http://f1.automoto365.com/news/controller.php?lang=en&theme=default&team_id=&month=7&seasonid=18&nextMode=GpNewsForm&news_id=32239 Seems they have traction control, and nobody else does... Called unfair advantage? Soon this will be banned, without it, Hamilton is not so hot. It appears as if McLarens new steering wheel could be behind the Woking based squads recent surge in form with Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen going from struggling to keep up with their rivals at Ferrari in France a month ago to winning back to back dominating victories at Silverstone and Hockenheim. Hamilton won by over a minute in the rain soaked British Grand prix, and although he wasnt miles ahead in Germany, he would have been if not for a safety car and the teams decision not to pit when the rest of the field did. Instead he came in under green flag conditions several laps later, only to make his way back from fifth to first, with a few seconds to spare in just sixteen laps. Although there is no doubt about Hamiltons driving finesse, the domination we have seen in these recent races has left other teams scratching their heads, but it claims by the Telegraph are to be believed, the answer is quite simple. It appears as if the MP4-23s steering wheel is a little different from its rivals with four paddle levels instead of the regular two. Two being to change gears and the two additional levers used to adjust engine torque to suit the gear selected, helping to minimize wheel spin in slow corners but retaining speed for the fast ones. The rules indicate that drivers can not select gears and torque settings in one move, so the extra two levers must be used for the car to remain legal. Just how long it will be before other teams use this technology, or the FIA bans it, is anyones guess, but if it is the reason for their upward turn in performance, you can bet it wont take Ferrari too long to be right up there with them!
*IF* true (and IIRC, they all have 4 paddles already) then I'd say they're perfectly legal and that McCheater are not, in this case at least, cheating in any way...... Would the thread title have been the same had this ("alleged") system been on the Ferraris? - I kind of suspect it would have been something like "Ferrari finds legal way to reduce wheelspin....." cheers, Ian
Same as the rules and the moveable floor last year for Ferrari.... It should be banned... and I predict it will before the next race....
Well, I sure did think that he pulled ahead on the start of the race like he was on nitro and everybody else was running motor power alone, like they say on Pinks... Let us not forget where the on board computer came from.
You're certainly entitled to that opinion. However, as stated in your original post: Which suggests it's legal. It may be an "unfair advantage", but all of the teams are looking for ways to gain that - "Unfair" (in your opinion) does not necessarily make it illegal IMHO.... Cheers, Ian
The Ferrari's flexible floors were perfectly legal untill the ruled change. This is exactly the same thing and no doubt there will be a ruling soon or everyone else will be using it and the advantage will be gone. Good on Mclaren for finding a technology that makes there car better and if this is so its no wonder Lewis looks better than he may actually be. Maybe Massa and Kimi will be dusting off their shoulders in upcoming races.
If it's true they now have torque paddles then either Ferrari needs to start development right away or the FIA needs to make a decision just as they did with the flexi floor.
So your contention is that anything that gives one team an advantage over another is unfair and ought to be banned? LOL...allrighty then. May as well just turn F1 into a spec series if the teams aren't able to devise technology that gives them an advantage over their competitors. This is no different than the moveable front wing on the Ferrari that the other teams then used, or the wheel covers on the Ferrari that the other teams then used. It is entirely different than the moveable floor. McLaren requested a clarification - the rules were not clear on how the measurements were to be taken. the FIA realized that the rules were ambiguous and clarified them. The Ferrari moveable floor was within the letter of the law but not within the spirit of the law. The FIA changed the law so that it more accurately defined what they were trying to define, which then made the Ferrari floor illegal. Because it was not an actual violation of the rule as it was written before the clarification, Ferrari were not penalized. COMPLETELY different than the 4 paddles on the McLaren, which are expressly allowed according to the rule, as posted.
I wonder if it will be allowed. There is no traction control allowed and reducing the torque to one or the other rear wheels is a form of traction control in my opinion. We will see where this goes. If it is allowed then all the teams will apply it to their cars and voila the advantage is gone. Seeing as some in here think that Massa is not that good in the rain then allowing the torque paddles will be a bonus for Massa in upcoming races.....once Ferrari adapts it to their cars.
There has been "traction control" technology whereby the rate of engine rpm acceleration for specific gears was monitored, if the rate was exceeding expected value (due to wheelspin) then the engine would cut power via throttle %. I believe that was the change required at the beginning of the year to remove that patch from the ecu's. I am sure more subtle things are below the surface for all to use if they figure it out.
Whether it's "cheating" or not is a technical and political question within F1. No wonder Dennis is talking so confidently. SF better get busy putting two more paddles on the car...of course, then it may be banned.
+1 No, wait, that can't be right. You guys are all wrong. It's not McLaren---it's actually Lewis Hamilton. The Mclaren isn't actually faster, it's just that LH is so much better than every other driver on the grid (actually than every other driver ever to have lived), that he just makes the Mclaren LOOK like it's going faster. And this BS about paddles and traction control? No. It's wrong. Lewis Hamilton, being god incarnate, is actually adjusting the engine torque levels with his mind while accelerating from the apex. This is just another example of how amazing he is. That's right, folks, he manages to do this all while concentrating on all the other million things an F1 driver needs to during the race--a feat that mere mortal drivers can only hope to achieve. We are all blessed to even be allowed to watch him drive. ...at least that's what the arrogant little prick would have us all think... Give me a freaking break. A talented young driver? Absolutely. As good as some of you on this board make him out to be? No. not even close.
Last year F1 had traction control which was the ECU selecting the amount of torque and horsepower to apply to the wheels based on grip so it was banned to make sport more competitive. Today McLaren allows the driver to do exactly the same thing as Electronic Traction Control did last year which allows them to have traction control, which was banned to make the sport more competitive. This new system from McLaren will be banned and soon or the FIA will be sued for not clarifying the rules and providing an unfair advantage to one team. Trust me when I say that Renault, Ferrari and BMW attorney's are already looking this over and in contact with the FIA....
Good for you and well said Though i was going to write just the same but you beat me to it. Good job I deleted the end bit because you was suddenly talking BS But the rest was spot on
I couldn't fail to notice the irony: Schumacher wins his first WDC driving a Benetton that had illegal traction control (the infamous Option 13). Not a peep from anyone on here. McLaren uses a manual system that is from all apearances within the scope of the rules and all hell breaks loose. Cheaters!! Cheaters!! If I really cared, I would look up all the apologists for the flexible floor issue when it got banned.
Ermmm now let ME guess.....no really, it is coming.....your from ENGLAND. Oh my goodness who would have thought? It is absolutely unfreaking believable!! WHAT DOES MASSA HAVE ANYTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH THIS DISCUSSION!!??? Are you THAT FREAKING MUCH of a Massa-basher that you have to bring him into a thread that has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with him?! Unreal. Massa's biggest fan? No. Do i support FM? Absolutely. I think he is a good driver and undeserving of the flack he catches around here from people like yourself who will take absolutely every single opportunity (that's for posting this as evidence to support my point) to bash him. For the record, I think Kimi is a better driver. But Felipe is not nearly as bad as some of you people make him out to be, and LH is not nearly as good.
How do you know Ferrari don't already have this? I would suspect they do. The selector may not be with the paddle shifters it may be a knob on the wheel. As said above given that most teams have four paddles on their wheel I'd say Ferrari probably has theirs set up the same as McLaren. That way when you shift up or down you pull on both of the paddles at the same time. It moves the car up a gear and into a new torque setting. But, it's a setting it's not continuous adjusting to eliminate wheel spin. That's traction control. This just allows the team to preset torque settings for each gear. That's a FAR, FAR cry from traction control.
