I vote this as the most ridiculous thread of 2008 thus far. It sounds to me like an awful lot of folks who clearly have never been on the race track are trying to come up with the most ridiculous excuses why Massa was not at fault in that incident. He was 1,000% at fault in that incident, his pass was not only optimistic, it was completely stupid. It was DC's corner and DC took it, it is incumbent on Massa to make a safe pass, not on DC to give way. Anyone who has ever driven a car on the track would know that. There are some ridiculously uninformed opinions in this thread. Massa's race was the single most disgraceful drive by a Ferrari driver in the last 20 years. Period. If ever you needed proof why he needs to be fired-and fired immediately-this race is it. Truly a pathetic performance.
The Ferrari engine has serious problems. They race again in one week. If they don't get those problems fixed, they run the risk of being a laughingstock of the field. Hopefully, they'll get the problem fixed. Looks like everyone did their homework, but Ferrari got caught playing hookey. They've got a couple of weeks to get this corrected, and I hope they do. Remember, last year didn't start well either. Art
He did a similar move on Kubica, but DC is simply suicidal so - I would say your argument is 1,000% + 3x B(ia)S. Not to mention that the 3xGod complex that gives you a clear insight into whether others have been on a race track doesn't help. You're just pissed bks DC destroyed his car and Massa went on his merry way, not to mention your fav Kimi bagged it also. Chuckle. Clearly Cucu!!! What's pathetic is bashing some members of the team for the poor results. I thought you were a dedicated F guy, you know - the kind that stands with the team through the good and the bad. If you're more than just a cherry picker, start supporting the entire team, through good and bad.
I've always wondered why Massa is so overrated...and who does the "overrating". Now I know. However there is no use trying to bash Massa...because anyone can see how this will end. He will NEVER win a World Championship. He WILL win the odd race here and there. He WILL retire with a whole bunch of money. Good for him....better than me. When Raikkonen decides to blow your doors away, God help you because he will. When Massa tries to do the same....well, he has to be on pole to do that, for one. Have you ever seen how he handles lapped traffic when he is in the lead? But for the grace of God passeth he. I got tired of holding my breath and stepping on imaginary brakes on his behalf. The dude is seriously clumsy at the wheel for an F1 driver, but unfortunately he is very cuddly and gets away with murder. He is constantly sawing away at the wheel....he plunges into the corner and in a blurry of arms and elbows he tries to sort his car out. Ferrari needs to have some serious meetings and decide how to go forward , because without TC and BMW baying for blood, Massa needs help.
Apparently you never watched Michael Schumacher when he had a bad day. Wasn't it Senna that intentionally drove into another car to prevent that driver from winning the WDC? Schumacher and Senna had few much worse days than either Massa or Raikkonen today. Actually, I would give Kimi the vote for the worse of the two today. First, you weren't here, you have NO idea how either car was handling, who in the pits made bad decisions, like the one where Kimi was not brought in when his tires even on TV looked ragged, or how the Massa/DC accident really went down. Second, you are watching on TV, you are not at that corner. Of course you might be correct about that accident, but there is no way on a one dimensional TV you can really understand what happened. Major point: Massa was not penalized by the officials for this accident. You are continuing with your arrogant opinion. It is your opinion, wrong as usual I must admit, and certainly not fact. ;}
In Ferraris defense, I think it was only 2 cars running Ferrari engines that had problems. I believe 2 crashed out and 2 others were not engine failures, although I could be mistaken. It was also 100+ degrees out there... not of course Ferrari needs to make their engines last no matter what, but I am not sure it's indicative of major problems with Ferrari F1 engines. EDIT: I take it back - 3 engine failures and 2 crashed at the beginning which very well may have blossomed into engine failures had they been allowed to try running the distance. Does not bode well for Ferrari.... but... when was the engine freeze? Aren't these the same engines Ferrari were running all last year? What could have changed (legally) to have them blowing up now, other than a manufacturing or assembly issue? It can't be a design problem, surely? There is going to be several very hot races to come.... they better fix it, stat!
Agree with you completely - however, if Massa sucks without TC (which I think he does - not just based on this race but based on testing too), then I don't know how long he is going to last in that seat. Luca talks a good game - that he's OK after this race etc etc but anyone who knows anything about the man also knows he likely did some serious ranting and raving after this race, much of it directed at the engineers who let Kimis car have a problem, and the rest of it directed mostly at Massa for screwing whatever strategy they came up with to mitigate the problem Kimi had. Luca will act like Mr Nice Guy to the public but once he reaches his breaking point - he'll toss someone out of a seat faster than they know what hit them. And if it's true that Todt is out at Ferrari (not out of the company, but somewhat out of Lucas good book and certainly out of the daily dealings of the F1 team) then Luca might not feel too bad about shafting Todt's kid by cutting down said kid's money tree aka Massa.
Pictures up for more discussion. Massa is 50/50 with the Red Bull, clearly not on the racing line though. I'm not the expert, we need more trash talking. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Where is Massa going to turn, he is so far off the racing line its hilarious, his turn in point is after the corner, and he's aiming to go straight into the grass. Great job Felipe.
uh, he's not 50/50 with DC, and also, as has been said hundred times already... Massa was NOT going to get around that corner...he'd be up on the next curb/grass
Look at the picture above. Massa is NOT on the racing line - game, set, match. No discussion of that - he is very obviously off the line, that much is obvious. From the perspective of the camera, it's clear Massa is not even with DC. The picture skews the perspective a bit but it looks to me that his front wheels are roughly equal with DC's midpoint. Furthermore, as was stated above Massa is so off line for that turn that he has no hope of making the turn - he is just trying to push/bully DC into making space for him. Bad gamble for him to take. DC is on line, and out front. It was his turn. From the perspective above, at this point is where Massa ought to be braking to let DC take the turn. Its very clear from the pic that he is off line and ain't gonna make the turn. As I said he was trying to do the "fast in, slow out" thing -and bully DC into slowing up and moving way waaaay out of line to let him by. Bad gamble. Especially bad gamble when you should be able to take him elsewhere. As others said, Massa lacks racecraft. He sucks at passing - I think he just doesn't have the balls and the skill to do it. I bet the team was giving him 8 kinds of hell for being stuck behind DC so he made a desperation move. Unfortunately DC paid the price for it, and only by the grace of enzo did Massa not end up DNF from that incident. 9 out of 10 times both cars would be out of the race.
