Help - 308GT4 one bank down - new coils needed? | FerrariChat

Help - 308GT4 one bank down - new coils needed?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by geeforty, Jun 23, 2007.

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  1. geeforty

    geeforty Karting

    Oct 29, 2004
    67
    Bedfordshire
    Full Name:
    Nigel M
    #1 geeforty, Jun 23, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hope someone may be able to shed some light on this

    1974 308GT4 - Dual Distributor. Euro RHD.

    Started off as a slight misfire - suspected muck in carbs - found leak in inlet manifold. Carbs all cleaned / new gaskets etc.

    Found ignition leads resistance all over the place (including open circuit) - replaced.

    Can get one bank (rear) working if hold foot on accelerator, but front isn't firing - exhaust pipe from bank is cold.

    Dropped the coils down this afternoon, found the wiring to the ballast resistors (square blocks) hanging by a thread. The green terminal is OK, but the brown isn't. The other coil only has 1 wire going to the equivilent resistor. This seems correct according to the wiring diagram, but is it??

    Any suggestions on a suitable replacment coils if these are on the way out?

    I will redo the dodgy wiring tomorrow, and see what happens.

    Thanks

    Nigel.
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  2. Peter

    Peter F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 21, 2000
    6,441
    B.C., Canada
    If I remember correctly, the brown wire is your signal wire to the tachometer. It should only connect to one of the coils (typically the rear bank coil).

    You can check the condition of the coil by taking a volt meter, setting it to read in ohms and checking the resistance of both the primary circuit (across the two small, "+" and "-" terminals which should be 1.5 to 2 ohms) and secondary circuit (across the coil lead terminal and the "-" small terminal, which should read above 10,000 ohms). If either read zero ohms (full continuity), then the coil is junk. Check also the ballast resistor to see if that isn't your problem. It should read about 1.5 to 2 ohms.

    Any standard 12V coil will suffice if you need to replace.

    If both coils are okay, the resistors are okay, then trace back the wiring from the points to the coils to see if there isn't a broken connection, or a frayed wire. Check points too for excessive gap, or bad tungsten contact/condition.
     
  3. geeforty

    geeforty Karting

    Oct 29, 2004
    67
    Bedfordshire
    Full Name:
    Nigel M
    Hi Peter

    Thanks for the info regarding the wire colours. Will check it all through today after redoing the terminals, and checking the resistances.

    Do the bosch blue coils with the built in ballast resistance work OK in these cars? Just think might give a bit more spark.

    Although it seems there are blue coils and blue coils.....

    http://www.ratwell.com/technical/BlueCoil.html

    Thanks

    Nigel.
     
  4. Peter

    Peter F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 21, 2000
    6,441
    B.C., Canada
    From what I remember, they will work, but I believe you hook them up straight to the points. Since they have built-in additional resistance (> 3 ohms I think), you don't need the Marelli ballast resistors.

    There are 308 owners on here who are using/have used these Bosch Blue coils, so I hope they see this thread and jump in to positively confirm that set-up I just mentioned. I have just standard, off-the-shelf coils on my car.
     
  5. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
    Owner Project Master

    May 10, 2006
    17,940
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    John!
    Blue coils are fine, but you must bypass the resistor on the marelli coil. I used bosch red coils in mine which are more potent and are more of a plug and play deal. The resistors stay in place and no real rewiring is needed.

    A note on checking if a coil is ok. Just because the ohms on the primary and second read ok, that does not mean the coil is ok. They are old, and if you replace them you will feel a difference. They get tired like anything else.
     
  6. geeforty

    geeforty Karting

    Oct 29, 2004
    67
    Bedfordshire
    Full Name:
    Nigel M
    Thanks for that.

    I redid the wiring today. The terminals on the marelli resistors are a bit 'wobbly', so I tried fitting 2 bosch black coils I had ( 4 ohms, 11K) without using the resistor and starting much better on the bank that runs (rear), but still no joy on the front bank.

    I have removed both dizzy's and checked the operation of the points, the R2 switch is working, and the wiring to the coil. Shame you cannot swop the caps and leads from front to rear as the wiring is mirrored (or have I made the leads up wrong?)

    I will get a pair of the blue coils as they are easy to source.

    Next thing to try is to turn the dizzy by hand with the ignition on, and see if the plugs spark.

    Also am I right in thinking No 1 cylinder is rear bank timing belt end, and 5 is front bank Dizzy end?

    Thanks

    Nigel.
     
  7. Peter

    Peter F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 21, 2000
    6,441
    B.C., Canada
    Yes, that's the correct layout.
     
  8. Brian Harper

    Brian Harper F1 Rookie
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 17, 2006
    4,078
    San Jose area
    Full Name:
    Brian Harper
    Remeber to ground the dizzy if you remove it to turn it. No ground=no spark.
     
  9. geeforty

    geeforty Karting

    Oct 29, 2004
    67
    Bedfordshire
    Full Name:
    Nigel M
    * UPDATE *

    Thanks to everyone for their help so far.

    I have fitted 2 new bosch blue coils, and have checked the dizzy by rotating by hand = nice spark on all four in the correct sequence.

    Bit more persaverance and I had it idling of sorts at 1100 rpm with a tiny bit of throttle, but the front bank is still nearly cold, and the middle two carb throats were spitting unburnt petrol. I had it running for 3 or 4 minutes like this to try and 'dry out' the cylinders and plugs.#

    The engine was putting out lots of smoke - bluey grey, and now see that the carbs are leaking around their base gaskets quite badly.

    When I cleaned the carbs, I just took the all jets out and the needle screws and cleaned with carb cleaner. I wonder if I need to reseat / seal all the lead plugs. It is also damp with fuel around the air corrector jets - normal???
    New gaskets were used on the top cover and choke cover, and new solid bases and accelerator pumps and fuel filters. I checked the floats heights, and did NOT change the needle valve.

    We are getting there.... any more ideas
     
  10. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,408
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    I've been told the condensor replacement should occur at same time you do coils...seems sensible.

    I'd go there........
     
  11. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,408
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    New coil wires on both coils by matching up at the local vendor...
     
  12. geeforty

    geeforty Karting

    Oct 29, 2004
    67
    Bedfordshire
    Full Name:
    Nigel M

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