COUNTACH PRICES VS AUCTION SPECULATION | FerrariChat

COUNTACH PRICES VS AUCTION SPECULATION

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by blackdowndraft, Aug 29, 2007.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. blackdowndraft

    blackdowndraft Karting

    Jan 16, 2006
    62
    Palm Beach, New York
    Full Name:
    Arthur O'Brien
    Hello to all!

    I'm so happy to hear that Tony has pulled the trigger and bought a countach from Roy!

    Could not have happened to two nicer people. Well done and congradulations.

    Additionaly it is great to hear that Joe was able to lend a helping hand, again a great assett to the lamborghini community.

    I have had a chance to talk to both Joe and Roy on the phone and they could not have been nicer, and while I was in Monterey I met Tony in person, in short WOW what a nice guy.

    Now we get to the good stuff, numbers $$$$ and opinions!!!! O.K. start to throw the tomatoes...

    I have attended the Monterey weekend since I was 12 years old and I'm now 32. 20+ years and I guess at this point I guess it is safe to say I have a good pulse on the stuff that goes on out there.

    Also please take note that my past includes my fathers car collection that at one point included over 120 cars, all european sports cars except for maybe 6 corvetts, cobra, shelby's etc and about 20 packards, duesenburgs etc.

    Having said that I own some countachs one that ive owned since I was 23 years old a black on black downdraft, a second one of mine is a Series S1 with a periscope roof, I'm guessing one of maybe 6 or 8 cars with that feature.

    So here is the deal, among major collectors who have been in the game since the 1970's or longer Russo and Steele is a total disaster. They have a reputation for fake sales and creating instability in a otherwise good market.

    I feel bad that I allowed Joe, Tony, and Roy to share with me all the knowlage of these cars and in turn I should have warned of the Montery magic, RM - Gooding, or the Monterey witchcraft, Russo and Steele.

    On Sunday am before I went from my hotel/RM auctions to the Pebble Beach Concourse I was able to stop by the russo garage to try and buy some cars from disgruntled sellers, I have been succesful doing this on three occasions in the past and I stopped going to their actual auctions three years ago. Having done so here are my thoughts:

    I feel bad for Roy, he has made such efforts in this market and he deserves better. Had he taken his car to Gooding or RM he would have gotten 100 to 140k and not 88k. Second because both RM and Gooding are not Gypseys they would have advised him to have brought one countach not 3 or 4. Russo had few real buyers and by having several of the same type of car there it leads the two guys in the room who might have paid 100 - 140 to thinking, hey these are just used cars. It was really stupid of the auction to accept so many of the same car.

    On the other hand you take people that play with millions and not a 100k and all of the sudden they get board and say what the heck I'll loose 20 or 40k and move on. Thus you get an 120k car to go for 88k, does the market hurt, no not really.

    It teaches us all a lesson, get off the laptops go look at cars in person and buy them. That is the way its done.

    Do the numbers, same market, Roy gets 135k for one countach insteag of 160k for 2 cars. Roy keeps a car, which he then sells to Tony anyway down the road, albeit for more money, but Tony makes a sound investment in a guranteed investment. Oh in the mean time RM - Gooding do 100 million ++++ with the forbes 400 and Russo has clowns and victums as clients.

    My current best guess on th real market:

    LP400: ask joe, my guess 325 to 450

    Low roof cars: 80 -100 rough 100- 120 nice car 120 - 150 show WINNER

    Low roof with periscope: 150 rough 175 nice 195 show car

    QV DD: 70 - 90 rough 90 - 110 nice 110 - 135 show winner

    Again bottom line countachs are great and prices are up, Joe Tony and Roy are even better, and putting the market on Russo and Steele is far from a good idea.

    Regards,

    Arthur

    PS

    On Sunday AM in the Russo garage one associate of mine bought a Ferrari that no saled the night before, and a second friend of mine was on the phone to the sheriifs department and his lawyers because Russo said they sold three of his cars the night before but in fact only sold two. The interesting thing is though that the two that did sell where for a loss and the one that they said sold but actually didn't was at a huge profit number.

    PSS

    The miura SV sold by Gooding was a nice driver not a show winner and it is actually with a new owner and reached 870k

    The miura SV that Russo says they sold was not and it was offered to me for sale post auction, a better car also.
     
  2. EMILIO

    EMILIO F1 Veteran

    Feb 23, 2006
    6,854
    Italia
    your prices are almost correct IMO:

    i would say your DD and low roof CTs prices are a little low

    a periscope S car is worth more than a regular S (fact), but i would not pay 45k more for a periscope S over a flat roof one (just me, there could be some that probably would)

    a 78-79 is worth more than a later 80-81 low body withouth bravos (that is a fact)

    my 0.02


    now, could you post pics of your ultra rare periscope roof S1? VIN?
    eveybody are waiting for these since months ;)
     
  3. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,981
    I can`t agree more with Arthur! I see the market for everything Italian getting nuts now! The result one silly guy pays for the ex-McQueen Ferrari Lusso is not from this universe! Same with Lamborghini: as much as I like it that the Bull-cars are getting more expensive -and they deserve this!- I find almost 1.0 million $$`s for an SV a "little" GaGa. Same with the LP 400`s! For me both cars are currently overvalued - but OK, the market talks, b***s*** walks! But its becoming a hype now! Just my 2 Cents!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  4. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Right on the money Arthur! What I have been saying, but then some of us have been around the cars 20 years.... as for consigning cars with Rob & Steal (errr, I mean Russo & Steele), I coulda warned ya. The result for the Periscopa they had was good for the seller (I congratulate him) but is nothing to do with the real value for that car, no more than you can convince me that every Lusso is worth $2 million, but sometimes crazy stuff happens at auctions...

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     
  5. Tony Ierardi

    Tony Ierardi Formula Junior

    May 30, 2004
    886
    Naples, FL
    Arthur,

    Great meeting you as well.

    Roy won First Place in class with #1121036 and I paid $160K for it.

    If a Periscope Roof S was in the same condition I would say $180K right now today.

    I hope they all go up in the future, but I am realistic about their value today.

    They have gone up considerably in the past 5 years...so we will see what happens next.

    Tony
     
  6. Anderson

    Anderson Karting

    Nov 6, 2004
    51
    Colorado
    Full Name:
    David Anderson
    I wonder how many LP400S "Series 1" cars with a periscope roof started life as an LP400 and were "converted" to LP400S cars in the late 1970s. Some such conversions were done correctly and thoroughly by the factory, while other cars were partially or totally coverted by other shops, both in and out of Italy. The total number of converted cars (i.e., LP400 going to an LP400S or a quasi-LP400S) is far more than a couple of handfulls.

    David
     
  7. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    25 LP400 (of the original 157) were re-manufactured into LP400S by the factory. We estimate that a further 25 were converted by privateer shops worldwide, but some of these have already been returned to LP400 spec.

    Joe
    www.joesackey.com
     

Share This Page