Newbie - Steering Wheel Junkie | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Newbie - Steering Wheel Junkie

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by woodrim, Mar 6, 2009.

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  1. Erich

    Erich Formula 3

    Sep 9, 2003
    1,190
    Poway CA
    Full Name:
    Erich Coiner
    Wow! I am in awe of you knowledge.

    What can you tell me about wood rimmed wheel in a Sunbeam Tiger?

    It has a black inlaid rim. Do you know what the inlay is made from?
     
  2. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    #27 woodrim, Mar 7, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hello Erich. The Tiger wheel was made from segments of mahogany. The inlay was real ebony wood; most likely gaboon. The Tiger wheels' inlay was not a single continuous piece of wood as you might expect (Nardi actually used two thin strips of dark wood before changing to plastic), but relatively short lengths butt jointed every several inches. They were also very thin, sometimes two, sometimes three wide to make the stripe. This was a result of their wood choice. Ebony of all types is dense and brittle, but the gaboon is more so than others, making it very difficult to bend without breaking. You will find it very difficult to see what I just described without scraping off the finish. The below image of a broken rim will show you some of what I'm describing.

    Question for you... Have you ever seen a Tiger wheel that didn't have a crack around the top of the bakelite boss?

    Woodrim
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  3. Neonzapper

    Neonzapper F1 Rookie

    Oct 19, 2008
    2,580
    MD/FL/Philippines
    Full Name:
    Mykol

    Jim, as I recall some time ago, I believe the steering wheel in the Dino is from a Mercedes 300 which you had Pininfarina install with a tilting bar to make it easier to enter and exit the car. Am I right on that?

    Michael
     
  4. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    2,350
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    Mike,
    I'm quite familiar with segmented mahogany on old rims.
    Just in terms of process, for the barrel wound beech- am I understanding correctly that beech was wound about (around) a form approximating the size of the metal rim and then brought to the rim and pegged in or so to hold it in place?
    Thanks very much and welcome to fchat- this place is the Library of Alexandria when it comes to Ferrari :)

    Best,
    Dave
     
  5. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    #30 woodrim, Mar 8, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hello Dave. There were three main methods for building rims; ply laminate (plywood) as used by Derrington, segmented (many early Ferrari wheels), and barrel wound (also called wrapped). The wrapped process is a laminate where seven or eight thin strips of wood are bent around a forn to creat what appears to be a perfect circle of wood. Later Nardi wheels, especially the signature series, with black stripes were done in this method (well, they did cheat a little). This method superseded the segmented style. That same MGA wheel below with a wrapped - barrel wound beech rim.

    woodrim
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  6. Erich

    Erich Formula 3

    Sep 9, 2003
    1,190
    Poway CA
    Full Name:
    Erich Coiner

    Interesting. They must have made a running change. I have a very late Mk1a Tiger. I refinished the wheel. I learned the hard way that the inlay in my wheel is dissolved with Paint remover !! It looked very much like plastic. No chance it was a wood product. The three days I spent picking out the inlay without chipping the wood around it was not a fun time.

    Yes my wheel hub was cracked. I filled it with epoxy putty and sanded and filled and sanded and filled etc. I never had a chance to see a Tiger when they were new, I suspect that is the only time they were uncracked. Someone in the Tiger club has been machining hubs out of billets of Black Delrin as a complete replacement. They look fantastic.
     
  7. Mark Shannon

    Mark Shannon Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 28, 2003
    1,210
    Surrey, UK
    #32 Mark Shannon, Mar 9, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  8. shaughnessy

    shaughnessy Formula 3

    Apr 1, 2004
    1,847
    Wolfeboro NH
    Full Name:
    Thomas E Shaughnessy
    Edward does not always listen or is objective. He clearly has more experience than you and I combined.
    Although some 67 and 68 wheels wil have MOMO as previously stated. NEVER say all or never be objective and listen to experienced individuals

    woodrim provided accurate reliable valuable information.

    After all this FERRARICHAT
     
  9. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Mark: Thanks very much for that picture, is very helpful. Although, since mirrors reverse images, isn't that really a OMOM wheel? ;-)

    Actually, very interesting. I've been trying to piece this all together for some time. I have to wonder if Momo sourced those wheels from Walsall. Walsall was very happy being a provider of wheels for others' names; ie Les Leston. I will see if I can see enough of the wheel in that picture to compare to the Walsall version. The faux guillochet on the spokes will provide some detail for comparison. Back when all this was being done, they never thought it was important enough to document, so information disappeared with the companies and people involved. They never anticipated there would be a steering wheel geek like me.

    I'm away right now on day one of a week long vacation, so I'll get back to it upn my return. Women are funny creatures, but you folks probably know that. Weleft a great house in a great area to drive nine hours to stay in a one bedroom condo next to a highway in Weston, Fla. Call it a vacation and she'll love it, call it home and watch her expression change.

    woodrim
     
  10. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Yes, it's very likely they did when they discovered the plastic crap others were using. The ones I've restored were all wood inlays, although I'm not surprised to learn they changed to plastic. Nardi started out with wood and changed to plastic too.

    I will be interested to know more about the gent who makes the centers; please send me email if you will.

    BTW, wasn't a good idea to use paint remover anyway.

    woodrim
     
  11. jacques

    jacques Formula Junior

    May 23, 2006
    877
    Los Angeles/Florida
    Hello.. My name is Jacques..I have a beautiful Nardi black signature steering wheel that was on my 1985 ser.III XJ6...I bought the car in 1986 with the after-market wheel already on..When I sold the Jag, I of course kept the wheel..My question..the wheel is still in beautful condition with the exception of a small worn area on the under-side..the original owner probably nicked with a wedding band or some such..what would be the possiblity of my just touching up the damage and what was used..laquer,varnish, or urathane..I love this wheel and want ot install it on my 1980 400i..any and all help is much appreciated..thank you all so much in advance..Jacques.
     
  12. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Hello Jacques. I'm afraid my expertise ends with the classic period wheels. However, I would imagine the finish on your wheel was a varnish or urethane. I'm sure you can lightly sand the affected area and coat with urethane with no reaction to the original finish. I guess this is okay if the area isn't easily seen. If I'm not mistaken, the Nardi you speak of is the newer line of fat rim wheels. Keep in mind that they can be had relitively cheap as new. Probably wouldn't pay to have it refinished professionally.

    woodrim
     
  13. 1oldf

    1oldf Karting

    Dec 25, 2007
    86
    Whittier, Calif.
    Full Name:
    George Engelage
    #38 1oldf, Mar 9, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  14. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    2,350
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    Thanks for the response and the great information!
     
  15. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Hello 1oldf. Your wheel is definitely a rarity. I see they did the blind riveting to the boss before making those three cut-outs. I'm not familiar enough with the Corvette to know what those cut-outs were for. I'll check my files when I get back from vacation. Probably the best way of finding an original horn piece would be ebay. That was a great experience you had; I'll probably come up with a few questions for you if you don't mind.

    Off to South Beach now to try to catch some sights.

    woodrim
     
  16. whturner

    whturner Formula Junior

    Nov 25, 2003
    315
    Western Pennsylvania
    Full Name:
    Warren Turner
    My 67 (330 GT sn 10069 - Dec 6 1967 mfg) is a 67 with a MOMO wheel. It is as original as the rest of the car. I would be surprised if there was any exact day (or hour?) that they changed from one supplier to the other. I could take a picture or so if there is any reason to do so.

    Cheers
    Warren
     
  17. Edward 96GTS

    Edward 96GTS F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,303
    tom s,
    i don't believe i ever said "never' or "ever". please be accurate. i said "many". and judging from the responses i have been proven correct.
    edward
     
  18. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Yes, it does appear that Momo supplied some wood wheels. The pictures provided earlier were very helpful and Mark was good enough to send me the full size images. The Momo in the pictures is what I believed to be a Walsall. I will be making some comparisons to pictures I have of two Walsall wheels that I used to have. I curious if the Momos were made by Walsall, making us all correct.

    woodrim
     
  19. whturner

    whturner Formula Junior

    Nov 25, 2003
    315
    Western Pennsylvania
    Full Name:
    Warren Turner
    Hi Mark, Woodrim

    From the picts on the thread mine looks the same as Mark's, except my filler strip on the inside between spokes looks like a gold color plastic and I can't tell on Mark's. And from a previous thread there are others around which are the same.
    Woodrim - I have a couple of pictures I'll send you - for file if nothing else.

    Cheers
    Warren
     
  20. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Thanks, Warren, pictures would be good. In addition to the rim, a crisp image of any spoke will help me make some comparisons in tooling. As for the yellow area between spokes - if I understand correctly where you're talking about, it's just the yellowing of the finish over the aluminum internal rim, which was left exposed. This is what I call a 3/4 wrap, where the wood wraps around the outside edge, but not the inside. The other two rim approaches are sandwich, which has both inner and outer edge exposed (and has rivets or dowels); and full wrap, which has the wood wrapped all around the internal rim.

    My direct email is [email protected]

    woodrim
     
  21. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Can anyone tell me if there is commonality between steering shaft splining on Ferrari, Maserati, and Fiat?

    woodrim
     
  22. Dino Club Germany

    Dino Club Germany Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2008
    549
    Germany
    Full Name:
    N. Schumacher
  23. Randy Forbes

    Randy Forbes Formula Junior

    Jul 14, 2006
    741
    Sarasota, FL
    Full Name:
    Sports Cars Plus,LLC
    #48 Randy Forbes, Mar 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hi Mike (woodrim),

    Nice to see you getting around. It doesn't seem to have been brought up yet, so I'll be the first...

    Mike Lempert is indeed multi-talented, as he has in the past contracted to have the almost unobtainable done for Austin_Healeys; a few years ago, I was fortunate to get in on a round of 3.54:1 ring & pinion sets. The gears looked to be fabulously made and securely packed in form fitted styrofoam and boxes. It was my intention to have my set fitted over this past winter, but I was too busy (a good thing) working on sportscars for others!

    Welcome aboard Mike, and it's nice to see you getting such a pleasant reception.

    Maybe we can talk about you freshening up the Moto-Lita on my Healey (this wheel has sentimental attraction, so a replacement is not an option). Overall, it's not in too bad of shape, but my hands do get "dirty" after a relatively short drive ;)
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  24. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
  25. woodrim

    woodrim Rookie

    Mar 6, 2009
    49
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Mike Lempert
    Hello Randy. Thanks for the kind words. I had seen the name but thought - nah, can't be the same guy. Do you have a Ferrari too? I think I just saw something about you having a Cobra? Is that a new addition?

    Good that you mentioned the sentimental attachment to that Moto-Lita or I definitely would have suggested replacing it. Are you also attached to that plywood rim? Although the colors have been pretty much muddled by time and exposure, the real Derringtons had a nice laminate rim of contrasting colors made from obeechi and mahogany. You just can't find plywood like that today. I make my own laminates:
    http://www.pbase.com/mdlempert/image/109865405

    woodrim
     

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