I have a 01 360 euro spider. The TCUs have been upgraded. Yesterday I had the PIS on my clutch adjusted. Things were slipping a lot and this was a great improvement. This morning my 360 wouldn't shift into reverse. I could shift into 1st and all forward gears shifted smoothly but I couldn't get into reverse. It turns out you can shift to R from 1st but not from N. I took it back to the dealer. They told me that the PIS couldn't have anything to do with this. That may be true but the two events were exactly coincident so: when you hear hoof beats don't think zebras. The checked yesterday's records and told me that my pump was producing plenty of pressure and the numbers all looked good. They experinced the problem and suggested that it was the reverse lever. I questioned that too because when you try to R it still says N but the throttle won't respond AND it will time out, beep, and drop back to N. They then suggested that it may be an actuator. OK, that may be true. I can at least cook up a idea about how this could be possible and the PIS could have caused an existing problem to manifest. Anyone experience this type of problem? OR, any of our experts want to venture a guess? Thanks in advance, John
I had the same thing happen to my '99 360 (US car). SV auto cleared the shift program on the computer and re-downloaded it which solved the problem.
This TCU 'Self Learning' technique worked on the 355 F1 system but I'm not sure if it works on the 360 'new ' TCU's, but it's worth a try. With the key in the ignition and swtiched on (not engine started) and the handbrake released, wait for the 'Check Light OK', and complete the following procedures with intervals between each step of less than 4 seconds. a. Press the automatic shift button beside the reverse selector b. Apply full throttle by pressing the accelator all the way down with the right foot. c. With the left foot, press the brake pedal three times, and keep it depressed on the thrid time. At this point the actuator should start selecting gears, i.e reverse, first, second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth. If the operation is successful a beep should be heard, but if there is a malfunction four beeps will be heard. If that is the case and you wish to repeat the operation, release the brake pedal, the automatic button, switch off the ignition and wait for the display to shut down, and begin again. Please let me know how you get on.........and where will I send the bill.
How many miles do you have on your clutch? I had your same symptoms when my clutch started going bad. For some reason Reverse suffered first. Resetting the PIS value gave some improvement, but it was short-lived. New clutch with the updated throwout bearing cured all ills. Lou
FYI-- I had the same issue with a 360 I rented from San Diego prestige...but it seemed to be fixed the second time I rented it.
I had a similar issue once with my 360 and was given two very different pieces of advice. 1) Turn off the motor. Put your foot on the brake and hold down for about 10 seconds (putting decent pressure on the brake). Repeat this a couple of times and then try to engage reverse. I actually did this and it worked. My car was in N when I was having trouble engaging reverse. 2) I told my dealer about this and he said that there was no relation between the braking system and reverse. The dealer said always to go from 1st to reverse as opposed to N to reverse. This also seemed to work. Hope this helps a little.
The dealer is 100% absolutely INCORRECT about the non-relation to the PIS. That is precisely what the problem is. We have had the exact same issue multiple times on both the 360 Modena and 360 Spider in our rental fleet. We have tested it extensively and are able to reproduce the problem repeatedly. When the PIS is adjusted to a point where the clutch "grabs" harder (and with less slippage), which is what I presume you had done, there is the possibility that this issue will arise. It can be elmininated by lowering the PIS a hair. We played around on our vehicles and found that exact tipping point -- set .1 below and it goes into reverse fine, set .1 above and the issue is there. Believe it or not, we opted to keep the PIS on the high side, and we explain to people that you simply have to put the car in 1st before going into reverse. The higher PIS extends clutch life and is a fine tradeoff for us. --Noah
The P.I.S. is set too low. Whoever is doing the work shold know that. It is a classic symptom and should be tested for whenever the P.I.S. is reset.
Thanks for the feedback. Rifledriver, As usual you wisdom is greatly appriciated. I suspected that the two events were related. They adjusted from 4.5 to 4.2. It really needed some adjustment because it was having a hard time hooking up when I was in 1st. Apparently they just overdid it a little. For what it's worth, the problem appears to be worse in the morning when it is cold. I start the car, warm it up for 3-5 min, and still have the problem. After I drive the car around some it goes into reverse much easier. This clutch doesn't have too many miles. I just got the car a month ago so I would need to look back at the records for the exact milage and the records aren't with me right now. The car has 15k and the clutch was replaced a while back. The dealers scan shows 49% wear so it should still be ok.
FWIW, the only 2 times it happened on my 360 it was well over a 100 degrees out and I had been running very hard.
Do I understand correctly from this thread that it is best to shift to reverse from 1st gear rather than from N? If yes, is the recommendation that you should always shift from N to 1st just to get to R?
No need unless the P.I.S. is mal adjusted. It is true that if adjusted very low so R cannot be selected it can cause slightly better clutch operation but it ALMOST always results in clutch drag which will wear the clutch out faster. It also brings about a real liability if an operator of the vehicle cannot change directions of the vehicle rapidly under stress, say when executing a U turn with traffic coming.
Here is a quick update. When I told the dealer that the transmission wasn't shifting well I assumed that they would check the obvious first; is it plugged in, is it turned on, does it have fluid. Clearly a bad assumption. The shifting has been getting worse. I checked the fluid just now and it is low; actually just a tiny drop on the bottom of the stick. Now I suspect that the shifting problem is primarily due to the low fluid. The PIS is probably set too tight. AND, I must have a lead somewhere because the fluid shouldn't be down.
From the very bottom tip of the stick to the low mark is fine. Your symptoms do not fit a hydraulic problem. Diagnosing and repairing the F1 system should be a slam dunk for anyone properly equipped and competent. There are several people around the bay that can do it for you. I do not know who is working on it now but they do not fit my description. Find one that does. Owners of Ferraris in the bay area are the luckiest on earth. There are more Ferrari shops per square mile than anywhere I know. No reason to put up with idiots.
Thanks Brian. I agree with you. The errant service was performed at Ferrari of Silicon Valley. I even discussed this with them in detail and they tried to tell me it was a weak actuator. I expected better from the dealer; my bad I guess. I am in the south bay. I believe your shop is in Dublin. If you were close, I would run it up to you. I dropped it over to Flavio over at Silicon Valley Auto Group. He appears to know what he is doing. Opinions are always welcome. Feel free to PM or email if you don't want to post opinions. The method of checking fluid outlined in the owners manual is wrong. It says 'with the engine cold, run the pump until it stops, then check the fluid level'. If you do this it will be over filled. Yes, this was learned the hard way.
had same problem, problem with reversing was aprelude to smoke form engine bay as a result of seized bearing in ?release wheel of clutch
