Advice for my first track day

I suppose if the track has massive run-offs, it's a clear choice...

 

Martin, I went to my first day with a small box of supplies, including window cleaning fluid, towel, drinking water, etc. I thought I was well prepared. At the track, I was shocked to see other guys with extra tires, brake pads, jacks, tire pumps, tools, and even trailers with track cars. What an amateur I was!

The track day was divided into several run groups of people with difference levels of experience. Each run group got about 5 sessions spread throughout the day. Novice drivers got brief classroom instruction and perhaps an instructor to ride in the car. To me, the in-car instruction was inadequate. Some other novice drivers crashed.

I had memorized Laguna Seca by watching YouTube videos, but my driving was still bad on the first day. The second day was much better. My line got better and my confidence was improved to where I could slide the car a little. See my YouTube video:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=I8UR4yaLcEU

That's a 1:55 lap. I'd be quite happy with that time as a novice if the Civic in front of me didn't pull away and disappear! It's all in the video.

My car had stock fluid and pads. I babied it by shifting at 7000 and not braking too hard, so there was no brake fade and not much wear after a few track days. The F1 transmission was great, particularly when downshifting. I sat in a manual 360 at the track and tried the clutch. It felt like a leg press.

As for flying, I flew basic aerobatics and had some experience in the German made Extra 200. Flying is great fun too, but I can't say whether it is more fun than tracking.

 

Thanks Peter. The helpful advice I got from this thread made my experience more enjoyable and safer. The few days I've had got me hooked. I'm already dreaming about getting a race car. Humm, how much is 360 Challenge to buy and run ...

 

Cool video. You are very smooth. 1min55secs isn't too bad at all. Remember Jeremy Clarkson got 1min59secs in the latest NSX on Top Gear so you are not going slow. Each second from here though gets harder and harder to find haha that is the joy and frustration of track driving.

Were those runs with TC/VSC/ASR (whatever the hell is it called!!) on??

 

Jeremy Clarkson drives fast cars all day, so he can't really be that bad??? I wonder if he was just acting dumb to make the show more fun to watch.

My car had Sport on and ASR on, but I'm tempted to turn off ASR at the Andretti hairpin and try to slide

 

Driving cars fast and driving quickly around a track are two very, very different things.

 

Hi Jack,

nice video. You don't need to hesitate when using the brakes actually. Try to push the pedal to the point where the ABS just doesn't come in. But when you do that for a certain time, you most probably will get fading, hot brake fluid – but at least very strong wear of the street brake pads. The race pads also feel much better. So that's a thing you really want to do sooner or later and it's easy and cheap too. Changing the pads or else at the racetrack is not really my thing. My race pads at the Porsche were always good for 2 to 4 track days (discs also).

Another thing you probably know anyway is to lower the tyre preassure significantly before driving on the track. The tyres get hot after a while, the air expands and you suddenly have "balloon tyres" – I forgot it once and thought I couldn't drive anymore...

After a while you will see how the rest of the car behaves, that's what I meant in my last post. A friend of mine had the idea to buy a Viper GTS this spring, just for fun. We bought a nice like new example and put in new brakes (8000 Euro) at once because the Viper's are not even good for use on the Autobahn. Unfortunately the differential is not good for the track either. After the second or so time we had a loud whisteling noise coming from it. They only change it in one piece so another 4000 Euro. There were some other issues like "unknown" engine problems etc., the list is endless. That's what I meant when asking of problems...

Flying: I am working on a helicopter PPL at the moment on a Robinson R22. When I have been in SF this spring I even tried to get an appointment at Golden Gate Helicopter (San Carlos Airport), but they didn't have time. Perhaps I can charter a R22 there after I have made my PPL. Flying in the Bay Area could be fun...

Best regards,

Martin

 

Best advice I have heard so far!

 

Miata, because if I total it, it MIGHT cost me 15K to just leave it there and got get another one. I race Formula Mazdas so i'm not sure about this, but I bet a spec Miata would beat my 430 around most tracks (that don't have long straights).

 

So, I am considering getting on the track. I have wanted to go for a long time, but there was no time. Things are looking up in the near future time wise.

Question #1: for professional instruction, where should I start? I am willing to travel to Bob Bondurant, is that a waste? Should I try to find something closer in NC of Va?

Question #2: if there is a great deal on a '95 M3 ($9,000, never tracked) is this a good car with which to start?

 

Hi sainthoo,

good decision to do some track days, this Friday I will be in Hockenheim once again...

I don't know about driving schools or such in the USA but I generally can generally recommendate the Porsche driving school. This will probably be available in the States too and they are pretty competent - you don't have to go there with a Porsche by the way. Just ask your closest Porsche dealer, they will know.

If you consider buying a car for trackdays a standard street car won't do it. These cars are not suited for track use, even not for track days. Only just for the first couple of times when you go pretty slow (so perhaps the M3 even is an option fo you right now). The problem are mostly the brakes which can't stand track use because they are too small and the car too heavy - with the M3 if you go fast, expect to wear down the pads in a couple of laps (even "carbo pads" and such), the discs will do a bit longer. The M3's brakes are absolutely nothing for track use. Next thing are seats and such - if you don't sit properly there's no way to drive properly.

A good car for track days is every type of RS or GT3 Porsche (even the older ones), Porsche 968 CS (clubsport) should be okay to, especially with the large brakes. Lotus Elise and such is not all too fast but should be okay too as well as Challenge Stradale, Scuderia from Ferrari or Lamborghini's Superleggera. The most important thing is that the car is suitable on the track, that it works at it's personal race speed.

Don't trust the advertising (BMW's motorsports blabla...). Now you know what type of car to look for...

Regards, Martin

 

Christian, I just spent the last two days teaching people at Virginia International Raceway, a 3.27-mile, seventeen turn track considered one of the finest in the US and comparable to places like Spa and la Sarthe. It's not much more than an hour away from you and I guarantee if you go there, you'll be hooked!

Your BEST bet is to sign up for Skip Barber High Performance Driving or Three-Day Racing School RIGHT NOW. The August school I think is full although I'd call, and there may be another in October. If you can't make those, travel to Road Atlanta, but go to the BEST professional school you can right off the bat. It will save you a lot of time, money and frustration in the long run. The Porsche Driving Experience, mentioned by my German colleague, is located at Barber Motorsports Park in Birmingham, Alabama. It is a very good program, but I recommend Skip Barber for the depth of the instructor knowledge, the best"building block" skill set and the shortest learning curve due to the tried and true curriculum.

While I agree that once you're quick and relatively experienced, the "modified street car thing" is not the best way (I run purpose-built competition cars at track days), I think that when you start out and AFTER taking the pro school, an E36 M3 that has passed a rigorous pre-purchase inspection by Billy Revis (Motorsport Connections in W-S) would be a good starter car. This will allow you to do the marque club and other low-key drivers education events that happen five to eight times a month at VIR.

The local Tarheel Chapter BMWCCA has a great drivers ed program. Also, check out TrackDaze and Tarheel Sports Car Club. Take a look at nceuro forum for more information on local groups.

Good luck and enjoy the ride.

 

Peter

Thank You!

I just finished the Skip Barber 3 day racing school. Your comments were spot on. The instructors were professional, courteous, and a wealth of experience and knowledge. I cannot imagine what someone can do that is more fun. I learned a ton, and I was going way faster than I thought possible by day 3. Sad thing, I could still learn so much more. I am already trying to figure out how to get back for advanced instruction. For now I am eagerly anticipating my lap session video.

I chose the MX-5 school; I convinced my 68yo dad to join me, and I thought the Mazda would be a better fit at 6'4" and an easier car to get in and out. Turns out that was not quite right, but very glad for my choice. ABS and synchroed gear box were much appreciated. It was great seeing my dad out there, especially since he kept telling me about the Lotus 7 he had and actually raced once. Even better seeing him after a couple passes....

While the school is not cheap, I think it is a remarkeable value for what is provided.

Thank you again for the recommendation!

 

I'm so glad for you. Your lead, Jason Holehouse, is the CI for SBRS's Northeastern Region and is extraordinarily talented. I watched him when he raced Pro Formula Atlantic back in the day and he ran me through the drill at SBRS Instructor Training when I got my stripes there. Ryan and Sean are terrific, too. Great team!

That's the idea!

Christian, not a sad thing. Just the beginning of a great and healthy addiction! Sort of like peeling back the skin of an onion or aging trees from the growth rings... It never stops being a quest for more, better and faster...

Most people get just a few shots to learn how to do this incredibly challenging task properly. It's an investment that will pay off your entire high performance driving career.

I'm sure I'll see you out sometime and of course, there are many track days available at VIR. I'm starting up again February 7th and 8th with a client at the Tarheel Sports Car Club event. Perhaps I'll see you at another SBRS event.

Glad you enjoyed it and welcome to the club!

 

As the fuel burns off and the rookie driver gets better, the balance of the car will change.

 

Put nitrogen in your tires, check the brakes before every hard turn and keep it out of the walls and sand

 

All of the above posts, and... watch different YouTube videos of track day events and racing at the raceway where you intend to go racing. This way, you are more familiar with different styles, cars, turns, and techniques, track worker signals, entrance area, pit area, driver signals, gloves, helmets, and knowledge of the actual track itself from a driver's perspective before driving on it yourself.

 

Heres a Garage 419 vid that should be quite use full.

http://www.garage419.com/episode/419_20081023