Why so much Cali hate?

That brings up another good point...Ferrari burst onto the World stage in the 80's and 90's because it was so unique. Ferrari was miles away from any other car on the road...in look and function. They sold Dream cars.

Now..... 612/599/575/Cali... if they didn't have a badge saying "Ferrari" I don't think 9 out of 10 people could tell you what type of car they were looking at.

Gone are the days when kids grew up dreaming of owning a Dino, F-40, 308, 355 or TR. Ferrari has lost its uniquely exotic look, and the performance gap has closed as cars like Nissan's GT-R have come along.

I just wonder what Ferrari will be all about in 30 years... when today's teens grow up? In my day... all my friends had a Ferrari poster on the bedroom wall, and quite a few have grown up to realize their dream.

With today's current designs...I don't see kids dreaming about Ferrari anymore.

 

I ubderstand your thinking. But I don't think that time has come quite yet. My young son and I took my 599 out this weekend and stretched its legs a little bit. While stopped at a light he says " Look dad at the car next to us . The kids in the back seat are waving, smiling and taking pictures of our car with their cell phones." Maybe it is more about the badge than the car these days. Bur childrens faces never lie and the magic is still there.

 

I respectfully beg to differ regarding kids. You should come to our monthly car show at Gainey Village in Scottsdale to see the reactions of young kids to Ferraris. The cars are mostly modern Ferraris and they always have a crowd of kids snapping pictures ceaselessly. I also have several friends whose teenage kids are always angling to come over and look at the cars whenever they can. The attraction of Ferraris to kids is alive and well and thriving, and I guess because of the prevalence of Ferraris in video games they are well versed in the modern cars and lust after them with fervor. The jaded bunch on FChat are hardly representative of the population at large and I'll bet you there's not a kid alive who would take a Nissan GTR over a 599GTB.

 

+1 in my town, as well.

Indeed, jaded or not, I'd venture a guess that there aren't many adults (save those with long term/terminal concussion related issues) that would pick a GTR over a 599.

 

Bingo.

"Give that man a woman in the balcony".

 

I didn't say the engine wasn't Ferrari, it is "amortized", fully depreciated.*

Please...

Which Maseratis, Alfas, Ferraris and FIATs shared engines and transmissions in the past, aside from the Dinos?

No-one makes their own shocks and electrics, they aren't the heart or soul of a car.

In the past they've cribbed trim pieces, taillights, auxiliary controls; not chassis, engines and transmissions.*


*All part of building 100% markup.

 

¿Que?!

 

technically all V8s up to the F360 are Dino engines, thus the cars are Dinos as well, as a Ferrari is an engine with a car around it, per Enzo Ferrari's ethos. After the 360 the engine platform changed and the sharing ramped up. The new 8C, Maser GT, F430 share the same engine platforms, are variants of the other. No the engines are not the same, but are derived from the Ferrari engine. The MC12 and Enzo Ferrari share the same engine.

 

+1

 

Hey, pal, isn't that a little hard to argue when the 360 has a 5 valve, V-8 versus a V-6 on the Dino? Don't you really mean to say that it was evolved from the Dino engine?

Claiming the 360 is a really a Dino is ridiculous no matter what you believe about the engine's origin. Whether Enzo said it or not, claiming that a Ferrari is an engine with a car around it is ridiculous also, as it ignores all the Ferrari engineering that goes into the whole car. Engines aren't the only Ferrari value-add. Are you implying they are an engine company and not a car maker?

Are you arguing that Ferrari is the equivalent of Cosworth?

 

Charliehorse is correct. The 308 series started it's life as a Dino in the GT4. The lineage back is pretty well documented.

I would argue that Ferrari "burst" into the scene more because of good marketing rather than product.

1) Making a low cost V-8 car and putting the Ferrari label on it
2) Introducing a EPA/DOT legal 12 cylinder for the US market
3) Putting the cars on Magnum PI and Miami Vice

Instead of complaining about it, we should embrace it. After all, it was the success of these cars that has allowed the Ferrari's of today. If Ferrari had stayed only with 12 cylinder cars and not sent them to the US, they would be more like Nobel is today.

You can even argue whether that is a good thing or bad thing.

 

...All contemporary, not past.

...All evidence of the same rot.

...All Three-Card-Montezemolo.

 

Just because some people learned all they know about Ferrari from bullsh*t TV shows does not mean Ferrari were unknown beforehand.

 

They would more like Alfa is today. Completely subsumed within Fiat. I don't think that anybody here thinks that would be better than things are now.

 

breathe deep, relax, inhale.... exhale...... relax.....


you can do it

 

This highlights another huge fallacy, that 'Ferrari needed the Dark Side to survive': Pure nonsense.

Ferrari were doing just fine before Montezemolo harnessed them to the draft horse that is the Cali 2+.

It's "leveraging The Brand" to fleece the rubes that will be their undoing.

 

Look on the bright side, Ferrari has stayed closer to its roots than their main competitor. Thank god we don't have an SUV or a 4 door sedan in the line up to ***** and moan about...

 

4) it looks like a Buick product


(not that I have the means to own one, but if I did my money wouldn't go there)

 

True, but a full-branded knock-off is nothing to cheer about, either...

'The Ferrari 924: When you think no one will know the difference'.

 

After all the hype i wasn't sure what to expect when I saw the new Cali in the flesh today at CAS. First impression: It is much smaller than I thought it would be considering the 3800 lbs. its carrying. Second impression: Its BORING with an equally boring interior to compliment it. Third impression: Its horribly overpriced. Final thoughts: Definately a womans ride. Slightly larger than Maser Spider but basically at least on the outside a Lexus and or Miata with a ferrari badge and a ferrari price. To be fair I didn't get to ride or drive it or even hear the engine. But the backseat is truly non existant and the rear end is simply too large. But all of that could probably be forgiven if it had the old ferrari magic. Unfortuantely in my opinion it does not. The whole visual experience simply lacked any real substance and depth. A marketing tool for a ridiculously high price whose sole intention is to gouge those unfamiliar with the mark. Just my opinion. Others I'm sure will disagree.

 

Ok I only read 200 of the 600 posts but this one is the closest to reality.

Plus One. Ferrari has an unbelievable group of ugly cars from prior years.

Plus one million......This unfortunately is a typical Forum problem. Having people tell you how your car handles because they read a magazine

Why do so many dislike it. How many of them have actually driven a newer Ferrari?

Yes too many buy the new Ferrari's with absolutely no true ability to drive them.

The only thing a MB SL600 serves well is depreciation. Anyone that can compare a car with 50% depreciation in 12-14 months to any model Ferrari really isn't thinking clearly.


Yep Ferrari stepped out of it's Norm here. Why not. Porsche is Rich because of it. Did Porsche sell out when they built the 996 many would say yes. I don't. I have a 993 Turbo S the prize of 1997 except the rare gt2. I also have a 997 gt3rs and they aren't even on the same playing field guys. The newer Porsche watercooled or not will spank it in every aspect. No questions asked. No one can deny. Porsche also now OWNS VW.

Hmmmmm. You think the Ferrari board of directors doesn't want to make money. You are crazy.

Ferrari now has a car that appeals to so many more then the typical 308 driving 15000 post F chatters. It seems that you guys are all pissed about it. Why?

Why because the typical hater can't afford one? All of you saying that the last True Ferrari is the 355 are f'n nuts. Drive the new cars and tell me the same thing. You won't. I love the 355 styling and looks. But no one will drive a 355 and then a 430 and walk away telling me they like the 355 more. They would be lying. They lack the true performance of the new cars.
There's not a 512TR guy on this board either that will tell me they'd rather track their car then a new Scud. They'd be lying as well. These guys sure will sing all day long that theirs is a true 12 Cylinder and a real Ferrari.

No different then the F1 Haters. Come on guys get real. F1 kills 6 speeds in timing. The new Scuds are faster than my sequential boxes in the 997 Cups I raced. Sorry it's just a reality.

Life comes down to choices and in the high end car world mostly what you can afford. No different then housing. If you can afford the better neighborhood and bigger house. You move.

The new California has good lines (not like the 60's versions) but with a car that my girlfriend and I can take out anywhere, anytime and blend in a bit but still have good performance. Add in a hardtop convertible combo I am truly looking forward to her's coming in. Yes I said Her's. She wouldn't possibly drive any of the racer boy 430's and 599's because they are too flashy. Yes I still keep the 430S (when it arrives June) and the 430 Spider in the garage because that is the type of Ferrari I like the most.

The California will never be a car I'm afraid to drive because it's girlie with a bunch of haters. I'll enjoy the car the way it was supposed to. Rain/Shine who cares with it. It's made for year round driving and I hope to get about 5k a year on it. With all of my others.

 

When you've put 20 or 30 k on it and you are looking at the latest greatest, send me a pm.

 

I'm sorry but I've got say it. I've owned three ferraris. A 328,TR, and currently a 599. All purchased new and at MSRP. I've seen the Cali up close and to be fair I have not driven one or rode in one. But the visual impact of the car to be kind is less than exiciting inside and out. The new California is tasteless, over hyped and waywayway overpriced for what it is. It is to be quite blunt a 3800 lb. "lipstick on a pig" marketing tool. I parked my 599 next to it and it only made my car look that much more stunning. I only hope people who see the Cali will recognize it for what it is and not confuse the front of it with a 599. For those who buy one,enjoy it in good health.

 

I used to think the same about C classes when I parked my S class next to them. It's the new entry level car, different segment.

 

I do agree with the overpriced part. If Ferrari can get that kind of money for the car, more power to them, but I think if they do it will more reflection of the utility/appliance mind set of the other manufacturers than a major accomplishment on their part. In other word the Cali is competing in a vacuum.

I've said it before and I will say it again: in a heartbeat I would trade all of the Cali's luxury features, including the fancy roof, for the exact same car, (front V8, rear transaxle, 2+2 coupe), but with lots more of that most precious of automotive assets: lightness! A car like the Alfa 8c should have be, but isn't as far as I can tell, as they are remarkably heavy for their size and configuration.