So Bernie Ecclestoneis is not happy with Indy and the U. S. of A.!

Whoops! I'm a newb

 

Does anyone know if Miller Motorsports Park would meet FIA specs? I don't even know what criteria needs to be met. Why is Laguna Seca out?


I've been to MMP twice (ALMS and GT Live) and although it is still in its infancy it is quite amazing. It's a blast to go around, with the high number or turns and length it has, it could make for a cool F1 course. But that would be years off if it were to ever happen.

 

Miller is great. Wide open, easy to get to and around. VERY safe. It is new but I don't think it is set up for the FIA timing and scoring equipment. I could be wrong.

 

I'm not making this up guys.

Reality check on NYC...its doesn't have 50% of the US population within its boundaries...just thinks its the center of the universe. NYC has Montreal in your area, and it turns out around 150,000...which is a small showing in Indy. Oh yea, have you ever been to Watkins Glen? I grew up 50 miles from there, we used to camp out at the track, and it usually rained about every day. That's not the F1 experience most folks are looking for.

Indy's 500 mile radius includes

Indianapolis
Chicago
Detroit
Cleveland
Cincinnati
St. Louis
Louisville
Nashville
Des Moines
Kansas City
Buffalo
Pittsburgh

I am sure I missed some, that is just off the top of my head.

Indy weather sucks? Avg high in June= 82 degrees. (yup, 10 degrees over this year...global warming?) Sorry its not a city of vice, but there are plenty of nice restaurants and clubs..maybe its just that the F1 crowd is boring?

Reality check on Los Angeles/Laguna Seca...its a 4 1/2 hour drive without regard to 'race day' traffic...

Reality check on Las Vegas in the summertime? Very pleasant. ya right. (I'd venture to guess you have never been there in the summer if you even think its an option.) Same thing with Orlando. Talk about brutal weather. Come on guys, be real. I think we've had this chat before.

The problem is simple, not that F1 is complicated. F1 is irrelevant to most people. About like soccer (EU football). It lost many of its supporters in '05. Not saying it is irrelevant to me, this is just an observation.

 

Just my 2 cents. Take it away from Tony George because he is the biggest ***** on the planet. Now bring it back to Watkins Glen where it belongs. I know that will never happen but it's nice to dream.

 

What i would like to happen is more promotion for the USGP in Indy.

What i DREAM would happen is that Road America is modified to the FIA's standards and used for F1.



Reality:


I might have to move to Canada.

 

It was in the 90s today at Indy. Tomorrow will be 94 as the high. Tomorrow here in Orlando will be 91 as the high. It gets hot everywhere for summer. Chicago reaches 100 as well over summer. Using heat as an excuse doesn't work.

Good luck trying to get residents of Detroit to go to Indy. That is if you can find anyone that even lives in that town. They've basically killed one another out there and scared all the nice people out of town, lol!

P.S. It gets very hot for the Australian, Malaysian, and Bahrain GPs as well and it doesn't stop F1 from going there. Nor does the heat stop millions of people from visiting Orlando for Universal, Disney, and Sea World. The hottest parts of the country are more in the AZ/CA border.

 

1) Rains "almost every day" in Watkins glen? Exaggeate much? 10 day weather forecast for Watkins Glen is scattered t-storms on 2 days. For Indy it's thunderstorms one day, scattered t-storms the other. Average rain in June for Indy is 4.13", 4.01" for Watkins. 3.42" in July at Wakins, 4.42" in Indy for July. Ergo, it rains more in Indy than Watkins glen.

2) If you look at a population density map of the USA, you will see that Indy is nothing special. As I said, a city in MD, TN, NC, DC, etc would have higher numbers of people within an X mile radius.

3) The 500-mile number is irrelevant. It makes for a soundbyte, nothing more. Does anyone actually drive 500 miles to an event? I'm guessing not - I'd bet most folks fly if it's over 3-4 hours. Drop the radius to 100-200 miles and you see Indy has very little around it other than truck stops and White Castle's. When you consider ease of flying in to be a major part of the deal (which is most certainly is), Indy pales in comparison to NYC, LA, and most especially Vegas.

4) Indy is not a city of vice, it's not a city of anything except plain-ness. Why would anyone want to see "beautiful Indianapolis" if it weren't for the race? Indy pales in comparison to San Fran, LA, Vegas, Florida, NYC and others in terms of the desire of people to go there.

5) Temperature is not an issue - races get moved around. Vegas, LA and FL have way more room for maneuvering here. You wouldn't want to move an Indy race to March, would you? It could be snowed out! But in NV, FL, CA, TX that would be no problem. Bahrain and Malaysia have temperature issues too - sometimes they have the race anyway (and its an interesting new factor to deal with), sometimes they shuffle them around.

6) As for LV - nobody said it needs to be in the middle of August. Average temps are 70's to 90's from March until May - whats the problem with that? Or there are plenty of nice tracks on the east coast that would be much more interesting than Indy and have more people closer and more things to do and equal or better weather. Roat Atlanta, for example.


Come on - is there anyone in the entire world that would rather go to Indianapolis to see the USGP vs. Las Vegas or LA or NYC or FL? Indy certainly isn't going to attract any foreign tourism other than folks there for the race. In Vegas or LA or FL, I bet lots and lots of folks would be enticed to bring the whole family or at least more motivated to attend the race themselves with the allure of the surrounding areas.

Who vacations in Indy anyway?

 

Yeah, It's Death Valley, then Lake Havasu area, then Phoenix. I believe in that order.

 

And wouldn't be singing the praise of NasCRAP cause. Their TV rating falling off and have been sliding back for almost two years now from their peak with the rating down on average from 5-10 plus precent pre-race the only one that still okay is the Daytona 500.
And then there is the problem of the races them selfs failing to sale out on race days. Like today race in Michagan it wasn't a sale out today agan.
And today's NasCrap is nothing like was in the '80s and earliy '90s. The races are boring and the track are so cookie cutter you can't tell where they are racing from week to week and the car are nothing more than rolling jelly beans.
Heck, give me a weaken Champ Car, F1 at Indy, and the ALMS over NasCrap. For my motor racing pleasure.

 

I was there today, and obviously could not see the telecast, but my dad told me they said 200,000 people showed up this year for the race. This may be incorrect, but if not, that's a lot of people. I don't know many fan statistics, but I can't think of another race on the calendar that would have that many people show up. What also struck me is the amount of foreigners at the race. Last year I didn't see as many as this year. Regardless, Brazilians were out in full effect today, and they have their own GP at a better track. It also seemed like there were a lot of Europeans. Obviously Indy isn't the best track on the calendar, but if people who could view the race from a better track travel all the way to Indy, it can't be so bad. I live in Chicago and don't mind the drive at all. Rip on Indy all you want. I think it was a pretty exciting race today.

Just as long as there is a race in the US, I don't really care where at, I'll be happy.

It's also pretty nice that sitting at turn one, you can see much of the infield. That's something that you can't do at a lot of tracks. I don't want to pay 200 dollars to see one turn for 70 laps.

Whatever. **** Bernie. He needs another ****ing job.

 

Having the U.S. Grand Prix in Indy, is not the most important thing for me, other U.S. cities are OK, Las Vegas may be Great. Many of us travel all over the world as a matter of doing business, or on a whim, such as going to a F1 race in Italy, Germany, U.K. Brazil, OZ, etc.

Bernie saying we don't need the U.S. Grand Prix, because it's "small potatoes", and we Americans, don't really appreciate F1 and the favor he is doing for us, well...that's another matter.

With the Michelin fiasco and this perception of the American Race Fan, don't let the door hit your skinny weasel-ass on the way out!

Ciao...Paolo

 

In my opinion California is the best place to watch racing. the weather is great and lots of amenities. (East coast and midwest weather sucks). Enough population on the W est coastto have the race well attended.

Since it is likely that Bernie will show Tony who's boss, Indy is probably history for F1.

Has anybody got their ducks in a row to have another US location when Indy is dropped?

 

I think the one that is closest to turn-key is Daytona in the Rolex 24 hour format, but that's essentially another Indy track. Flat in-field with banked ovals. However, there's more to do in the Daytona-Orlando-Tampa area than Indy. Plus a lot more hotels so you don't get as easily ripped off.

 

You guys have it wrong:

You could plant an F1 race on Wall Street in NYC, but if the folks that LIVE THERE are not F1-savvy - they won't be going.

To make my point, you could put the world's #1 and #2 ranked soccer clubs in a game in Boise, and nobody from Boise would go. (don't take 'nobody' literally, but you know what I mean).

Let me try this:

If tomorrow you said the Patriots and the Bears were going to play a game this Saturday in Boise or Billings, it would sell out in 2 days. Same goes if you said the Spurs and the Suns were going to play a game there, or the Red Sox and the Yankees.

If tomorrow you said a soccer game or F1 race was going to take place this Sunday in Billings or Boise, there is no way in hell it would sell out.

80% - or more - of the folks that go to an F1 race are current F1 'fans', I see very few newbies going - unless it's cheap or free tickets. Some do, of course, but nowhere near the majority.

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Yurrupeans don't give a hoot for our MLB, NBA, NFL, nascar, IRL, Canada's NHL (which they may, in fact, LIKE, since so many players in the NHL are from yurrup), so why should we expect americans to give a hoot about cricket, soccer or F1 ?

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Indy 2005 - Bridgestone did their homework, Michelin did not, they did not even test there, I'm glad as hell they didn't stick a chicane in - why penalize Bridgestone for doing their job, and letting Michelin in on a freebie ?

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The folks that live in and 'around' Indy have three major races to go to there - can they justify attending all three ?
Wasn't the 500 just 3 weeks ago ?
The Brickyard 400 is soon enough.
If you were a casual racing fan, which one or two would you go to, realistically ?

 

Bernie is running a business not a love fest. He wants more cash, can't blame him.

American F1 fans got bltch slapped in 05, all I remember on these boards was F'en this, F'en that, and they will never return. But back they went and Bernie must have secretly laughed his skinny, white, rich, old butt off. Sorta like when people complain because gas has gone up a bit and TV news crews interview them at the pumps, yet they say "well what are you going to do you need to drive". The boys at Exxon were giving each other high fives.

America doesn't embrace F1 because it is a class system. You either are a special talent or you need to be very wealthy to join. How many super licenses are issued compared to racing here in the states? Here people seem to need to "know the drivers". I never understood that, I watch the race and that's it. It's not like I'm going to break bread with the him. The Speed TV waste of airtime "meet the drivers' crap was nothing more than a script each driver babbles on about. Yes we love to race here fill in the blank, the fans are great here fill in the blank, blah blah blah. What are they going to say, Indy sucks donkey balls because there's nothing to do besides going to the big tree stumps or the giant stuffed bull?

 

Some friends and I had dinner @ Oceaniaire Saturday night in Indy.
5 minutes after we were seated, the table next to us was seated. It included Jean Todt and Massa. Half way through the meal, Bernie and Flavio came over and sat for at least 20 minutes. If I could figure out how to down load the pics from my camera phone, I'd post 'em (Why the F#ck did I not have my real camera!?!?!?)

One of my friends knows the guy who made Bernie his first $100 million or so (Credit Suisse guy, as is my friend).

He approached Bernie, introduced himself with the intro regarding their friend in common, and chatted for 5 minutes. (I shook his hand and said "hi").

Question: are we going to be back in Indy next year?
Answer: Well, they don't do much to promote it, do they?
Question: What about a Las Vegas race?
Answer: It makes for good conversation, but it will not happen.

fuel for more speculation....

 

See my above post....
I, for one, think that F1 would like a sexier venue than Indy, and I can't really argue about that... EXCEPT....
I had an incredible weekend. Thursday night, I met Scott Speed at a bar, chatted for 5-10 minutes. Sat next to the titans Sat night. Saw a few others on the streets.
Indy gives you ACCESS to these guys (if that turns you on). Vegas... (which probably will not happen), they would all be sequestered in the "high roller" areas of the 4 Seasons and other places where you probably will not bump into them. What is there... 10 great restaurants in Indy? Chances of seeing someone / meeting them is really pretty high... as I learned this weekend. BTW... got a pic of me and Jean Todt! now... just got to get it off my friends cell phone...

 

How old are you?

 

He's pretty old.......


The deal with Indy is THE TRACK or more specifically, the pits....

You'd have to clean sheet a new facility to do any better, and as the US dollar tanks it ain't gonna happen here.....

Let's put Nassua back on the calendar and get the Islanders to lay us some fresh asphault! LOL!

The ladies could pack light....


Or better yet CUBA!!!! ROTFLMAO!

We'll all have to sneak thru Mexico, it'll add spice to the trip........

 

Nothing to do in Indy?

They could take a side trip to the World's Biggest Ball of Twine (in Minnesota). Or they could go outside of town and watch the corn and soybeans grow.

Despite all this enchanting stuff to do near Indy, the weather is still lousy. You couldn't pay me to go there unless it was really a good crop year.

 

Just my worthless .02...

I went to the USGP and the 500 this past month. Next month I'll be at the ALMS and IRL race in Detroit. Racing is fun to be around no matter what the cars are if you really enjoy cars.

But F1 (at this point) is by far the most boring of the brands when it comes down to the racing itself. I personally prefer F1 to the rest because I love the technical capability of the vehicles. It doesn't matter what's going on, just seeing the absolute outer edge of what is capable on 4 wheels is exciting to me. This is why we blow 175k on cars for our garages.

But as Alonso said about reaching turn 1 on the first lap, "That was the key point. I thought whoever was second after that would finish second in the race." It doesn't matter how brilliant, how complex, how flashy a series is, the average fan could care less about a sport where the result of a 73 lap race is often decided at the first turn. Of course it's not always the case, but casual fans are only as interested as their last experience makes them. It doesn't matter that NASCAR turns left, you frequently find photo finishes, and cars running 4 wide within inches at 200mph (for the record I don't watch or follow NASCAR, but I respect the frenetic insanity of what they do). I'd cancel my NBA season tickets if it was largely a whoever scores first wins affair.

The Indy 500 this year was exciting because it was filled with drama of *gasp* who would actually win. I don't follow IRL that much, but I can certainly say the race itself was a dramatic and tense affair. The only drama at the USGP was whether Hamilton could hold it at turn 1 and continue his streak.

That in a nutshell is why I think average joe here really doesn't really care about F1. It's just far more esoteric than the other options. You don't get the nationalistic fervor over specific drivers, Ferrari isn't as revered across the land, the races often finish just as they start, etc. If the race leaves, nobody will really care. If it stays, same deal. I'll be bummed, but it would barely be a blip on the radar for most people, and I don't begrudge them for it.

 

P.S, downtown Indy is great. Surprisingly so. Great restaurants and bars, some great hotels, a good energy as a sporting town. My ex had briefly lived there in her youth and while we lived in London she always said Indy scarred her for life because it was so horrible. I was expecting a piss poor city but I've been more than happy to return several times.

 

I think there is a lot of blame to go around. I saw the Indy 500 banners and I thought what BS that they were still up. The Mayor of Indy was on TV this morning and he said that the City makes more off of Indy because people travel to Indy, stay in hotels, go to Restaurants and Bars and because they travel they are there for longer. He said the Indy 500 and NASCRAP races attract more locals and the City does not do as well. Couple that with (according to the Indianapolis Star ) the arrests are about 25% of what you get during the 500. HMMM - more money, less trouble -you would think they would want us. But as open wheel fans have found the Indy management are all inbreds and they put the one with the shallowest DNA pool in charge.

On the other hand despite the fact the the USA has a very strong market for the cars these manufacturers teams sell (well not Spyker... ) and they should have some impetus to stay, Bernie is just totally in it for the money. He has made it notoriously difficult for many of the "traditional" GPs such as UK, Spa, etc. He just does not think he needs us and he sabotaged Indy by putting the race on the weekend after Canada instead of the fall. The U.S. F1 fan is just stuck between the fire hydrant and the Dog

 

I think Vegas would be the best place by far, assuming they were to push some dirt around to make the track interesting (ie not flat).

So count my vote for Vegas.