Massa's post race comments ***SPOILER***

No asterisk for the season. I think the rules were very foggy, but you can't penalize Brawn for out-thinking Ferrari et al. I do blame Max and Bernie for creating a multi-car grid with total inconsistency, but that's another issue. Honestly , Red Bull did a great job also, fielding a car with no diffuser or KERS that is the equal of Brawn (save questionable qualifying strategy).

 

gaps between cars are closer than last year ... i wouldn't call that total inconsistency, i'd call that an improvement.

 

Hit the nail on the head again Andreas. You can not blame anyone or anything else for the results this season. Its not like Ferrari is alone with this situation. McLaren and BMW, both running at the front or winning in 2009, now they too are backmarkers.

The rules and/or the FIA are not the problem. The interpretation of the rules is no ones fault but those teams that: 1) did not listen to Ross Brawn one year ago about tightening the loop holes, and 2) were not smart enough to be smart about interpreting the rules. Three major teams fell flat on their blind asses while three hungrier teams read the printed rules and also between the lines.

Good job to Brawn, Williams, and Toyota. The rest of them, blew it. No sympathy.

 

I believe you are also correct. The sour grapes about the rules are really silly, if one was a diehard Brawn, Williams, or Toyota fan, you would see nothing wrong with the rules. You would only see that some teams have better race engineers than others. The fact that Ferrari is doing poorly is Ferrari's fault.

What inconsistency? Like there is not a difference in rules interpretations every year? Moveable floors for example. One of the attractions of F1 is watching to see how clever the race engineers can be while staying within the rules. The early bird gets the worm. In this case the early diffuser gets the podium.

It also seems now that the rules really did not need clarifying. The teams without the diffusers, that have now added them, did not need new rules to figure out how to build and install them. They only had to go back and reread the original rules with egg on their face, and read them whilst standing under a brighter light. Duh!

It also seems that having the diffusers is not the only reason that the Brawn is doing so well. It is the entire package that is superior. Look at the performance of the non-diffuser Red Bull, and now look at the performance of the newly diffusered Ferrari. The Ferrari is still not up to speed with the Brawn. It still does not have the entire package. The Red Bull is brilliant, so changing their chassis to add diffusers may possibly hurt them.

This excuse about unclear rules is silly, it is unclear race engineers, not unclear rules.

 

F-drivers say the Ferrari F60 still lacks the downforce generated by the ‘diffuser three.’ That's a big factor this year. It's unclear how that issue will be rectified, but no doubt it has to be settled quickly.

 

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? HELL NO!!!

It is a long season. Anything can happen. Many wrote off Kimi two years ago when he was down (I believe it was 16 or 18 points) with two races to go, and he went on to win the WDC. My point is to never give up, Ferrari doesn't give up and neither should its fans. True, the team sucks @$$ right now and is averaging 1.2 points a race but I won't give up hope till Ferrari is mathematically eliminated. Call it stupid optimism or whatever, the team needs us more than ever.

So who's with me?
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Remember, when Bluto ran out of the house, he ran out by himself. Then he came back in and yelled at the guys in the room.

Unless we have a few tricks up our sleeve, we just better start enjoying the season for what it is--a very nice reminder that nothing in life is certain, and that if you work really hard and you innovate, then good things can happen.

I am no Button fan, but his team seems to have found the formula for success, and it is good for F-1. The stuffed shirts at McL, Ferrari and BMW needed a good dose of humility. They got complacent, and their institutional-think, en masse, did not allow them to see the angle of the trick diffuser.

Good to see that Vettel and Weber and Timo and others can have hopes of winning or a podium.

 

...so this is a 'fake championship' now is it...? Come on, if Ferrari had the twin-diffuser and not Brawn,McLaren etc, you would all be saying that Ferrari was 'smarter' than the other teams, and they should have done their research as well as Ferrari etc, etc,..blah, blah.. Ferrari have blown it. This is the 'classic' Ferrari of the 80's and early 90's. Chaotic, mismanaged, comical. They had the BEST man in F1...and LdeM decided to give him the boot....right into Honda/Brawn. Brilliant! With strategic thinking like that, it will be another decade before they see a WCC and WDC again. They can't design a good looking road car anymore...and they can't design an F1 car either. What a debacle. Time for LdeM to go.

 

Just to be clear, I only mean we have a grid with a) cars with KERS, b) cars with double diffusers, c) cars with KERS and double-diffusers, d) cars with neither KERS or diffusers. Normally there is much more consistency among the grid. That said, it does make the grid more interesting than a "spec series" so I'm not arguing against it. I just don't think the rules/expectations were entirely clear to all teams.

 

All I can say is "wow!!"...

 

..ok, the're not chaotic, mismanaged, comical. They are actually organised, brilliantly managed, serious. The results prove that...don't they..?

 

I think you misinterpreted my comment. I thought you gave a searing indictment of where the team is right now. I certainly didn't intend to indicate any disagreement.

 

I can't believe the strange and awkward mistakes Ferrari have made so far this year. Obviously they don't have a shot at either of the titles but what else is at stake is even greater. Ferrari are sabotaging their own effort with what can only be called shoddy build quality and stupid, trivial mistakes. I'm hoping Ross Brawn and his team can pull off what many thought would be the impossible just a few short months ago. Williams, Redbull and Toyota too. It does the sport good. I also like seeing new faces on the podium. They genuinely feel as though they deserve to be there and their excitement is something that was missing in years past.

 

Umm...what?
You do realise the even without race pace, McLaren have almost twice the number of points Ferrari do. And would likely have more if they hadn't decided to bend the truth after Melbourne.

Where the hell are you pulling this from? Is it based on ANYTHING remotely factual?

It's pretty sad how much Ferrari have fallen in terms of strategy. Their car was pretty useless in '05 and bits of '06, but even then I enjoyed watching the races because they had the personnel on the pit wall who could extract the best results in an inferior car. I think it was San Marino '06, where pit strategy gave Schumacher the lead and the win with Alonso all over his gearbox. Now, I'm actually watching the races to see what new and innovative ways Ferrari can come up with to lose points. Really highlights the role Brawn/Todt and co. played within the team.

 

Kimi to Filipe after the race: "Here Phil, have a popsicle"

 

There is always things that some teams develop that others don't. Remember the areo wheel caps? IIRC it was on Toyota, Ferrari and McLaren. Then they appeared on the other cars, now they all have them. The movable front wing was first on McLaren and Ferrari, then the others. Or the shark-fin engine cover. On one-two cars (I forget who) first, then they all started using them.

The only difference IMO was that the diffusers were a big deal to change, and that some teams had asked Charlie if their designs were legal and were told no. They now claim their designs were legal with the re-interpreted rules, but who knows really, since it was never scrutinized officially then and now.

As for major differences in cars (KERS vs Non KERS), there is a lot of precedent for this... remember when you could run a V8 or a V10? We had both cars on the track. Or when we had a tire war, there were years the b-stones were waaaay better than the Michelins, and the b-stone runners were just untouchable. It reversed in other years.

I don't mind the optional KERS thing... better than having a stock series.

 

On a positive note: the Ferrari this race was the most improved car on the grid performance wise. Which is very impressive compared to where they were and to the other big teams. Steve is right that FIA should have cleared the rules situation up before the start op the season. That's no sour grapes, that's just the bottom line.

I also noticed that there still are all sorts of aero parts sticking out on the body, especially around the barge board area. I thought these were supposed to be banned as well? And is the double diffuser now here to stay, or should it be banned fro 2010 on so that cars will be able to run closer together (as was the intention of the changes to the aero package)?

I like a bit of competition as much as anybody so that's the exciting part at the moment. But the playing field is not quite level.

 

It was on Ferrari first. If article I read is correct, Ferrari uses CO2 in the tire to transfer tire heat to the wheel and the hubcap channels the hot air out of the wheel. This came out during Mclaren Spygate, and was part of the blackmail that Alonso tried to use on Dennis.

But the gist is there. F1 is full of clever guys and something that visible, and it's only a matter of time until people figure out what's what. IIRC a team (forgot which) tried just the hubcaps and didn't get any benefit from them.

 

As least Ferrari can develop the car for next year's rules and smoke everyone.

 

I do like the 430 a lot, but have to agree that the rest of the road cars' designs are less exciting than they used to be. And the F1 team is in disarray. Something at the top is fishy, but I don't think we're back in 80ties territory. At least I hope not.

Since you quoted WWII: Every General knows when a battle is lost and when it is time to regroup. Giving up on 2009 doesn't mean retreat from F1, but concentrating your forces on a battle you have a chance to win: 2010

I'm into space flight, so my comparison would be with JFK when he realized that he can't beat the Soviets at any of their space stunts in the early sixties: Pick a goal so big and so far away, that you have a chance again at beating the competition. Same applies to F1: Ferrari will not succeed at playing catch up this season to realistically have a shot at the title, but 2010 is away enough to stage a comeback.

 

+1...Agreed Andreas...Agreed 100%

Bloody good post

 

Dragging the thread way off topic but did anyone else notice that JB ran these in the race, but Rubens didn't have 'em on the rear of his car......

 

They talked about this during the BBC coverage. Something about Rubens being very sensitive to the brake balance. (?)

 

Yes but it would be nice if FIA could make up their mind and set out a clear set of rules for 2010. Then Ferrari would know what to focus on.

 

So what exactly is the point you are trying to make? Thing is, Kimi acts like he doesn't give a rats@ss, and he acts like that the minute the season took off. His so called 'devil may care'-attitude which he loves so much is frankly nothing more than an appaling lack of professionalism.