Hello, can someone give me a advice on putting my gearbox together. I had to disassemble the backplate for some reason. The plate wich covers the side wich faces to the engine. The gearselection fork is installed in this plate too. So now i got the fork here and the cover and plenty of nice rockers. So how i figure out wich rocker i have to put between my fork? 27, 28, 38 are the rockers. The Forkpart is 30 with 29 still assembled. I don't touched the gear selection forks inside the gearbox. Only disassembled the plate and the fork part cames of with it too. Image Unavailable, Please Login
If memory serves me correctly there is a considerable number of special tools required to reassemble that gearbox correctly. Toby at Ferrari of Houston is the best on these transmissions.
Realy? I don't touched the forks on the shafts itself. They are still mounted all on the right position. In the workshop manual i only found some tools to align the selector rods inside the gearbox if they where just installed and the forks not in the right place.
I have rebuilt 6 of these gearboxes with home made special tools. I race one and it has not blown up. They are not magic. So....what are you asking? I do not understand the question.
Ok i did the following to the gearbox 1. Put the plate wich seals the housing away 2. Now i can see the internals of the gearbox differential and so on 3. Worked a bit on the plate ( i had to modify something that i can put the gearbox on another engine wich wasn't build to mount on that gearbox. 4. Now i'm done with that and want to put the plate back in place. The plate is the part with the hole where the crankshaft sealingplate is put into. Where also the shifting fork goes into wich is connected to the shift cables outside of the gearbox. 5. So final question >>"How can i put it all together??"<< Because the shifting mechanism how should i position it? on the picture you see what i call the shifting fork. This is the part wich goes trough the plate of the housing wich i disassembled. Now i slide it back through the plate and now i have to put the fork between one of the three "rockers" 27,28,38 on the first picture. Image Unavailable, Please Login
8/20/18 selector boss indexes onto detents into rods 11/17/19 and cannot be done improperly or the puzzle will not fit together. selector tongue on 27/38/28 bellcranks index into the square receptacles on 8/20/18. The primary selector 29 fingers 27/38/28 depending on the gear you select. If you set the gearbox up in neutral (no gear selcted) then you can have 29 freely floating. Personally, I like to select 2nd gear. This ensures that 1) I have a gear fully engaged in the gearbox. 2) the tongue for second must be fully engaged. 3) the primary selctor is therefore engaged. and 4) this makes it easier to put the shifer in second and tighten everything up. This makes the shift cable adjustment almost zero. That is my technique and nobody I know uses it or beleives that it saves you time. But I think it does and it makes sure that you have fully engaged a gear from the gearbox which is the most basic place and work backward to the shifter. This works on any Ferrari gearbox and I have done it this way for 25 years. Some like to start from neutral but it makes for more work. Ask Ernie he did it the hardway and posted about it on FC. I actually make slim to no adjustments my way. So there you have the secret. I hope that helps. Oh make sure you have all those little pills and springs and balls back in the right place for the shift rods to detent into as they move. It is part of the rod action.
Okay, if I understand you correctly you removed the front cover of the transmission, the part that faces the back of the engine block. Since you have the sellector shaft out you may as well change the o-ring that is inside the cover plate and the seal, these are both in the hole that the selector shaft goes through on the cover plate. You said that all you did was remove the cover plate off the front of the tranny and haven't touched anything inside the gearbox. If that is all you have done then it is pretty easy to put the cover back on. Yup that's the way I did it. It is easy to put the cover on that way though, but it does make it a bit of a pain in the butt to adjust the shift cables once the gear box is back in the car. That is why Billybob calls it the hard way. You can put the cover back on whatever way you like, just make sure that when you do the you have the fork that is on the sellector shaft (#29) facing the rockers that are on the back of the cover plate. The shaft goes into the cover pretty much facing the same way you have it in the picture. That is if you are looking at the transmission on the left side (drivers side on left hand drive cars). The little notch has to face to the left because that is for the retaining screw for the slider, the part that the shift cables get connected to. If you do it the way I did, with the gears in neutral, you want to have all the rockers lined up so that the ends are facing the fork on the selector shaft and the other ends are facing the forks inside the transmission. You will also want all the forks inside the gear box lined up. When you start to slide the cover back on you can look through the space and see if the rockers are all lined up with the fork in the gear box. If the rockers are not lined up the fork on the selector shaft will not be able to rotate properly over each one for gear selection. One thing you can do while the cover is off, to get an idea of how it works, is to put the selector shaft back in the hole on the cover, and then move the selector so that you can see how the fork slides over the rockers and then moves them. Anyway, so long as you haven't touched anything inside the transmission you shouldn't have a problem putting the cover back on.
Mmm ok but how i see what gear is selected at the moment? Because i don't know wich gear was selected last. So i need to put the sellector shaft on the right rocker wich is for the gear selected at the moment? Or i only put it on any of them. But then when i adjust the shift cables i must know wich gear is selected? If i'm right i have 3 choices at the moment because there are 3 rockers and i can put the sellector shaft on either of them. Or not? On wich should i put it on any of them? And other question how i adjust the shift cables at the end? ___________________ Samy
Ernie is correct in his post. You can follow it or follow mine. You do need to determine what gear your gearbox was last in so you can index the selectors. OR You can physically push on the synchro/dog ring complex and manually engage gears with the front cover off. Just look inside and play with it. Then you can either select a gear such as 2nd and then index the shift forks accordingly or select no gear and do it Ernie's way. Both work fine. We have a philisophical difference like I like blondes he like brunettes. As plugzit would say...."makes no difference to me I'll take either".
Or you can put the cover one while everything is in neutral and then sellect 2nd gear afterwards. This way you get the best of both worlds.
Well as you know I'm a bit anal about certain things and that is one of them. You see I disagree with this becasue you cannot be certain that you have fully selected 2nd with everything assembled and tweeking into second from the primary shift boss. The gearbox is the most basic place to start. To put in in terms you can fully understand selection at the gearbox vs the shift boss is like "get position before submission". Going to the boss is like doing a flying armbar and hoping you get it.
Okay if you look at your picture the top rocker #27 is for 1st gear and reverse, the middle rocker #38 is 2nd and 3rd gear (that is the one fatboy wants you to have in gear ), and the bottom rocker #28 is 4th and 5th gear. If you look at the picture on the right in this thread http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=135397033&postcount=71, it is of my tranny opened up, and that is how the forks on the slector rods look when the gears are in neutral. Now if you want to engage 2nd gear, looking at the front of the open gear box as in the picture, if I'm not mistaken, you will want the middle fork moved to the left. That should engage 2nd gear, via the control fork on the selector ring. Now if you already have a gear engaged just look at the selector ring for the syncros and see which gear syncro it is slid over. It should be pretty evident if it is in gear or not. So when you are putting the cover back on, you will want the rockers arms to fit into the forks on the control rods, and you will want to make sure that the fork on the selector shaft is facing the rocker arms. Just play with it a little bit and you'll get the idea of how it works.
Ok i will try. In the workshop manual they use two special tools to position the 3 forks of the selector rods. These are putting the forks into neutral or what they do? And this can also be done without them just by eye? Why they use these tools? Tomorrow i will look what gear is selected i hope its neutral or second then i don't need to change it. But for the next step. How do i adjust the cables? As an exampel if the selected gear is the second. Then i put in the second gear on the shift stick inside the car. And then mount the cables on the shifting device outside the gearbox beside the oilpan? And what do i do then? Till now i only drive cars with shift rods no cables. __________________ Samy
When Ferrari sells you especialt tools they make alot of especial money. Second special tools scare you don't they. They you will take your gearbox to Ferrari and they will rebuild it for you for about $15,000 usd. The threes stooges can do the same thing for just the cost of parts. A hand grenade went off in Ernies GB and it cost him about 3000usd, a few pizzas to feed my fat face and he had to sollow his pride as I busted his chops for about 6 months! All in all much cheaper than 15k. Let me tell you about Ferrari special tools. Often times you can make very sofisticated tools right in your own garage. This is a special ball bearing holding tool invented by none other than the famous FC'er Ernie...It gives you an idea of how hard this gearbox is to put together. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Well I did it by eye, as has Billybob. But you don't have to worry about that because you only took of the cover plate. Even if you had remove the shift rods it still isn't hard to put them back together. It is pretty hard to mess them up because of the design. The rods have detents in them, so when the are moved back to the middle you can feel them click into place, via the little ball bearing and spring that are inside the tranny case. On top of that there is also a detent on the back side for the screw that holds the fork to the rod. Sort of the same deal as for the slider on the shifter shaft. So, just put the shift shaft back into the hole on the cover plate, then slip the cover plate back onto the front of the gearbox. You can always take it back off again. You can try putting the cover back on with the gear box as it sits, then move everything to a different gear, and try it again, or put all the stuff in neutral, or put it in 2nd, or what ever. Like I said play with it a little bit and you'll get the idea of what is going on. It's no big deal. All you are dooing is putting the cover plate on, and then taking it off.
