When did "they" start putting computer chips in cars?

They originally used HP1000s, 5 of them because they didn't always come up with the same answer to a simple question. Due to the decreasing size of the logic gates in modern processors, the energy of particles outside the earths atmosphere can easily flip a 0 to a 1 causing a miscalculation or error. And you can't practically shield them from the biggest hitting particles.

 

It depends upon what your definition of "chip" is. Bendix and Desoto had them all beat back in the 50s with the Electrojector electronic fuel injection: It utilized transistors because at that time, there were no such things as "chips".

Inside the "brain" itself: http://www.chrysler300club.com/jhstuff/fuelie/cwdata/Inside%20brain%20box.html

More info: http://www.chrysler300club.com/jhstuff/fuelie/fuelie.html

http://www.ch300imp.com/bendix_us.htm

http://www.allpar.com/cars/desoto/electrojector.html

 

In the USA this car is more commonly known as the Fastback and Squareback (Variant in Germany and other countries outside the USA) and includes the Notchback in the rest of the world. They are the Type III, where the Bug was a Type I and the Bus a Type II (broadly speaking). The Type III was the first production vehicle to use electronic fuel injection (not mechanical like found on some Porsches).

Both the D-Jet and L-Jet systems are EASY to diagnose and work on. Parts, however, are becoming more difficult to find...

 

In all reality the Ferrari 308 and maybe the 365 GT4 were about the last cars on the planet that fit that category. By 1977 only one other manufacture that I know of offered a carb and points ignition, and that was Rolls Royce. Every other car maker had by then moved to fuel injection, or had begun to heavily complicate the carburetor with electronic controls, and virtually everything had electronic ignition. And while many want to sing the virtues of electronic ignition, Rolls Royce kept on with points for only one simple reason, reliability. What finally pushed it over was the US EPA sanctioned 5 year 50K miles emissions warrantee all car manufactures were forced to offer.

As to the fastbacks and squarebacks being easy to diagnose or work on, I would take great issue. In the day when they existed hardly anyone knew a thing about Bosch fuel injection. Even the dealers knew squat. A guy had to be able to find obscure manuals and study the whole system just to be able to figure it out. I remember learning to back probe the harness at the ECU to ohm componenets, rather than swap ECU's and possibly blow one out as many shops, even dealerships were known to do. I recall many cars that had gone into a shop for brakes or something, and suddenly some mechanic was yanking the ECU out to try on some other car. I also recall opening at least half a dozen ECU's that had given me trouble over the years and found hack soldering and/or jumpers wired in. There were a lot of good cars back in the 70's that got junked simply because the computer fried, there were no used ones available, no one could repair them, and a new one was $1200 or more. Then the Dealer tells you if you plug it in you own it, your car might blow it if something else is wrong, and it may not fix the problem. A DCNF is a lot easier to work on in comparison.

But seriously, working on those cars (VW's) to do almost anything was very difficult. Just replacing the alternator on a type III was something like a four hour job. IIRC you had the drop the engine down, remove a lot of air ducting, and remove the entire engine air blower housing to get to the alternator. Not a lot of fun.

 

The Type III used a generator (but I developed an alternator kit that my buddy's shop sells) and they last a long time (the voltage regulator, however, is another story). The generator is on top of the engine and really easy to replace/repair. The Type IV used an alternator. When used in the Porsche 914, yeah, that's an engine drop. Not sure about the TIV engine when used in the 411/412 models and late Buses.

Being in the TIII scene, we've discovered that the "brains" (ECU) rarely ever go bad -- they are hardy units. Replacing a unit is really the very, very last thing to do. It's just too bad the factory techs at some places weren't well trained. And it's not a good idea to mix ECUs because there were different versions of them that were meant to work with specific versions of parts (versions started at A and went to E). If any ECUs have hack job wiring/soldering in them then it's because the "mechanic" had no idea what they were doing (99.999% of the time). In the forums I'm on that deal with the TIII we have factory trained VW service techs from back in the day and they agree, the ECU is the least of the worries. Poor grounds and low voltage are the real culprits, followed by the engine temp sensor. Really, these are simple systems but people just MAKE them out to be complicated. There's plenty of documentation out now for trouble-shooting, including the Bentley shop manual, and the fuel injection testers are often found on e-bay. I have a couple myself.

 

Dear Ferraristi,

I have a 91 Testarossa and a 97.5 Lamborghini Diablo Roadster. Even though the Diablo is a more sophisticated car, the computer sensor, check engine light stuff drives me nuts.

I find when cars started with the CEL's, that's when all the sensor overload started.

My Testarossa has simple electronics, and if there's a problem, it's usually a mechanical adjustment.

The Lambo on the other hand, has to be plugged into a scanner to wipe codes, check conditions and all that other crap !

I tell you, I love my more modern Diablo, but my older Fcar is a better car.....because it's simpler!!

BTW, both cars are daily drivers.

Oh yeah, I will not buy a new car anymore. With all those black boxes tattle-tailing on me so my insurance can go up, the cops can fine me more for their budget decifits....I've had enough !!!



Shamile

Freeze...Miami Vice !

 

My wife comes home in her new vehicle. Next morning she starts it up...it starts...then dies.

Oh crap! I've got a lemon, I think. It would take forever and a week to get it to and back from a dealership, too (they're booked way in advance). Look up on the internet for her vehicle asking for the solution to "starts then dies."

SOLUTION: Reboot the engine computer.

I could have punched through a wall. Someone sold my wife a vehicle that gets the Microsoft blue screen of death.

So I had to leave one of my 10 mm wrenches in the glove box in case the engine computer ever needs rebooting (2+ years later it's never needed it again...has run fine non-stop...go figure).

It's like we've outlawed simplicity.

 

They'll put a chip in our heads next, just wait and see.

 

Kris recently threw out my box of 8 track tapes, the nerve of her! That was the final straw as I will not spend an afternoon trying to figure out how to turn a radio on. Holidays are special as that is when the kids come over and I can get my CD movie player reprogramed. NO DIP STICK? Thats it! Owners had the oil level gauges right in front of them on the Bentley R Types in the 50's and still I had to rebuild a few of those due to locked up engines with no oil in them.

Thinking back to the mid-late 70's, I still remember a 70 something Opel with the Jetronic and the many hours trying to diagnosis that, and a VW Squareback /Notchback? and the many weekends and evenings for that fool thing. Alternator diode breaking down on both cars sending a small amount of AC through the electrical system. Paul is quite right, there were no books, manuals, nothing to assist in any diagnostics of these systems then. Half the English cars still running in the world had leaky diodes at the time and still were being used as daily drivers as long as the points would open and close. Really no more difficult back then as it is now, just new systems to learn with each new model.

Dale, head back to the dealer and demand an 8 track player and a dipstick! Is the trunk on the Miata big enough for 2 dogs and the collection of tapes?

Dave

 

Paul, I'm not so sure you're far off on that one. My wife's MB is so electronic something is always failing. I'll never own another. As to chips in the head, My grad school mentor wrote a book called "The Dossier Society" in 1975 where money would be passe and, while he knew nothing of chips, he knew the government. Everything would be controlled electronically. If you committed a crime the government could shut you off so that you couldn't even buy food. I thouoght he was crazy then. Now, I'm not so sure.