was gone already. Actually, I am starting to look again with a more realistic viewpoint on price...this car was not worth within 10K of the asking once you know the problems.

By the way, I have been in contact with Norwood (James the owner was one of the first to welcome me onto this forum, BTW). They have been very helpful and told me many items to look for. I might very well have thought that the custom exhaust on that car would have been a simple bolt-on of the converter parts if he had not shown me a stock testa exhaust he had there in his shop...so many thanks to Norwood Performance.

I have an online dealer who is making some attempts to arrange a trade for my ZR1 on a lower mileage 1987 with recent service - but no deal yet.

James

 

The owner just called with good news/bad news.

He has driven another 125 or so miles, and claims the leakdown is now down to about 17% on the two weak cylinders.

However, while paying toll on the highway, he attempted to shift down into first, only to be greeted by an ugly crunch and an immobilized transmission. So, they have it at LFSC and are doing the transmission and differential, and while the engine is out will do belt service as well.

I asked about valves and rings, but do not have a clear answer yet. I think it depends on what Joe finds when they get it apart.

I told him I was sorry that happened, and I am. He seems to be a nice guy who has got himself into kind of a mess.

James

 

It was missing from the current month's Hemmings, but he says it will go into next month's issue. He thinks he now wants 62,000 for it - i.e. when it is fixed.

I cannot imagine pulling that engine out and not doing the valves and rings, but I am afraid that this may very well be what happens. Preliminary word is a transmission rebuild as well as the fact that metal got into the diff. They are waiting for parts just now.

I take it that a certain female family member is quite put out by the premature eruption of this little hand grenade.

I think I may have dodged a pretty dangerous bullet here - but still feel sorry for the owner. He truly loved this car, and now he kind of feels let down by it.

 

You know what went through my selfish little mind when I first heard it?

What if that first gear had crunched out while I was driving it?

Yikes!

I am going to try to follow the story, just out of human interest. I kind of think that what BPU said is pretty much what Joe Puakner told him - it may not be worth trying to do a full rebuild on that motor; but in that case why is it worth a belt service?

James

 

Thanks for the message, but it is not appearing in my list...maybe because I am not subscribed...?

Will try to do that later today - then maybe you can resend.

I will not have any more news on the engine/transmission work until about September 5; the owner is taking a vacation and he tells me that Joe the mechanic has had some minor surgery.

James

PS - everybody I talk to agrees that this engine should go way further than 50,000 miles without valve/ring/bottom end trouble. I don't know if we will ever know what is happening on this one if they don't at least pull the heads.

 

MGTR1990, or anybody else - If this deal should ever get put together, I will definately need all the exhaust system from the 3to1 headers back...including the precats, main cats, mufflers, and the rest.

Would it be possible to post me back a price for what you have?

Thanks, everybody...

PS - Yes, I know the concensus has been that this is a junk parts car, but as the owner is doing the overhaul at his own cost, I am looking at it again. Remember, this car is in really great shape cosmetically, and is a real one owner.

James

 

Carguy, it has the original 3>>1 headers, but from that point back everything is custom. The four headers go to four little individual mufflers (kind of like an old glasspack), and there are no precats nor are there the two original main cats. I was hoping that the owner had just put test pipes in it, and that I could then just buy the main convertors, but it was obviously not the case when I actually saw the car.

At least, I don't think I will need to buy the 3to1 headers...

BTW, Joe Paukner says that while he has the engine apart he will make a decision as to whether it needs a top overhaul (i.e., he will find out why those two cylinders are low).

Still looking for exhaust system parts, thanks,

James

 

That really does look like the system, but of course I am here in Dallas and the car is up in Chicago, so I can't say for sure. (Except of course that my candidate is not nearly that shiny!) What did you do about the sensors? The chicago 87 has them in just two of the four individual pipe - and I can see a couple of fittings on your inner two pipes that look the same.

I think that the main issue for me right now is the precats - if they could be found there at least 2 or 3 aftermarket options. So, maybe I should just concentrate on that.

Maybe I will go check with the Norwood guys here again, as long as the owner is fixing the engine and transmission. He is doing a belt service as well, so I am warming up to this car again - the big issue right now being the cat system.

BTW - do you think this setup really makes a little more power, or is it just for sound quality? My owner claims 20hp but he has no dyno sheets. I think I will save this system even if I can put together a legal cat converter installation.

Thanks - James