BOXER REBELLION - New Sports & Exotic Magazine

Thanks man, as I'm too poor to buy it! LOL!

 

thanks for scanning the article

Many errors are in it including the redline at 6500rpm actually 7000rpm, weight which is 3050 dry factory not 3500 as with a converted car, HP which is 360 not 340 and they way they are talking about this particular cars drivability and noises sounds as if its out of tune

 

I liked Captain Obvious's comment..."try to buy one that's been recently serviced......" LOL!

 

i was thinking alot of the same thing...they make the car out to be kinda tame. i don't think i would describe a carb or fi car that way.

the photos were taken at fiesta island so they may not have run it very hard.

 

Actually the 340hp number is right for a 512, 360hp for the 365, 380hp for the prototype 365 engine. My car weighs 3400lbs with fluids as they basically said and my redline starts at just over 6000rpm /6500rpm, not 7000.

 

Note the comment about making custom transmission gears...

Hasn't that issue popped up a couple of times in the past, in regards to boxer/testarossa gearboxes???

Well, it seems that gears can be made, as the article alludes to a price of $400 or so for a gear. I wonder where he had it made. Might be a fantastic resource if known...

 

The Nichols book quotes Ferrari saying the 512 motor is quite safe to 7500rpm, actual redline is 7000 though instrument gives beginning warning at 6500, max power is also at 6800 rpm a actual 6500 redline makes no sense

Other publications including Ferrari quoted 360hp for the 512BB confirmed by Carobu stock 512BB motor that was dynoed, the BBi is 340.

 

The Canepa 512BB was purchased by a guy in the Seattle area. If this is a different car, clearly it is not owned by the guy up here.

Cheers...Keith

 

What's the deal with the BBi front valance & grill & driving lights. Is that a result of DOT federalization?

 

Thats a standard, non-converted BB512 front bumper, not from a BBi. I noticed the silver nardi wheel which seems to be a 1980 thing from what Ive seen, almost a transition from the Momo silver wheel to the black nardi one on the injected cars. Also the front flash-to-pass lights protrude more than the injected cars do just like JTR's.

 

Concerning the front end, who can figure Ferrari's. After your comment it's the correct grill, I went to Mel Nichol's book, and it appears you are correct. My 81 BB512, # 37715, engine # 917, has the hidden driving "fog" lamps, and a full width grill, not the grill that's on the Hemmings car. Don't know which I like better.

 

I believe the differences in those front egg crater going full width or not and foglights exposed or behind grills ,...were based on the exported country's regulations. I believe Italy had the lights exposed, whereas other nations like Swiss etc. had the lights hidden behind the craters. Jimmy

 

I agree it would be a market thing with the lamps. I prefer the exposed lights myself and even if I had a carbed car I would prefer the look of the injected lamps only because they seem to fit the front better and look like less of an add-on. Thats just personal preference plus im probably biased but in denial

 

is that gear stick nob stock.

 

I’ve driven with this car up in the hills east of San Diego, and trust me, it runs and sounds just like you’d expect from a well tuned BB!
As Peter said, they were test driving in an area where you couldn’t really do much with it.
The big mirrors look better in person than they do in the pictures, but I’d still opt for the originals. It’s actually a very nice car and Joe and Archie have put some time and bucks into it to make it better, but as with most any Boxer there are always a few more things to do.
The front grills/lights are the same on both cars, and I don’t doubt that both are original from the factory.
And actually, eating Archie’s exhaust that day was a real treat, as I got to hear what a reved up Boxer really sounds like powering through the hills and valleys!
Unfortunately that was the same day I smacked the critter at an unreasonable speed on the highway, and bent my grill, but all in all a great fun filled day.
Now if Peter would ever bring his car out west, we could have a three boxer run!
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So as we all know a boxer is a great car, put some real tires on it, amp up the engine a bit and you have the prefect ferrari. More perf than you can use on the road, hand built 12 cyls exotic experience none of the moderns have. Realisticaly you need a 288gto to exceed the experience of a properly sorted boxer and those are a fair bit more pricey.

Based on the price of a 288gto a boxer should be a 200-250k car. That it is not placed there is because when new a boxer was seen as a bit of a anticlimax compared to the excellent daytona.

The faults in the boxer are crap tires and a somewhat compromised engine.
Imagine if ferrari had not had to go for the fat testarossa and continued to develop the boxer. Low profile tires and a proper FI system. What stops us from doing this today is a slavish adherance to originality.

Modern wheels can be ,made that look almost exactly like the originals and a modern FI system is easily remaovable and will not leave marks.

Since we find it acceptable that Daytonas and 275 gtb have newer wheels and tires not to mention rebuilt carbs with emissions removed and euro exhausts, why can a sympatheticaly modded boxer not be acceptable too. By acceptable I mean not devalued. The canapea car that sold a few months back seemed to acheive this.

A boxer was compromised by tire and crude emission technology. Had ferrari fitted p7's and a proper FI system where would it be today. I think us boxer fans should band together and create an acceptable provenance for
a sympatheticaly updated boxer.

Just think you are all driving around in possibly the best classic ferrari short of a 288gto(arguably the boxer is better looking and has a 12) held back by a bit of rubber and some breathing.

The alternative is to become a GHibli a car almost as good as a daytona just as stunning to look at but too expensive to keep up vs value.

 

Rims and rubber are one thing. Easily reversible. F1? That's quite the jump! I'd keep my 5 speed. But if you've got about 25 large constantly wandering around your house, a full EFI and head work can be done on a 2v Boxer motor to make it modern. Another 5 for bottom end work and she'll keep pace with most modern sportscars.

I'd just settle for a system to easily replace the radio or otherwise integrate another one.

 

He said FI not F1. A good FI system, FI FI FI FI.

 

Jimmy, you guys are right again. # 37715 was first sold by Ch. Pozzi in Paris

 

Have a look at the lates Octane magazine, see how they are upgrading Jag xj220's . The boxer was the unfortunate child of the 70's where ferrari had little time/budjet to develop their supercar, between strikes, emissions and survival.

The FI on the boxer is a lashup, two systems slaved with soft camshafts. Interestingly the plenums etc are good. So if ferrari had the time and money and technology in 1980 they probably would have gone for a proper efi system and real wheels and tires. Basicaly this is exactly what happened to the 308 becomming the 328. Instead of a developed boxer we ended up with a testatrossa, early examples of which still had crap tires and FI.

It is one thing to resto mod and change the character of a car entirely, it is anotrher to properly sort and develop it which is what I am proposing.
A BBi should be better than a BB, its just a matter of a proper efi system, wheels with real rubber and for peace of mind a upgraded diff carrier.

For thoise that drive their BBIs imagine that surge of power you fell comming on at 4500rpm growing all the way to 7000 instead of going flat in the low 6's, imagine real soild road grip instead of the slightls losse on ice feeling at the limit.

It is not about staying with moderns so much as alowing the boxer to be the car it is meant to be. Two things, grip and breathing stand in the way because the car suffered arrested development, and that is why it is not regardede better than a daytone or 275gtb4.

 

Interesting topic Sean,

While you'll find that actually most people that frequent this site are concours purists, there's a few of us that have come to your same conclusions. In fact if you research, every upgrade you mention has been discussed in detail and in fact various solutions and resources have been identified.

Probably the big argument is why. Financially it doesn't seem to make sense to upgrade this car as the popular thought (hope) is that it's value in perfect stock condition would prohibit any logic in upgrading it.

I guess I'm one of those people that is upgrading anyway. I bought my car cheap enough to get started in this direction - don't even ask where I'm at $ wise now. I did see the Canapa car in person and actually considered buying it, but instead decided to do one better. Even though Bruce got a big number for the car, I can tell you now from first hand experience more was put into the car than it was sold for.

So... Why Do This? Because like many of us I loved it when I was a kid, and like Michael Jackson, I can't seem to leave well enough alone.

My list of upgrades and changes to date is long and pricey, and I have a ways to go.

The purists on this site have been a wealth of info, and constant source of inspiration and for sure they're keeping me honest. The car will now look fairly stock - much more than it would have.

Version 2.0 should be ready in early June. Stay tuned.

 

It's Serial # is 31061, The 'Canepa' car is it keeps being referred to is #33971.

Argento

 

Im fascinated as to how you are able to identify so many Boxers??