Has anyone tried this? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3ASS%3AUS%3A1&viewitem=&item=150123975083 If so, what were the results? Thanks
I got something like that for my Mondial (not sure if it is the same seller or product; looks a little different). The ones I got DO work. Not as fast as a regular car, but a definite improvement. I got mine from this guy: [email protected]
Yeah, Frazer is the guy. Lots of happy FChat folks who've installed his relay boxes, including me on my 308QV. Made a BIG difference, and is MUCH easier than redoing cables and gears. His website is www.FerrariWindows.com
I purchased a pair from eBay for my Mondial. I won't know how it works until the car is delivered to me. That was before I found the ferrariwindow.com site. I imagine they're both the same thing, but since others have had success with Ferrariwindow.com, I'd probably go with the known vendor. Bob
RICAMBIAmerica also carries them -- check out their online PDF manual to install = easy http://www.ricambiamerica.com/product_info.php?cPath=24_767&products_id=262540
I just finished inspecting and lubricating my window rollers, cables etc. I found several rollers stuck or dragging and one where the cable had come off the roller and the window still worked !, the window did have excess lateral movement though(felt loose when fully up), so I'm glad I found the problem and fixed it. I'm just mentioning that the rollers should be lubricated while you're in there. Dragging rollers will slow down the windows. The proper tension on the wire is important too. I found the best way to adjust the tension is at the top and bottom window positions, the cable should be just tight enough to prevent the cable from coming off of the rollers.(cable is loosest at top and bottom). My windows take about 6-7 seconds (up or dn) WITHOUT the "box". I do have the Birdman style fuseblocks though.
I bought the modules from blazerfrazer. They were a great investment. Highly recommend them. They were a pain the install because of all the work getting the door panels off and back on. If it wasn't for that it would have been a quick job.
Thanks for the replies. Because of price, I'm going to give the ones on Ebay by Mera a try. I have heard a lot of good things about his products over the years, and have been told he is very reputable and stands behind his products...I'll give a report after I get them installed. Darolls ps.I wonder if they'll help my Rolls Royce passenger windows too. they're slower than the Ferraris!
I've fixed all the windows on my '85 cab in a similar way. Save some $ and buy 4 DPDT relays from some parts place like Digikey. I'll see if I can lookup the part # if anyone is interested. The key is a *new* wire pair - ground and 12v (fused of course) to each window. This is the hardest part, but doable even for the rear windows. Wire the new power leads and existing leads to the relay, and relay to the window motor. Now, all the switch does is flip the relay (the switch is a power "bottleneck" as well as gnd) and the windows run up/down like new. I'll be happy to post a vid. The rear window wiring is accessed thought the "cheese graters " on the outside, the fronts the inside door skin. It is possible to fish the new wires through the existing flex door-conduit. Use heavy gauge stranded wire for current and flexibility, some of that fancy speaker wire works well. The schematic is simple and I think been posted before, if you like I'll draw it up. - Frank '85 Euro-Cab EFI http://www.employees.org/~fty
It is my understanding that the Frazer guy invented the little relay boxes that go in the doors for his 348, then began marketing them. This Mera guy is building his own version. They are very simple inside, just a pair of relays that switch the appropriate wire to a local ground rather than sending it back to the switch. It adds a volt or so across the motor and seems to make a difference in speed, though the windows still will not be what we consider fast. I built a pair for the Mondial but I haven't put them in yet. I briefly considered marketing my own version of these but decided that it just wasn't nice to step on another guy's toes and "steal" his product idea. I know it's done all the time in business, but I'm just not that kind of guy. If I were buying a pair, I would buy them from the guy that invented them. Just my $.02. Birdman
If you think they'll help, fine! The idea has been out there for many years .. My $0.02 is that the *key* to a real fix is running a decent power and ground to the motor, which is obviously more difficult. It's a different circuit/solution and takes the current out of the switch path. - Frank
Okay, I ran down to the car and shot these cheesy Palm Treo videos of the windows. One is modified, the other not. The car wasn't running and you'll see that there isn't enough voltage to even raise the passenger window no less do it at any decent rate. The reason that I have a window that isn't modified is that I burned up most the original relays - they were too small, current handing wise. For the original implementation I used whatever was in my junk box and have since bought new relays with adequate current handling and have replaced 3 of the 4. When the engine is running the driver window goes up even faster. - Frank Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Yes I tried them on my 1985 308QV and they suck. So I would not get them. I am going to try the ferrariwindows guy though.
please elaborate great videos of b4nafter.....but I agree. I don't believe the relay approach is a long term or even a sound short term solution. Will probably burn them up or over current something....seems like your statement to just create a viable load to the motor and have also a limiter to prevent too much current is better.
Do not overlook how much it helps to clean the switches with contact cleaner. I was amazed at what a difference that made. You don't realize how much resistance you can get with oxidized contacts in the window switches until you clean them!
I have checked my sales and have not found I have sold these to you. Can you veify that you bought them from me? Also let us know why you say they suck. Others have asked you to explain this and you have not. Why? Rodney Dickman 1990 348 TS
I built a set for my own car, but I only used one relay per side. The windows went down pretty fast already, it really only needed an assist going up, hence only one relay required per window. It works better now, but it's still slow compared to my other cars. Eventually I may add a second relay to pull the (+) up to a full 12 volts for going UP. Just my 2-bits worth. Thor
Hi, I'm having troubles with my Mondial Cab rear window. I have my drivers side stuck in the down position. When I turn the key to on and hit the window switch I do hear a clicking in the body cavity, but no movement. I know to leave that alone as it may burn the motor. I've got my strakes and cheese graters? off and I am trying to work some lube down into the rails and mechanism but its nearly impossible to do with the darn glass in the way. What can I do to raise the glass so I can get to the mechanism, motor, wires etc.? My passenger side rear is working o.k., just slow. All the windows are slow, so I have taken apart my doors also to clean and lube up all the pulleys/rails/cables. I haven't put it back together yet to see if any improvement. I still have all the switches out and want to clean the contacts in those also. How do you take the switches apart? It looks like the plastic halves are held together with a spot melt at the plastic post on the side...need to be careful with those babies. Thanks for any tips you may have.
have a look to make sure that the window cables have not overlapped them selves, this will bring the window to a halt. On my car i needed to remove the worm gear assy. in the window cable gear box, it had grease which had become like a wax/plastic from non use. cleaned up, new grease, works like new.
Sorry for the delay, I've been absolutely swamped. Several have emailed about details here's the info: The relays I used are Omron G4W-2214P-US-HP DPDT rated at 15 amp. I don't remember if I ordered them from mouser or digikey. You should be able to plug that part # into google. I did not use any diodes. The circuit is simple (2 relays per window) that mirror the operation of the switch. I ran power direct to the battery and have a single 30amp fuse for the full circuit - all 4 windows. The rear wiring was the most difficult, fishing it into the cavity behind the "cheese graters" from underneath the car. I ran both power and ground and use the ground for the circuit as well as the door frames. Attached is a cheesy hand-drawn schematic. The relays do NOT have spade connectors on them, you will need to do some soldering. cheers, - Frank Image Unavailable, Please Login
Did you also clean the window assembly? Or just add the relays? I guess if I have to open up the door to fix this problem then I will go ahead and clean everything... Aaron
IMHO the relay idea is working around the problems instead of solving them. All the relays appear to be doing is finding a different ground path instead of using the intended one. We should all be smart enough to realise you you dont get something for nothing. So instead of servicing a 30 year old system and correcting an inherent fault, just slap in some relays and rock on? I see this the same as the guy putting MSD on a points car instead of replacing wires, plugs and extensions. Of course the engine will run better, but you havnt fixed anything. The original ground, at least on my early cars is through the door hinges. The ground off the switches is terminaled inside the door frame. This leaves only the door hinges to carry current back to the negative battery terminal. They probably worked great when the cars were new, but age and environmental exposure has taken its toll. Then the cable rollers, who's grease has long since dried up and been ground away, slowed to a permanant stop and now force the cable to endlessly slide over them, dragging the system down further. Now pull power through crummy 30 year old Bosche fuses and oxidised switch contacts and youll see why they wont run. Simply upping the votage by finding a new ground path via a relay is not the correct repair IMO. It might be an "upgrade" once the other issues are resolved, but its not the fix. I also disagree the waxy grease in the motor drive is a big issue, its a worm gear with like 100:1 gear reduction. If the rest of the system is up to snuff they seem to work quite well. I can now raise either window in about 4 seconds, give or take, both sides, even with that icky grease. I also removed the jumper leads between the motor and switch, as I seen no reason for extra wire and doubling of connections, and the wires reach just fine. The way I see the proper fix, is either to install a bonding strap from the door to the chassis, or physically run a dedicated ground cable through the wire cluster from the chassis into the door through the grommets so it looks fully stock. So, get Birdman's or something else, but definetly get those crummy bosch fuses out of there, clean the switch contacts, lubricate the rollers, and fix the ground. And while your in there adjust the cable tension and check the window alignment. I pulled the motors out and played with all the tangled up cable routing and I dont think you have too. Dont pull the motors until you have everything else accomplished. They will probably work just fine.
