Alonso's Swerve

I never said he was weakness free - but he was not the kind of driver that got ruffled up and was easy to trick or force into a mistake. Overall he was controlling and dominating on track and usually had everyone else eating from his palm. Maybe he learned the crashing technique from the overrated Senna?

The situation WAS reversed the following year and Alonso couldn't get by. I think he handles pressure very badly. A coupe of races ago he put the car off the track, what, four times? Just trying to keep up. Then he said the team was favoring Hamilton. This time he was going nuts over the radio to the team. Previously he accused the team of sabotaging his car and he's always good for an "f-you!" wave that's unnecessary and unprofessional whenever he passes someone who he feels held him up. I think Alonso is one of the most easily rattled top drivers on the track. I predict he will careen towards meltdown if he does not start beating Hamilton with regularity. His ego is too huge to accept that anyone else could be better. i think he will crack and probably leave McLaren before his contract is up.

Schumi wasnt a challenger of his 2 years ago. Last year he was, and thats when Alonso went boinkers - with accusations of team sabotage. I mean, come on, thats probably THE most ridiculous assertion I've ever heard any driver ever make - that the team is actively out to sabotage his car. And it wasn't a heat-of-the-moment thing. This came out hours if not days afterwards. I can only imagine what he's like in the heat of the moment. Crybaby comes to mind. And Ron's post about hearing his tirade over the radio proves it to be true.

Hamilton will win the WDC and the closer he gets to the WDC, and the further that Alonso slips back, just watch Fernando go into meltdown overload. Trust me - it'll happen. Heaven help us if he has a mechanical failure leading to a DNF vs. a win for Hamilton - then you'll see what I mean.

 

Liberal revisionist history has officially found it's way into F1.

If MS were any sort of a man he would have wanted to beat Rubens fair and square as opposed to accepting hollow victories. When Rubens was on, he was really on and MS should have dealt with it like a man. As for his retirement, all this chatter didn't start until Ferrari obtained an option on Kimi, and then MS had to really contend with competing with a younger, possibly faster teammate that wasn't going to accept sloppy seconds and could win the WDC in the same car as MS, raising doubts in whether MS was as dominant a driver as so many people believe him to be.

Last, for you to bring Senna into this discussion just goes to show how weak your arguments (and memory) are, especially to go so far as to compare a couple of brake checks by Fernando to MS crashing out his competitors for the WDC. Fernando may be showing some stress off the track but on the track he is still the consumate professional, even when he is not winning.

 

Hamilton had plenty to say after Monaco.

 

Overrated?!? Blasphemer

One thing Schumacher never learned from Senna was contrition.

Oh, and by the way, Senna's move was payback from Prost's move on him the year before. What was Schumacher's excuse?

 

Good post. As for the couple in here the call themselves senna this and senna that. Get over it ...It is very obvious that you both have been in search of that bornagain Senna and you think that you have found him in Alonso. Sorry but this guy is a whinner and will show it every race he cant win. Nitpicking.....far from it ....Nitpicking is when one has to look long and hard to find ones faults and believe me with Alonso one does not have to look long and hard. As for racing wheel to wheel with MS...Well we all saw how the tire rule burried the Ferraris 2 years ago so that was hardly a season that Alonso won fairly. In my opioion Bernie and his boys were trying to do anything they could to slow down the Ferrari onslot of wins but went too far in the one tire per race rule and gifted the season to Alonso. Last season Alonso had no pressure as he took a big lead early and it was only in the last half of the season that MS came back and if not for a puncture near the end.....well we all know the story. It is only now that Alonso faces any real pressure and he cant deal with it. He will not win the championship this season. If Ferrari get it together then Alonso may not see the podium much more.

 

Were you referring to Ralf?

 

Actually there was a slight difference from Monaco. Lewis was told by the team to hold station there and that's where his frustration came from. At Indy, Alonso got no such orders and was free to race. He just couldn't get the pass done. To be fair, I doubt Lewis could have made the pass at Monaco either had he been allowed to go for it. That track is just far too tight.

 

This will happen under only three conditions:

1) Lewis Hamilton is given the order to let Alonso win from now on.

2) Lewis Hamilton has the misfortune of not finishing a race.

3) Lewis Hamilton is not able to race for some unfortunate reason.

Unless one of the above occurs, Alonso's chances of winning another WDC in the near future are as great as Michael Schumacher's winning the WDC in 2007.


For anyone thinking that Alonso is not under pressure, how do you explain his off road excursions in Montreal? If the car was not performing, then after the second excursion, a calm two time WDC would have figured out to slow down at that corner.

 

There is a significant dif. between being upset, or even extremely upset and reaching 'breaking point' and for that matter, MS tantrums. Alonso's reaction is completely normal.

Hamilton's worst enemy will be the persona that the media
is very busily manufacturing.

This isn't to say that those who despise Alonso cannot enjoy
some good old fashioned schadenfreude, but equating it
to reality is stretching it.

 

Agreed back of the net with that

 

Well, lets see what happens when the title is directly at stake. I wouldn't be too sure that Alonso or any driver wouldn't go that little extra.

When has another driver has been in the position where he found himself in an on track duel with the driverstitle directly at stake? Senna?

When was the title decided in a clean overtaking manoeuvre in the last race of the season?

 

You need to put down your crack pipe. Where have you seen anyone suggest that Alonso is the next Senna? Certainly not from me.

All I have said is that Alonso is (at the moment) the best driver in F1. That is hardly likening him to Senna, the greatest F1 driver who ever lived. Guys like you have to make up lame excuses about Alonso being gifted a WDC because you can't handle the fact that this guy beat Schumacher on the track. You need to bring him down a notch by foolishly suggesting the guy is cracking under pressure and that he is a ticking time bomb waiting to explode. Anyone who has spent any time watching the 2005 and 2006 seasons know how ridiculous that characterization is. I wonder what you have been doing these last couple of years because it certainly appears you haven't been watching F1.

Get over it? Good advice. You should try it some time.

 

He is 10 points behind, for chrissake, with 10 races to go. You don't think Hamilton can have a DNF?!? One race and Alonso is back in the WDC lead.

Coming from someone who refuses to write off Massa's chances, even as he falls further and further behind, I am suprised that you are willing to write off Alonso now. He does know how to win a WDC, you know...

He is the only man in F1 today who can say that. Experience counts for something.

 

I disagree. have u forgotten Imola 2006? Schumi held Fred since the 1st round of pitstops. perhaps, u also might have forgotten Malaysia 1999.

 

that is a bold statement. And a false one. How quickly we forget, so let me refresh your apparent non existing memory: in 2006 the positions WERE reversed and Michael held Alonso off for the win and didn´t put a foot wrong.

So much for guarantees then.

from F1racing.net on the 2006 Imola GP:

 

again, not true. Senna commented on the move exactly one year later after winning the 1991 title at this track. The move was a reaction to Jean Marie Balestre how first, after the Japanese GP of 1989 personally obstructed Senna in going to the podium, since he was disqualified for cutting the chicane. Then, in 1990, he (Balestre) refused to put the pole position on the clean side of the track. That is were Senna vowed to himself that if Prost would catch the first corner ahead of him, they both wouldn´t finish. The rest is history.

The move however, was in no way payback for anything Prost did, it was a reaction to Balestre and the FIA.

Senna´s words, not mine.

Besides, I don´t see how this could be of any excuse, but in the end both Schumacher and Senna did it because they were after titles they felt belonged to them.

 

What Senna and Schumacher did was wrong. No doubt about that. Let's keep them out of this thread and focus on the subject: Alonso. He hasn't put a foot wrong so far. I think he's intelligent enough to prevent such a situation because I hope he knows that he will be burnt to the ground for any wrong moves. And not only by Tifosi (who don't even have an interest if he does a wrong move against Hamilton) but by the press as well. Especially the British.

The swerve only demonstrates once again that overtaking is almost impossible today. Take for example the moves Kimi - who was clearly faster -tried at the end against Massa. Which by the way seems to show that Ferrari no longer has a #1 driver policy or any team orders (usually it wasn't allowed for the Ferrari drivers to fight amongst eachother at the end of a race when there was no threat from behind).

Best, Peter

 

I still disagree. At Indy you have to make a choice in setup: grip in the infield and low drag on the straights. Cars can come close on the infield, but once on the straight, the car in front as no problem defending it´s position if and when it is setup for the straight. That could mean the the car behind is faster in laptimes, but still doesn´t manage to overtake. That has everything to do with the characteristic of the track and nothing with the car as such.

F1 has proven time and time again that overtaking will take place when the circumstances are there. We´ve seen Sato overtake Alonso for position, we´ve seen Heidfeld overtake Alonso for position, we´ve seen Massa screw up overtaking Hamilton, we´ve seen Alonso put the front of his McLaren right under the rear of Hamilton´s car without any mentionable signs of instability as a result of that.

 

Guys, we still haven't seen a wet race.

Alonso is a talented driver. If he can stop whining and start looking for a few extra tenths, this competition may be the best thing for his career. And Fred would be a lot easier to like, too. It's his tendency to toss blame around that reduces his fan base.

Hamilton is likeable so far, so it's easier to take him beating the red cars.

From what I've heard, Alonso is improving on the attitude front a little (although still prone to relapses). But I don't imagine Ron Dennis will tolerate many public tantrums without lowering the boom.

Besides: Ron does enough whining for the whole team.
Alonso just can't compete on that score.

 

McLaren (and BE) has a juggernaut on their hands in the form of LH (just look at the recent world wide viewing numbers for F1), and if they feel the kid has a real chance at the WC, you can kiss FA good-bye.

 

i agree with what u said about Senna and MS, Peter. both were world champions, both are legends. but both also had the same hunger and desire to win, they can't seem to settle for 2nd, and because of that, they did some rather silly things in their career.

for me, personally, both Senna and MS are the same. there's none better than another, whether Senna claimed it was a revenge or not. both are professionals and world class drivers, and due to this, both looked extremely silly with this antics.

however, i do disagree with u regarding overtaking in Indy is impossible. just have a look again at Fisi's race...

 

Yes, that was quite impressive. I'll agree. I even wonder if some drivers review these things and think: dang, I could have tried that move too!
So maybe I should give Massa more credit for defending his position but i'm afraid I would be called a fool on this board...

 

That was just a little check to see if you were awake

Senna wasn't overrated by most folks, I dont think

 

Wow, a lot of venom there against MS! MS did beat Rubens fair and square, almost every race. Rubens had plenty of wins over MS, but the reason *that* particular race was handed to MS was points reasons. The team certainly didn't tell MS to slow down and let Rubens win the following race, that was obviously MS's idea, so I think the facts do not at all support an idea that MS was in any way afraid of Rubens. About retirement - are you serious about it starting when Kimi came into the picture? Come on - talk about revisionist history. Jackie Stewart, Niki Lauda, Ecclestone, many of the team managers, Ralf, and TONS and TONS of F1 journos had been calling on MS to retire for 3-4 years before he did. And again, I think breaking virtually every record in F1, earning a BILLION dollars, being the most winning driver in the history of the sport, an international superstar, considered the best driver ever, etc, etc probably had something to do with MS feeling the job was done. Certainly a lot more to do with it than being afraid of Kimi. The idea that MS was scared of Kimi is just so out there that I have a hard time even thinking it's a serious suggestion.

Who said they were equivalent occurences? It was stated that MS put people out of the race and Alonso never acted like that - but Alonso has been penalized for the same kind of actions. And Alonso is the guy who falls apart when the going gets tough. Just wait and see - Alonso will melt down more and more as the season progresses.