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come out and admit you hate paddle shifters, whomever you are stand and be heard

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by VisualHomage, Aug 13, 2008.

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  1. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #76 VisualHomage, Aug 14, 2008
    This thread has nothing to do with removing technology from racing programs. Nothing at all to do with that. Read the thread from front to back.

    This is about consumer-level experience and spirited driving sensations. Public roads are not timed and judged race courses, and, at times, offer moments of open road and twisties that beg to be driven. Paddles are irrelevant and (can be relatively) numbing on such drives. To then force the consumer to live with only one kind of shifting, adapted from an F1 paddle configuration, and then sell this as an innovative and better roadcar experience, is to foist a falsehood upon the enthusiast when clearly there are many who feel that a 3-pedal setup is more enjoyable.


    The dilemma is such that when a corporate-wide, and now industry-wide, paradigm shift of presenting a new technology is pushed to replace and supplant an older technology --with millions of dollars invested fiscally to create this shift-- the minority who did consume 3-pedal technology is then forced out of the market (or forced to adapt with no choice).

    The minority is then rendered, for the most part, economically irrelevant as the majority seems to accept the changeover, buying and consuming and back-ordering Ferraris. As long as this bottom-line is met, the voices of the few who truly feel duped are drowned out and silenced and rendered irrelevant --even though the newer replacement is in actuality not better from a subjective vantage point.

    And aren't passion, emotion, idiosyncrasy, honor to heritage.... subjective and emotive? What is Ferrari without that? Emotional fulfillment is often "inefficient" and unquantifiable. Ferrari, and other makes, appear to be removing the very elements that beckon the driver to get behind the wheel. It's damn sad.
     
  2. teak360

    teak360 F1 World Champ

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    #77 teak360, Aug 14, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    #78 PSk, Aug 14, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2008
    +1000

    ALL modern cars are boring in comparison to older cars. This is because older cars (1960+) were all about the driving, now it's just about being faster or safer.

    Pete
     
  4. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #79 VisualHomage, Aug 14, 2008
    You've missed the point. It's not about reverting back to the stone age across the board. Keep F1 at the forefront of Ferrari's racing pursuits. But allow the consumer to pursue their own choice of happiness behind the wheel on public roads. Numbing down the Ferrari GT car with only the sole offering of paddles is a mistake and a travesty.
     
  5. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #80 VisualHomage, Aug 14, 2008
    thank you, fellow enthusiast
     
  6. ferraripete

    ferraripete F1 World Champ

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    #81 ferraripete, Aug 14, 2008
    i am not a paddle fan either...yuk!
     
  7. dm_n_stuff

    dm_n_stuff Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #82 dm_n_stuff, Aug 14, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  8. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    #83 davebdave, Aug 14, 2008
    LOL.

    Long before we owned a Ferrari I offended a lawyer at a party when I called his Ferrari an automatic. It seems to me that even the paddle guys are embarrassed by them. "It is not an automatic," he says, "it has a clutch." Whatever.

    I personally love the hands (and feet) on feel of driving a manual. The perfect shift in a manual is like the perfect golf shot: Satisfying and you want another right away. I can't imagine you get that feel with a paddle. I won't buy any car with an automatic period, paddle or otherwise! When you get right down to it, the synchronizes have removed a bit of the thrill. I wouldn't mind having a dog box in the Ferrari.

    Paddles are great, I just wouldn't be caught dead with them in a car that I owned.

    Dave
     
  9. Darolls

    Darolls F1 Veteran
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    #84 Darolls, Aug 14, 2008
    Yup, paddles belong in boats, not in cars!
     
  10. Rodriguez_Exotics

    Rodriguez_Exotics Karting

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    #85 Rodriguez_Exotics, Aug 14, 2008
    count me in, on NO To paddleshifters. Add one for my father so theres 2 more Votes.

    My apartment will be the HQ for the Anti Paddle shifters group Haha
     
  11. UConn Husky

    UConn Husky F1 Rookie

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    #86 UConn Husky, Aug 14, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2008
    This is the root of the problem...people don't understand that the F1 is truly a manual gearbox. I hear that all the time, so it's an automatic? yes it is, back to your cave now. I don't want a shift to be like a lucky shot in golf, I want it to be lightning fast, when I request it, every single time. The classic Ferrari gate? eh, sometimes yes, sometimes no. F1? Every time, count on it!

    Again I love the old classic cars (I'm drooling over the 250 GTE at F40 Motorsports!), I love 6-spds with clutch pedals (see my profile)...but the F1 paddle shift is just plain FUN to drive. Spinning tires when engaging 2nd and 3rd gear shifting at 8500 rpm? Priceless. To create a specific thread about hating the F1? Seems just a tad bit uninformed to me :D Why not a thread about just loving the gated shifter?

    Anyway we're all Tifosi here right? Enjoy every mile :D
     
  12. David888

    David888 Karting

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    #87 David888, Aug 14, 2008
    I love both!
    I think that as cars get faster and the new generations get older paddle shifters will be the standard.
     
  13. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    #88 PSk, Aug 14, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2008
    The point that most are missing, especially the paddle shift siders, is that ANYBODY even a baby can make a perfect shift using paddles.

    Many people want to learn skills themselves, not have a computer do it for you. Ultimate personal satisfaction comes from doing something difficult well. I want to own a car that asks a lot from me to drive quickly, not the other way around.

    All that money you pay for a Ferrari and it is now as easy and nearly as involving to drive as a Toyota Corolla (regarding gear change) ... no thanks. Technology should never take away the challenge ... for a ROAD car where gear change speed is just wanking (as is carbon brakes ... yeah really makes a difference on the run to pick up the kids).
    Pete
     
  14. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #89 VisualHomage, Aug 15, 2008
    Very well put and many thanks for that articulation.


    The anticipation, premeditation, intuition, non-verbal feeling, complete immersion of the body mechanism as one unit aligned in symphony with the car's dynamics, translation of direct-to-clutch-heel-toe-shifter-arm-pattern-clenched-transmission-connection .... all of that is labotomized and emasculated upon the flip of the paddle.
     
  15. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #90 VisualHomage, Aug 15, 2008
    +1 ^^^ that's hilarious! LOL! much appreciated humor....
     
  16. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    #91 davebdave, Aug 15, 2008
    The truth is I would jump at the chance to try a F1 traney (bet I'd love it too), but in the end I like my cave man ways.
    Dave
     
  17. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #92 PhilNotHill, Aug 15, 2008
    My Porshe has a 6 speed manual.

    the Ferrari has an F1...the best in the business. Porsche tiptronic sucks.

    variety is the spice of life. I love having both options.

    No question F1 is faster on the track.

    And the stick can be a pain in stop and go traffic (not a problem where I live)

    May the horse be with you ;)
     
  18. UConn Husky

    UConn Husky F1 Rookie

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    #93 UConn Husky, Aug 15, 2008
    When I decided on the F1 I wasn't looking for a challenge in shifting, I have enough challenge getting my kids to eat dinner :D Why on earth would I want my modern Ferrari to be a challenge to shift?! Screw the reward of patting myself on the back for a nice shift, I just want it to slam in gear every time, no questions asked! Seriously guys, the F1 paddle shift is FUN to drive, no need to create threads bashing it. Why can't it co-exist with a 3 pedal setup? I'll never be an F1 driver, but this is close enough for me!

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=KDEeoYwt3Qc
     
  19. VisualHomage

    VisualHomage F1 Veteran

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    #94 VisualHomage, Aug 15, 2008
    To come to the middle, indeed, I see both sides of the argument --have seen both sides for a long time-- regardless of my personal convictions that lean clearly to one side.

    I've heard the arguments pro and con for both setups before. Your ideas are well-taken and there is no harm there. Not everyone is in it for the exact same reasons. I think that is a foregone conclusion.

    I think we all have pondered this issue to great lengths, with varying levels of opinion running from quiet acquiescence to seething rage. It matters more to some than to others.

    But this is an opportunity for true-grit haters of paddles to step forth and just tell it like it really is. No politically correct sensitivity or bullsh!t like that. Why accommodate and coddle the opposing side just for the sake of upholding the veil of egalitarianism. There is a time to break away from that nauseating charade.

    It's just meat and potatoes disappointment and disillusionment with a trend that is not in actuality living up to every enthusiasts idea of what a driver's car is about. That ethos, of being specially united with the machine, is being bit-by-bit removed and shut off. Paddles are not across the board this fantastic torch lighting the way ahead. They're an abomination and a tumor upon an otherwise potentially elegant creation.
     
  20. Fred2

    Fred2 F1 World Champ
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    #95 Fred2, Aug 15, 2008
    The big argument for the paddle shifters is that they are faster on the track.
    Since most of the owners are not skilled race drivers, their car (any car) would be MUCH faster on the track if the owner/driver were replaced with a "no name" SCCA driver.

    If faster is better is the Holy Grail, which is more fun, watching someone else drive your car faster than you can go, or driving it yourself.
     
  21. italiafan

    italiafan F1 World Champ
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    #96 italiafan, Aug 15, 2008
    But what about my balls?
    :)
     
  22. UroTrash

    UroTrash Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #97 UroTrash, Aug 15, 2008
    Let me snap this into sharp focus.

    My 2 driving age daughters (that live at home) have opposing views on this.

    The older loves to shift and in fact has an odd idea that if a young man cannot shift he is in someway...inadequate and a bit laughable. she feels that a non-manual ferrari is an abomination, a crime against nature.

    The younger, who has minimal interest in cars, never would learn to shift ( absolutely refused to try) and thinks the idea of a Ferrari with paddles is fabulous.

    There you have it, from the generation that will be making the car buying decisions in the future.
     
  23. b27

    b27 F1 World Champ

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    #98 b27, Aug 15, 2008
    I haven't driven a paddle shift yet so this is only my thoughts. Been in an M6 with one and sure it was great, no mistakes, computer revs engine on downshift and therefore precise repeatable gear changes.

    Personally I like to heel and toe and drive my cars. So to me the F1 box (paddle) is geat in technology but to me takes away the fun of driving.

    Nothing like heel toeing going into a corner going through the gate. Tapping a paddle is not he same IMO.
     
  24. teak360

    teak360 F1 World Champ

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    #99 teak360, Aug 15, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2008
    It was a joke as the op's title included the word "hate". I like a stick too as in my racing days that was the way it was done. I like paddles more though. Sticks will be gone soon. I would guess 5 years from now you won't be able to get one in a Ferrari.
     
  25. HerrBremerhaven

    HerrBremerhaven Rookie

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    #100 HerrBremerhaven, Aug 15, 2008
    I would actually prefer a six speed sequential, more like a motorcycle transmission. Add a proper shifter to that, and the car to driver interaction is complete. That traditional Ferrari gated shifter grate is a signature of the older cars, and it is a shame to see it go to something that looks like a video game toggle. At least with a sequential, they could have a nice gated set-up with the old stick and knob.

    Ciao!

    Gordon Moat
     
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