Disaster averted, but I still have a problem! | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Disaster averted, but I still have a problem!

Discussion in '308/328' started by jimshadow, Nov 8, 2008.

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  1. tomoshea

    tomoshea Formula Junior

    Dec 29, 2003
    541
    Ireland
    Full Name:
    Tom O'Shea
    #26 tomoshea, Jan 7, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2009
    Hi Jim,

    Just seen these updates to the thread since I last posted on this one.

    What happened to you is absolutely exactly what happened to me and a few other folks I know.

    I hope I am going to save you some time and frustration here, but your probably not going to like what I have to say........

    Your cam drive gear has been slapping hard against the drive shaft and woodruff (evidenced by the damage) each time the engine rotates through the cycle, it is very likely that the tolerance between your cam drive and your drive shaft has gone out of tolerence (I really hope not for your sake, but based on your note above it seems you might). The only down and dirty way to check is to slide the cam drive back onto the shaft and ensure that to do this requires an "almost" a pressure fit between both parts. Do this with the shaft hole ( minus woodruff) and cam drive gear woodruff slot both in line. If it is not a pressure fit you have wear.

    Secondly (and it is very difficult to do) you need to be sure that the movement of the cam drive in and out along the shaft ( as a result of the loose lock nut) has not worn the inner section of the threads on the shaft ( the only way to really check this is to take the other lock nut off the 1-4 bank and "feel" whether it takes the same amount of hand torque to tighten the same nut on both shafts, to the point of the lock nut section biting. If it is looser on one (even for part of the tightening), you probably have thread damage also.

    There is not point in proceeding in trying to fix your engine if either of the above is the case without replacing the drive shaft, the cam drive gear and the lock nut and the belt. It will come loose again no matter what loctite you use, and you will find that the cam drive does not centre properly on the shaft and you will get (if you use a stet on the engine) a grinding sound from the lower bearing on the bank due to the non ovality of the cam gear on the drive shaft.

    I grappled with this for 8 months with various "fix its" including proper cylinder tolerance materials from loctite etc, loctite on the threads/ new ock nut, trust me .... nothing works and you run the risk of more serious damage to your engine. Eventually I pulled the engine and had it fixed properly by Colin in Superformance in the UK, had high comp pistons put in at the same time (in for a penny in for a few thousand!!!), just got it back on Christmas eve.

    I hope for your sake you have been more lucky than I was, please try all of the above before deciding a course of action.

    I have a couple of spare pulleys and 4 spare shafts (none of which are new, but are usable, you are welcome to test them if you need parts, or have trouble finding them)

    All the best

    Tom
     
  2. jimshadow

    jimshadow F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Feb 19, 2006
    6,257
    Indiana/North Carolina
    Full Name:
    JIM

    Tom,

    Thanks for the informative post. I'm waiting on parts and as soon as they arrive, I will check the steps that you suggested and report back to this thread.

    JIM
     
  3. 350HPMondial

    350HPMondial F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 1, 2002
    5,334
    18 mi from the surf,, close to Pismo, CA
    Full Name:
    Edwardo
    #28 350HPMondial, Jan 7, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I believe that oil is intended to splash into the non-Sealed bearings,
    that is why they have an external lip seal and not an internal one.

    The SKF Italian Bearings I just purchased had seals like you show, but they are easily removed with a pick to the factory "Nonsealed" style.
    Good luck,

    Edwardo
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  4. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

    Jan 25, 2004
    3,931
    CA and OR
    Full Name:
    pit bull
    Be nice to know if the mechanic removed the rear seal from that bearing so it gets fresh lube as Edwardo mentioned. You might be thinking the newer cars have sealed bearings so no issue but those bearings are further out on the shaft so don't see as much load ... just a thought.

    Sean
     
  5. jimshadow

    jimshadow F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Feb 19, 2006
    6,257
    Indiana/North Carolina
    Full Name:
    JIM
    Yesterday I found some time to get under the car, unfortunately, I did not grab the camera...so no pics. :(
    As per Tom's post, I did check the tolerance between the cam gear and the shaft. While it is not "an almost pressure fit" there was next to no movement between the gear and the shaft. Additionally, there is no wear on the threads at all. The new nut screwed all the way down to the last thread on a test fit.
    Where I did have problems was torqueing down the new lock nut. I have 2 torque wrenches..15-75lbs and 50-150. I needed the longer one due to the high torque value for this nut and without a lift, or the car lifted fairly high up, I had to remove the airbox in order to work the longer torque wrench from above. (I also needed a neighbor to hold the tool on squarely) All in all not a big deal, just time consuming and somewhat comical.
    Sooooo, the nut is on as well as the new timing belt. I did not do the rear bank nut at this time as the gear is on firmly and there is no sign that the nut is backing itself off. I marked the new nut with paint so I can periodically check to see if its moving again.
    Next step is to fill the car back up with antifreeze and start her up. Thanks to all who have commented/advised in this project and thanks again to David for loaning me the tool to r/r the ring nut.

    JIM
     
  6. Beta Scorpion

    Beta Scorpion Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2006
    1,379
    Thanks for sharing this ordeal.
     
  7. jimshadow

    jimshadow F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Feb 19, 2006
    6,257
    Indiana/North Carolina
    Full Name:
    JIM
    My pleasure!

    I tried to upload a video of my car running tonight, but I'm having problems with my new video camera and computer. Anyway, the car started right up and is running like a top!! I realize now that I've been living with strange noises for a while now and its nice to hear a smooth running engine. :) Now I can't wait for winter to be over with. Unfortunately, we're under a Blizzard Watch for the next 2 days. :(

    JIM
     
  8. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 26, 2001
    33,388
    E ' ' '/ F
    Full Name:
    Enzo Gorlomi
    You're in danger from Dairy Queen ice cream? :D


    Glad you got your tick fixed.
     

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