Drivers in dispute over superlicence fee | FerrariChat

Drivers in dispute over superlicence fee

Discussion in 'F1' started by kraftwerk, Jan 24, 2009.

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  1. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

    May 12, 2007
    26,826
    England North West
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    Steve
    #1 kraftwerk, Jan 24, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2009
    By Jonathan Noble Friday, January 23rd 2009, 12:55 GMT

    Formula One drivers are refusing to sign their mandatory FIA superlicences amid a fresh dispute with the sport's governing body about their price, autosport.com can reveal.

    Last season drivers were unhappy about a price hike from 1,725 Euros plus 456 Euros per point for the licences, to 10,000 Euros plus 2,000 Euros per point for the 2008 season.

    They accepted the payments then, however, despite calling on the FIA and Formula One supremo Bernie Ecclestone to justify the increase in costs.

    Former world champion Fernando Alonso said at the time: "It is a very serious matter...we all agree that it is not fair that from one year to the next it (the cost) increases 500-600 percent."

    There was talk mid-season of the matter resulting in a drivers' strike at the British Grand Prix, but these reports proved unfounded.

    However, high level sources have revealed to autosport.com that drivers have now taken the matter into their own hands because of a further minor increase in the licence costs due to be introduced for the 2009 season.

    The price of a licence has increased by 400 Euros (to 10,400 Euros), while drivers must pay an extra 100 Euros ( to 2100 Euros) per point scored. There is also a 2,720 Euros compulsory insurance charge.

    Although the 2009 increases are purely the result of inflation, it is understood that the Grand Prix Drivers' Association (GPDA) is deeply unhappy about the price increase. Under the current fees, world champion Lewis Hamilton will have to pay 218,920 Euros for his licence fees this year.

    The GPDA has taken up the matter on behalf of its representatives to try and get the increases cancelled, and has urged drivers not to sign and pay for the licences until the situation is sorted.

    Autosport.com understands that correspondence has already been exchanged with the FIA about the matter, and is understood that president Max Mosley said he was willing to discuss the situation, but only if drivers could provide him with details of their earnings so he could judge whether the fee was too high.

    With no resolution in sight between the drivers and the FIA, and amid a risk of the situation not getting sorted before teams head to Melbourne for the first race, the matter has now been tabled for discussion at the next meeting of the Formula One Teams' Association (FOTA) that takes place early next month.

    This week the GPDA urged drivers not to sign their superlicence paperwork, despite pressure beginning to come from their teams, before the FOTA meeting.

    In an e-mail sent to drivers by the GPDA, a copy of which has been seen by autosport.com, it was made clear that the drivers' body wanted all members to hold firm.

    "(The) Superlicence issue will be addressed at the next FOTA meeting which will take place on February 3," said the email. "We would like you to wait approximately three more weeks to sign or pay for the Superlicence.

    "This should give us enough time to hear from the FOTA and at the same time increase our pressure on the FIA."

    It is not clear how much FOTA will wish to get involved in the drivers' situation, with sources suggesting teams do not wish the superlicence matter to overshadow progress being made between them and the FIA about cost cuts and other changes to the sport.

    Mosley said at the start of last year that the licence fee had increased so much because of the rising costs of safety.

    "We spend a fortune on safety and most of it is for the benefit of the drivers," Mosley explained. "A lot of the people who have otherwise been meeting the bill said 'Hang on a minute, these drivers are all earning megabucks and we are spending a fortune to try and make sure they are safe. So hence the increase."

    Thanks autosport

    So Max!, everyone is screaming about the global financial uncertainty and you decide a massive increase in cost for the drivers licence, not that it bother's me whether or not the driver's can afford it, they get paid enough, but how is this going to help, when he is banging on about reducing teams cost's the man is a total utter clueless idiot and needs to be whipped... oh I forgot thats what he needs the money for, 100 mil wasn't enough...silly me ..:eek:
     
  2. lmunz22

    lmunz22 Formula 3

    Jan 16, 2007
    1,224
    So wait, they need to pay more if they do better by scoring points...?
     
  3. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

    May 12, 2007
    26,826
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    Steve
    In a word!! yes...
     
  4. Gilles27

    Gilles27 F1 World Champ

    Mar 16, 2002
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    Jack
    Of course! Like Max said at the bottom, this money is needed for safety. And the better you are, the SAFER you are! Perfect.
     
  5. Whisky

    Whisky Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 27, 2006
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    Upper Great Plains
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    The original Fernando
    SEE - no good deed goes unpunished.

    I always thought drivers backed off at the end of a race to save fuel, little did we know it was to save money...
     
  6. lmunz22

    lmunz22 Formula 3

    Jan 16, 2007
    1,224
    So that's why Glock did it...
     
  7. Kieran

    Kieran F1 Rookie

    Jul 23, 2006
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    Westchester, NY
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    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
     
  8. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Well I have to admit that is one of the better Glock!! jokes...:)
     
  9. jk0001

    jk0001 F1 Veteran

    Oct 18, 2005
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    Jim
    All you have to do is mention Glocks name in the racing society and everyone laughs now.
     
  10. mpatrizio

    mpatrizio Formula Junior

    Dec 29, 2004
    776
    Miami, Fl
    Full Name:
    Mike P.
    Let's see 39 available points per GP, 18 GPs per year, that's 702 possible points, or $1.9mm the drivers pay just for points scored.

    Based on these numbers Last year Hamilton and Massa had to pay out over $300k each. Hamilton is listed at £206,416 just to be able to compete in the 2009 season.

    It never ceases to amaze me how much money is just wasted in F1.

    To me it's not about the money so much, but more about the principle. We all know that the top drivers can afford it, but to charge the drivers for points WON, just ooozes greed.

    The thing is, not all these drivers make more than $1mm per year. Most make less than $1mm, then they pay agents, marketing managers, and loans from earlier in their careers. Add to it that many of them PAY for their own ride, so you can imagine the financial situation that a pay driver could end up in, would he have the misfortune of actually getting good results.

    Fisichella is essentially a pay driver that makes less than $1mm per year. Think about that as he fights to get into the points this year, which he might actually do with McLaren equipment.

    FWIW, the golden boy Vettel made E600,000 last year. His raise this year takes him to a whopping E1.5m. It's no surprize that the drivers are protesting this.

    OT: It's funny, then people wonder why teams like Ferrari have their pick of the litter when it comes to drivers.
     
  11. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
    Moderator

    Oct 1, 2008
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    Andrew
    Not to mention insanity. If a driver wraps up the Championship early on in the season then where is the incentive for him to continue scoring points? Unless teams give bonuses for points scored - thus offsetting the charges imposed by the Superlicense fees.

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
  12. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

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    I don't ...he did better staying on the tyres he had on, nearly spoiling it for LH and gaining positions.

    Most that know anything about racing, the ones that matter I'm sure see he did the right thing with his gamble.
     
  13. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

    May 12, 2007
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    Steve
    +1 It's the hypocritical nature of Porno Max pay me more yet cut cost's , Yeh right
     
  14. Kleos1

    Kleos1 Karting

    Feb 1, 2004
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    Urbandale Iowa
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    Garry Haas
    "president Max Mosley said he was willing to discuss the situation, but only if drivers could provide him with details of their earnings so he could judge whether the fee was too high."

    Maybe Maxi should have to provide detailed earning report so they(drivers and fans) can judge the need for the increase.
     
  15. mousecatcher

    mousecatcher Formula 3

    Dec 18, 2007
    2,116
    san mateo, ca
    oh? name 2 drivers that pay for their ride.

    i don't mean to sound sarcastic. seriously, i was unaware that any F1 drivers pay for their ride.
     
  16. mousecatcher

    mousecatcher Formula 3

    Dec 18, 2007
    2,116
    san mateo, ca
    inaccurate assessment. the massive increase happened last year, when financials were pretty good. the increase for '09 was just inflationary.

    i do agree, the fees are ridiculous and are a tax for the privilege of earning your money in the most fun way possible.
     
  17. anguruso

    anguruso Formula Junior

    Jan 20, 2007
    493
    Hong Kong/Sydney
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    Angus Cheng
    Nelson Piquet
    Kazuki Nakajima
    Giancarlo Fisichella
    Sebastien Bourdais

    They may not literally pay to drive for the teams, but are very likely to be on less than $1 Million

    In the early 90s there were loads of pay drivers, Niki Lauda was a pay driver once upon a time.
     
  18. anguruso

    anguruso Formula Junior

    Jan 20, 2007
    493
    Hong Kong/Sydney
    Full Name:
    Angus Cheng
    Aaah here you go. STR is looking for a pay driver to partner Sebastien Buemi

     
  19. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

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    In the wake of recent misreporting of the drivers' issue with the FIA regarding their Super Licence fees in certain sections of the media, and in response to Mr. Mosley's latest comments, the Drivers wish to clarify the following:

    In January 2008, the FIA unilaterally increased the Formula One drivers' fees for holding a Super Licence. The basic Super Licence fee for the 2008 season increased from EUR 1,690 in 2007 to EUR 10,000 representing a rise of nearly five-fold. In addition, the points' fees which are paid concurrently with the basic Super Licence fee increased from EUR 447 per point in 2007 to EUR 2,000 in 2008, an increase by a factor of nearly 3.5.

    These increases were made without any prior consultation with the drivers, and the first the drivers knew of the increases was when the invoices were received by their respective teams and via the media in January 2008. The proposed increases are inherently unfair, both in the way they were introduced and the way they impact on individual drivers.

    Since these increases were introduced by the FIA, they have been opposed unanimously by the drivers because they are unreasonable and unfair. The GPDA has - on behalf of all drivers holding Super Licences including the non-GPDA members - appropriately and professionally sought to resolve the issue privately with the FIA throughout the 2008 season, culminating in a meeting with Mr. Mosley at the Italian Grand Prix last September which opened up the way for further discussion.

    This included a request from the FIA to the drivers to disclose their gross earnings. However, Mr. Mosley is incorrect in his claim to the media that he had not received an answer from the drivers as a letter was sent by the GPDA in December declining the request because it was not relevant to ascertaining the appropriate Super Licence fees. Furthermore, drivers' gross (and net) earnings are confidential to the drivers, their management and financial advisors and any relevant tax authorities, and should be respected as such.

    In fact, Mr. Mosley himself alluded to such confidentiality in recent correspondence with the GPDA. On the subject of whether the Super Licence is paid by the team or the individual, Mr. Mosley concluded it was a private contractual matter between the driver and his team, and not a matter for the FIA.

    The drivers are not opposed to a reasonable increase in the Super Licence fees, the fee which should cover the administrative and other costs relating to the issue of the licence.

    Therefore, the drivers have offered to pay the 2007 Super Licence fees adjusted upwards by inflation for the 2008 season with a corresponding increase for the 2009 season.

    In addition, the drivers have offered to explore fair ways in which they can assist the FIA in raising funds to meet the apparent EUR 1.7 million shortfall required to run the Federation in 2008 and a further EUR 3 million shortfall that will be required in 2009, according to the figures cited by Mr. Mosley at Monza.

    The drivers contend that the Super Licence fees should not be a revenue stream for the FIA and such a change constitutes a major departure in principle for both past Super Licence fees and fees for any other drivers' licences. The FIA should raise sufficient funds from the exploitation of its commercial rights.

    a principle, the drivers should not be taxed to fund the costs of others fulfilling their legal duty to the drivers. It is the teams' duty to provide the driver with a safe car, it is the circuit owners' duty to provide a safe circuit and it is the duty of the manufacturers to provide helmets, fireproof overalls, etc. fit for the purpose of safety. The FIA, as the governing body, has a duty to impose safety regulations and to supervise through licensing the parties carrying out their duties, e.g. licensing a circuit. The licensing process for drivers is to ensure that the drivers are competent to race at the level necessary in Formula One.

    FIGURES

    * Already in 2007, the F1 Super Licence was the most expensive Licence payable by any sportsperson in the world
    * In one year and without prior notice, it went up between 200% (basic fee) and 350% (fee per point)
    * The winner of the 2008 F1 World Championship will have to pay $270.000
    * The closest Licence Fee in the world is NASCAR in which each driver pays $4.000 per season
    * The FIA qualifies the drivers' contribution to the running of the Federation to a total of EUR 1.7 million per season via our Super Licence fees.
     
  20. AlexO91

    AlexO91 F1 Rookie

    Sep 26, 2008
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    So that means that Lewis Hamilton paid 206,000 Euros or 266,000 Dollars to win the World Championship. Whats the point in paying for a race licence thats only valid in Formula 1. I bet Mad Max and Bernie are laughting at the Drivers right now. $$$$$$$$$$$$$
     
  21. dmaxx3500

    dmaxx3500 Formula 3

    Jul 19, 2008
    1,027
    screw em ,all the drivers shouldn't pay it
     
  22. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    As every pro athlete has said at one time or an other "It's not about the money".
    Right.
     

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