*** My 360 Twin Turbo Project *** | FerrariChat

*** My 360 Twin Turbo Project ***

Discussion in '360/430' started by vrus, Aug 22, 2007.

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  1. vrus

    vrus Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
    25
    Richmond Hill
    Full Name:
    Victor
    #1 vrus, Aug 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I've been busy modding my Porsches & MBs for the past couple of years and thought it was time I did a Ferrari project.

    I am really excited about this so I thought I would share it with you guys...

    It all started last week when I came across a spare 360 motor... I couldnt pass up the opportunity. I quickly began planning the build to support a Twin Turbo setup capable of 700+hp.

    I am going to convert the bottom end to a complete forged setup (new pistons, rods, sleeves). We are keeping the stock crank. The heads will be ported. We are going to make some custom Inconel exhaust valves, and stronger intake valves also. We are analyzing the heads right now to see if we have any room to go bigger with intake and/or exhaust valves. These guys I am dealing with have done alot of work for me in the past and they are wizards when it comes to cylinder head porting.

    We are also trying to decide if we are going to keep the variable valve timing or scrap it and put different cams in there. We will be putting a standalone engine management system into the car (most likely Motec M400).

    I dropped the block & heads off and the machine shop will now dissassemble, clean & inspect all the components. They will also flow the stock heads before they do any port work so we can get a good indication of flow improvements once they are done with the cylinder head modifications.

    Below are some pics of the bottom end and the heads.. I'll post more pics and information as the project progresses...
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  2. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    what compression and what boost are you shooting for?

    Ray
     
  3. vrus

    vrus Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
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    Richmond Hill
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    Victor
    I am looking for 9:1 compression and will be putting 1BAR of boost through the motor. We'll see how much it makes and then adjust boost accordingly.. The block will be O-ringed and made to take alot more than 1BAR of boost.. just in case I want more. :)

     
  4. 996TTurbo

    996TTurbo Formula 3

    Apr 9, 2006
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    Sounds like a serious project, wish you the best of luck, keep the build updated ;)
     
  5. Asmod3uS

    Asmod3uS Karting

    Apr 6, 2004
    148
    New York City
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    Steve
    Looks like a cool project. Spare 360 motors must be tough to come by...
     
  6. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    are you planning to change the profile on the cams? That can make a big difference also. You might also want to build in an adjustable waste gate system so you can dial the boost up/down. I've run that in the past and it's handy.

    Ceramic turbos? :)

    Ray
     
  7. maranello71

    maranello71 Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2004
    1,221
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    Andre
    Not quite so. There's lots of spare 360 motors floating around salvage specialists.

    Just check

    www.eurospares.co.uk

    as an example. They're not very expensive either.
     
  8. vrus

    vrus Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
    25
    Richmond Hill
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    Victor
    Thanks!

    They are available if you know where to find one.. This one just happened to drop right in my lap and I decided to take the opportunity to do a full-out engine build with it.

    I am thinking of pulling the stock cams out and doing away with the VVT.. Not sure at this stage.. I'll decide as I get closer to the assembly stage of the heads. Turbos will be Garrett BB.. I have a turbo wiz who knows compressor maps and A/R so he will properly size the turbos to match the characteristics of the engine. I want something that builds boost at 2,000RPM and will pull right to 9,000RPM. :)

     
  9. duskybird

    duskybird F1 World Champ
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    Jan 20, 2007
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    Great! Please keep us up to date.
     
  10. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
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    I have dibs on your "varible valve timing scrap" should you decide to go that other route ;) :D!!
     
  11. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    intercoolers? Water injection?

    Ray
     
  12. vrus

    vrus Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
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    Richmond Hill
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    #12 vrus, Aug 24, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    My first idea is to use a pair of barrel intercoolers. 1 will be mounted directly behind each MAF sensor.. They are compact enough and the cylindrical shape will make it easy to mount back there.

    I also had a custom twin pump water injection system built for me by Richard @ ERL (Aquamist).

    Below is a pic of the barrel intercooler that I was thinking of and the twin pump water injection system I have.


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  13. h22gordo

    h22gordo Formula Junior

    May 24, 2004
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    The valve covers look a bit charred/discolored. Did the engine come from a car fire?
     
  14. dsevo

    dsevo Formula Junior

    May 7, 2007
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    Dustin
    That's a good looking water injection system. He did a very nice job. Be sure to use fail-safe after fail-safe, because in my experience with WI systems, if they fail the motor fails too. Of course this experience wasn't with Ferrari's, but instead Evo's which are much cheaper to repair.
     
  15. Ryanthebigr

    Ryanthebigr Rookie

    Aug 22, 2007
    31
    how much more speed do you expect to get outa your set up
     
  16. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    looks good. I have run water injection in the past and like it. However, I would suggest you setup the water injection so it only comes on under WOT. Also, make sure you put in some provision to monitor the water tank level.

    Ray
     
  17. vrus

    vrus Rookie

    Nov 17, 2003
    25
    Richmond Hill
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    Victor
    Not sure to be honest. The engine was intact and that's all I cared about... As far as I know the valve covers cleaned up nicely.

    I am using the water injection as a means for cooling and not to try and make power. The only danger with these systems is when guys try to run very advanced timing on the ECU and then mix in water & meth as a means to keep detonation under control. At that point the engine becomes dependent on the injection mixture and because of the higher timing will go ka-boom if the water tank becomes empty.

    In my case, I am not tuning the car any differently.. The water injection will be used to keep IAT in check and ensure that hot-lapping the car will keep the power consistent. The W.I will be used in conjunction with 2 barrel style water-to-air intercoolers, so even if the tank is empty the regular components make the car perfectly safe.

    I decided that since everything is already apart, and that the turbos & Manifolds + standalone management system will take alot of time to get done, I am going to take advantage and bolt the motor back in keeping it in a N/A setup as the first phase. I want to see how much power we can get out of the block in a N/A configuration just doing the heads & pistons and some equal length headers. This will allow me to keep the VVT cams & ECU.. Then, while I am enjoying the car, we can work on the TT setup on the side on the original motor that is in the car and swap it in when it is done.

    That will keep the car from being out of commission for 6months. The pistons will be here in 4 - 5 weeks and by that time the new valves & head porting will be done also.

    I'll post some more progress pics once I visit the engine builder again.



    It's not an issue with my setup.. Mine has a 3D mapping system as part of the controller. It uses the injector pulsewidth to determine the proper amount of water to spray based at each RPM point. Most WI systems that people use will always spray a constant volume.. The problem is that at 2,500RPM you dont need as much water as you do at 5,000RPM. The controller will handle all of that and ensure that the proper fuel to water ratio is matained throughout the whole RPM band.

    Electronics for monitoring water level, clogged injectors, and faults is already built into this system. :) It really is the creme-de-la-creme of WI.

     
  18. TexasMike

    TexasMike F1 World Champ

    Feb 17, 2005
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    Very interesting! I look forward to more updates along the way.
     
  19. bryanc4

    bryanc4 Formula Junior

    May 22, 2008
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    any updates??????
     
  20. toshiba

    toshiba Formula Junior

    Jan 14, 2008
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    sounds good, let us know whats up as I'm sure alot of people here want to know including myself
     
  21. VR4

    VR4 Karting

    Apr 22, 2004
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    vancouver, wa
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    steve
    mmmmmm......burnt valve.



    keep the updates coming. im very interested in your turbo selecetion for such a large RPM range.
     
  22. Greenjack

    Greenjack Karting

    Feb 20, 2006
    72
    Sounds like an awesome project!
     
  23. TopElement

    TopElement Formula 3

    May 14, 2005
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    OC & Vegas
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    A Montoya
    Cool project.
    What will you be doing to properly strengthen the rest of the drivetrain?
     
  24. bryanc4

    bryanc4 Formula Junior

    May 22, 2008
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    Delray/Boca, FL
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    Bryan
    is this project dead??? any updates?????????
     
  25. Ingpr

    Ingpr F1 Rookie

    Jun 30, 2009
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    I'm wondering what happened with this project!
     

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