Maserati - gone Lotus - gone Jaguar - gone BRM - gone Alfa - gone Ten years ago, Ferrari was the *only* team building the whole package themselves. Now there's Ferrari, Renault, BMW, Toyota, and Honda. As a manufacturers' series, it's a bit closer to its roots than it was. (Not that any of that has stopped the lemmings from heading to a spec series.) But *would* F1 survive as a Toyota vs Honda venue? When PSA pulled Citroen and Peugeot out of WRC, that left Subaru, Mitsu, Ford, and Skoda. And FIA folded up the manufacturer's class. (If a Euro team can't win, they're not gonna play.) I think the question should be, how much better would F1 be without FIA? Instead of getting industrialists to build underfunded "customer" teams to fill the grid on a manufacturers' series, how about bringing in sports car manufacturers, like Nissan or Porsche? But this isn't R&D funding for a manufacturer, anymore. The money in F1 doesn't develop technology, it just pads Bernie's pockets and pays for Max's "extracurricular activities". The real question is what would a sports car manufacturer today want with F1? I think that the bulk of F1 fans today only still follow it out of habit. The "fair weather" F1 fans that tune in to root for Fernando or Lewis aren't in it for the long haul. (Look how fast the stands emptied after Alonso crashed out in lap 1.) But if they make today's ratings look good .... well, I don't imagine Bernie is doing much planning for ten years for now.
You sponsor a car in nascar to either sell product or to sell cars, and I can imagine an entire grandstand at a nascar event pooling their money, and not being able to afford a new Ferrari... (stereotyping full-on)
It's not an arrogant or presumptuous question at all, I'm sorry you misunderstood the simple yes/no format. The point is, you talk to a less-than casual racing fan, or a wife, or a girlfriend, and you take them to an event they have never seen in their life before, if you point out all the different cars, there is a pretty good chance there is only a handful of marques they would know - lately because those streetcar vendors are now in F1 (why ? to sell cars...). Those marques are Honda, Toyota, BMW, Mercedes, Renault and Ferrari. But for some reason, folks are enamored with Ferrari. And the other part of your reply - yes - true - F1 fans watch F1 and NOT just Ferrari, BUT there are just not that many TRUE F1 fans. A lot of people go to the events because it's the 'in' thing to do, and for no other reason. What made *US* become Ferrari fans ?????
Has to be at least a two horse race. No F-cars would mean the historic continuity gone and for a couple of seasons, minimum, a macca walk over. Probably stagger along in some form but diminished significantly, imho.
Well, F1 nearly collapsed when Trabant pulled out, and Trabi has a much larger international following than Ferrari does. So I'd wager a guess that F1 would be harmed in no small way if Ferrari abandoned F1 and went to NASCAR, like they should.
Ferrari is F1 blood No Ferrari - NO F1 - take any body else out & doesn't matter - but Ferrari is the universal F1 icon theres no doubt about it - is there???
Why do I get up early on Saturday and Sunday mornings (or go to bed late in the case of the Pacific Rim races) during the F1 season? Or search out a cafe with a TV when I'm in Europe on a race weekend? Or generally arrange my schedule around F1 races? Not because I love the FIA, or Max, or Bernie. Certainly not to see what Flavio's hair is doing on a particular day. I do it because F1 is the venue in which Ferrari has chosen to compete for the last 50+ years. Sure, a return to endurance racing would be great, but only if Porsche has an epiphany and stops building SUVs and does the same. So, right now F1 is the only venue where I can appreciate Enzo's legacy, and watch his cars perform the way he intended. F1 would not stand a chance if Ferrari were to depart.
I'm sorry you missed my point, the simple statement that, the idea that Ferrari is so important that F1 will collapse if they leave is arrogant. That's my opinion, sorry you missed that there buddy.
Ferrari outsells every other brand of F1 stuff 5 to 1. Just ask the guys at Speedgear.com... F1 would last about half a season without them, Mercedes can't compete anywhere but F1, they don't do GT or LMS stuff and BMW would transistion rather quickly if Ferrari left so there would be nobody left, no fans left either.
F1 without Ferrari would be called the IRL. And ask Marlboro why they dropped millions even though their acutual name can not appear on the Ferrari. Ridiculous to think the 40% of F1 attendees that currently cheer for Ferrari would suddenly switch loyalty to another team. Consider that F1 fans usually do not follow just one driver, but the team for which that driver represents. When Scuhumacher left F1, I did not see all of the Ferrari fans suddenly buy Toyota hats. They continued as Ferrari fans. Without Ferrari, the sport would be different and support would wane. Not joking, I think the only exception would be if Ferrari hired Alonso, then there would be a loss of a few Ferrari supporters.
I never said they are 'so important', I asked a simple yes/no question. Do not try to push any 'arrogance' off on me, I asked a question, no more, no less. Sorry again.
How is it worthless ? Should I repost it with an outline definition ? Could F1 survive with Super-Aguri ? (I think so) Tyrrell, Lotus, Brabham, Ligier, Alfa ? (it has) McLaren, Williams, BMW ? (more than likely) Shall I rephrase it and ask 'Overall, can F1 survive if Ferrari left with no noticeable drop in viewership, attendence or corporate sponsorship revenue if Ferrari left ?' (And yes, certain drivers will bring out the home town crowd: Alonso in Spain, Massa in Brazil, but would Massa bring out the crowd in Brazil if he was in an uncompetitive car ? Hmm....) The 'problem' is, like it or not, Ferrari has a HUGE fan base. You ask anyone on the street to name a Grand Prix team, and if anyone CAN name a team, it will probably be Ferrari. You ask anyone on the street to name a nascar TEAM, or an Indy car TEAM, they probably can't, but they probably CAN name a couple of drivers. F1, IMO, is the opposite. Most on the street cannot name a Ferrari driver, but they CAN name the team.
That's not a rephrase. That's a different question. I think virtually everyone who said "yes" realized that there would be a noticeable drop in viewership/attendance/sponsorship. I'm sure we all thought it would be survivable though. Sure, budgets would probably have to be cut as revenue shrunk, but all businesses do this to match the current business environment.
Popularity was not the question. The question is could it survive. The answer is yes it could. Diminished popularity is besides the point. Fact is Ferrari needs those other manufacturers pushing cars around the track as much if not more than those teams need Ferrari to push its two cars around the track. I was joking about NASCAR but has anyone ever lined up the numbers? NASCAR fans are probably more numerous and loyal across the board than Ferrari fans.
More numerous in the U.S. maybe. More Loyal? Define Loyal. In any event, comparing NASCAR to F1 is like comparing "TJ Hooker" to "COPS". One is a show ABOUT the police, and one is ACTUALLY the police. There is no doubt that Ferrari needs a competetive series to race in order to be valid. However, popularity IS the point. If Ferrari were to leave F1, F1 would definitely survive, but for how long? You simply cannot remove the percentage of fan-base that Ferrari fans make up, and expect revenues to continue to be adequate to carry a series as fat as F1. The real question is, could F1 survive without Ferrari, while continuing to push the rules toward the same type of spec-series, cost-cutting, blanding-down that NASCAR is? When F1 finally becomes like the IRL, where without paint and sponsor decals you cannot tell one car from the other, will anyone care at all, with or without Ferrari?
Ok, my wording was way off, I still don't think F1 could survive without Ferrari, it might make it for another season but I think it would soon fade with time. I really don't think Ferrari needs the other manufacturers as much as they need Ferrari to stay in Formula 1, or maybe I should say that Formula 1 needs Ferrari to stay popular but Ferrari doesn't need Formula 1 to stay popular. Ferrari can easily stand on it's own even if it wasn't part of Formula 1 but like a few of the other post said, look at all of the fans and support for Formula 1 that would be lost without Ferrari. You are right about the NASCAR fans though, I can't stand NASCAR, but I'll have to hand it to there fans, they are very loyal to the sport and to there drivers, and if F1 had support like that in the US then we would be looking at a whole new story.
Then ignore it and more on. Bashing the question bashes the person starting the thread. Start your own thread. Wait for those with little tact to bash it. I quite frankly am shocked by the poll results so far.
