Issues with mileage 308s

Hi,

I am currently looking for a Mondial or GT4. Two that I am considering have high mileage, approx 100K miles. I have received different feed back from other users, groups and mechanics: some say to stay away and others to go for it.

Per what I have seen in posts in this , there are are a few Ferraries with over 100K with no trouble and others with 30K with rebuilt engines.

My basic mechanic skills are to do my own work without taking the engine out, even replacing the clutch. All in my home garage. I have no trouble in replacing seals and belts, but I can not rebuild an engine or transmission.

What are daily drivers seeing in terms of wear of these vehicles? Only high oil consumption? Or other more serious issues of internal knocking of the engine? Replace bearings in the transmission?

Thanks,


Richard

 

My 84 has 100K. Not a single problem.

There is nothing special about these cars that will make them explode at 100K.

 

IMHO the cars are built just as well as any Mercedes, maybe better. The gearbox has gears and shafts larger than a 1 ton domestic truck so is super strong, possibly capable of nearly 1000 HP according to people like Norwood. So the main issues are syncros and shift adjustments, but no real wear issues unless exceedinly high miles, probably in excess of 500K?

The engine. The crank is almost indistructable as long as its not ran out of oil. The whole botom end is very strong, and doubtful if taken care of with good oil and not overheated or beat on to much it could last many hunderds of thousands of miles. The heads have a hard time getting past 100K, the valves just work to hard at the normal engine speeds encountered. The rest of the car is pretty standard fare, as good as anything. Same brakes as used by MB, Porsche, etc.. same types suspension, drive axles are huge and almost unbreakable.

But even if taken care and flawlessly maintained, time is the enemy. IMHO I think these engine should come apart from time to time, at least pop the heads and split the gearbox from the block every decade or two. And mileage is so over rated. Between pulling the fuse, disconnecting the speed sender, or failures, its probably amazing any of the cars have recorded 50K miles, while potentially travleing 4 times that distance! They are good cars, but many have far far far more miles than they indicate, regardless of the 4 inch stack of invoices signed by the Pope. And they make the cars look bad by looking so beat and worn with such low "indicated" mileage.

So to answer your question, I would give far more interest to a high mileage 20 plus year old car with recent heavy service, than to any garage queen with low miles. Its all about condition, just like real estate, and there are NO CHEAP FERRARI'S. Its "buyer beware" on a scale of unprecedented scale not seen since the used car days of the 1940's. So if it looks to good to be true, RUN!

 

101,000 on my 328, with the last 48,000 put on by me since Oct 02. No problems. Motor's never been apart, still runs fine and pulled stock dyno numbers at 80,000 miles. Previous owner refurbed the suspension bushings in 01. From what I see in the service records, the clutch is still original. Amusingly, service records also show that the AC failed every summer from new until I finally gave up on it in 05

 

Have a friend with a 145k mile 328. Platinum award winner and the strongest running 328 I have ever seen! Heads never off. Just well maintained and driven.

 

I bought mine with an indicated 80k 21 years ago! It runs like a champ & i pound on it, I think these cars are like a good airplane. Hangar queens fall out of the sky, the million hour planes fly every day like clockwork.
I'de me more afraid of a 1k odometer.

 

Agreed, if the cars are well looked after, surely the mileage is not the issue. I have bought many cars in my years and driven some high mileage cars that felt like new. I have always believed that cars that have high mileage from motorway cruising can be better than a low mielage commuter. Just make sure you know the history etc

 

Do a detailed PPI and if it checks out, you should be fine and you'll save some money - in the TR section, a guy just bought a clean, serviced 70K mile TR for $35K.

 

I recently took my mother to our local Niello Maserati dealership to look at a Qporte. They had an '89 328 GTS with 1100 miles on it that they sold for $75k. It still had the original tires on it. I inquired about the service history the car had received over it's 18 years of existence but the salesperson was unsure of it's maintenance or did not want to disclose it. Beautiful car but lot's of money on top of the $75 k purchase price to insure it is in the proper condition to drive.

Dan

 

Like any HP car I would consider your knowledge and experience with them...what to listen to and look for when driving, etc. The more you know the better . I just sold a 200K plus 944 with it's original motor and it ran like it had 20K. The best 944's I have owned were driven and not stored. Used them all as daily drivers. Now I am moving into a 308QV. I will aproach it the same way and keep it healthy with a few runs a week. Just look at it this way; If it were a plane you would inspect it before every flight. The mileage on the car is not the deciding factor when I am looking. The overall condition/wear is.

 

Hw do you know? I can understand not _wanting_ to rebuild an engine, but anyway...

I have a GT4 that shows 91k on the odometer, so it probably has well over 100k on it. But it did have an engine rebuild at 80k by the PO, so I can't really comment on a high mileage engine issues. My engine was rebuilt because it couldn't pass smog, so I don't know if it was an oil consumption issue or not. These are old cars now, even the Mondials. They will need constant replacement of little things - hoses, fuel lines, brake lines, weatherstripping, oil lines, seals, switches, plugs, wires, points, suspension bushings, steering rack bushings, master cylinder, etc, etc.

I would be wary of any 20+ year old car without adequate mileage. Is the car really that bad that the owners haven't driven it?
My dad bought a used Maserati Biturbo 15 years ago that had low mileage on it. You know why it had low mileage? Because it was crap and every owner was afraid to drive it far from home or at night.

 

Brian,

My mother also, as your father did, purchased a Maserati Biturbo spyder new in '87. It was an 85 or 86 if I remember correctly. What a piece of s**t that car was. It was a carbed car and my mother drove it like a grandma. That car was always in for repairs partially due to her driving style. She finally got sick of it and sold it. Bought a Lexus but is now looking at jumping back into the Maserati market and buying a new Qporte.

Dan

 

I think a person should be very careful to consider what people say about particular cars. I knew two different guys who worked on more than a few Biturbos many years ago. They both claimed it was a very well made car, although rather complex. They claimed virtually all thier work involved fixing things other mechanics effed up. I feel the Ferrari is in the same category. Ask the guys with questionable reputations, and the cars are unreliable crap always needing repairs. Ask the better mechanics or DIY owners, and most say entirely the opposite, and in some cases that they have been some of the most reliable cars they even owned. It cant be both ways.

 

Artvonne,

By no means was I trying to bash Maserati. It was a beautiful car and when running correctly it was fun to drive. It was always serviced at our local Ferrari/Maserati dealer. My mother was told that the carbed cars presented more problems than the fuel injected later models. She pondered upgrading to the fuel injected model Biturbo spyder but instead opted for the lexus. Maybe she just got one of the few bad ones.

Dan

 

My 81 GTSi is at 76,000 and is running great.

Jeff

 

I am. And this particular low-mileage carburated Biturbo was a dud. Now it was used and who knows its history, but it had a wide variety of maladies. And I've read that the later FI cars were actually quite good. Even with its problems it was a kick to drive. Turbo lag is bad mid-corner, but in a straight line the shove at 3500 rpm was waaay cool. There are anaomolies from every car manufacturer. I'm sure that there's a 200k mile Yugo out there somewhere chugging away. But most aren't.

Actually, it can. DIY owners don't have issues with little ignition tune-ups, rattles, broken switches, or whatever. An hour here or there and problems are solved. Sometimes it takes a trip to the forum here for help, but these little things are no big deal. For the non-DIY each of these is a visit to the mechanic for what can be an expensive fix or else you just live with it and the car exudes the feeling of junkiness. And all of those little things start adding up until the whole car feels like it will fall apart. And then it's a slippery slope where it feels like junk so putting money into it to fix it feels like wasted money and more things go unfixed....

I have a friend who had an Audi she hated. It was always having problems, she said. It always needed something, needed new wipers, new tires, kept running out of gas, etc, etc.
WAIT. Running out of gas? Yes, she says. It didn't have a light to warn when the tank is almost empty. She will tell you that the Audi stranded her several times and the car was a POS. Perhaps the next owner had better "luck."