FIA and FOTA find an agreement!

What a sham? We'll know what's up next time they cry wolf with a breakaway series. Looks like it was just a power play from the start with Bernie ultimately caving in a bit to keep the money flowing.

 

That is my understanding as well. Developmentcosts were high at that time, with all the technical freedom regarding active suspension and full automatic gearboxes and such.

 

+1,000000

I'm a little surprised we haven't heard anything from the pygmy yet......

 

Its the wind tunnel and aero developments that lead the expenditures now. They pretty much run those things non-stop. The computing power needed is unbelievable and is why you saw AMD as one of Ferrari's partner/sponsors.....

 

No, I am not wrong. You are quite wrong, but that's OK. I haven't been on anyone's side all along as you say. I have indicated my disappointment at both the FIA and at FOTA.

I have supported the reduction of costs so new teams can enter F1. Even Bernie made this call public last week. Call it what you want, it is still budget restrictions, much different than what was proposed by FOTA. FOTA's plan wasn't going to work, Ross Brawn's deal to stay with FOTA was budget restrictions. Face it, FOTA really never showed any concrete plans to cost reduction or how they would help new teams.

Read: "As part of this agreement, the teams will, within two years, reduce the costs of competing in the championship to the level of the early 1990s. (If I remember correctly, even Ferrari was at around $200 mill USD at that time). I certainly call this budget control renamed to be politically correct.

I have been saying all along there would not be a break away series, that there would be budget restrictions of some sort, and that Max would be gone in October. The teams can't get a much bigger piece of the TV pie as its not Bernie's to give. They already get 47%. CVC gets most of the rest.

I disagree with you, you have a one sided perception of this entire debacle. In 6 months, it won't matter. Face it Michael, you had a boner for Mosley, so in your mind, you see his departure as total defeat for the FIA. I don't, maybe because I do not consider the FIA and Max as one. Max will be gone, the FIA is around for a while. The FIA wanted budget restricitions, they got them.

I don't see that FOTA won this, I don't see that the FIA won this, I do see that it is very likely that FOM won this. As race fans, all we won is there will only be one series. Nothing else.

 

+1 on the first part - One of the reasons Ross is on record as saying they're proposal was no more than 3 aero updates being allowed per season.... That obviously made *way* too much sense for the crazy man of course....... It'll be interesting to see if it comes to anything.

As for the tunnels, the "testing rules" state:

How the hell they police that I have no idea but them's the rules apparently.....

Cheers,
Ian

 

You did, through Mosley and through LdM. They both agreed to make each other look good, which their speeches give the appearance. Bernie gets his agreements until 2012 and beyond. Bernie wins.

 

I'm more curious to see how the schedule looks for 2010 & beyond...

 

Not even close to the numbers the crazy man wanted - 40MM, *maybe* 60MM. He may have even negotiated to 100MM. What we've got now is some sort of nebulous "similar to the early '90's" restriction - 200MM is not in any way shape of form a "real" budget constraint for most of these guys.

Sure, they're all saying the necessary conciliatory things, but there's no way the FIA "won".

Cheers,
Ian

 

+100!!

Oh ya, the FIA won alright. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

FOTA won on all points. They wanted cost restrictions implemented in an intelligent manor...they got it. FIA wanted budget caps implemented in a ridiculous manor...they didn't get it. FOTA wanted Max out to insure proper governance...they got it.

FOTA is allowing the FIA to remain in control under FOTA's terms.

 

FOTA got real time concessions. The FIA got vapour ware promises of two hamburgers on Wednesday.

 

Seems like a 50/50 win to me.

 

One of two possibilities:

1. He's passed out in a drunken stupor after celebrating too hard and too long.
2. He's delivering a bath chair and admission to the crazy house to Paris.....

 

we chatted late yesterday

Carol

 

You are an optimist aren't you?
I just hope he's not hiding in the bushes in front of Max's place with a broad ax.

 

Headlines: I JUMPED I WASN'T PUSHED . . . . .Max Mosley has insisted that far from being pushed out of his position as FIA President by the Formula One Teams' Association (FOTA), it was always 'planned, agreed, arranged' that he would step down at the end of his current term in October.

Max is still playing the twisted words game - now he saying . . . "My departure was planned, agreed, arranged – all the staff have known for months, but obviously I couldn't say it publicly because the moment you do you lose all your influence. Now I don't need influence, it's a satisfactory situation. I can have a peaceful summer for the first time in three years.”

I find it hard to believe that there are actually posters on here who support this damned old fool.


Way to go Mike - you ARE THE ONLY ONE HERE WITH SENSE and your posts are the only ones that are accurate ! ! !

Carol

 

So ticket prices will stay the same?

 

He's probably applying preparation H to his bum... will be for some days, probably

 

40 hours total or just when the fan is blowing at the desired test parameter? Very vague rule IMHO. It does not take long to blow wind across a part or chassis and retrieve data.....I guarantee you once they have the data, they are crunching data night and day. 40 hours is a ton of time when you really think about how long it takes to setup and tear down, etc. They can also devise ways to test multiple items during the same run session I would presume.

How you police that is right, but restricting the hours only creates more cost as you've got these super computers now to "simulate" before they go into the tunnel which is verifying the theoretical results to real world. I don't think the software is nearly perfected as it is still considered one of the few black arts of sorts that still exist.

 

See y'all in Montreal!

 

Ron, you are wrong - totally and completely. You're probably more stubborn than even I, so I know you won't acknowledge it, but I know you know it to be true!

Max said again and again that there MUST be a budget cap. The teams said they had alternative methods for reducing costs, but were against a cap.

Well, there is no cap. FOTA won. It was not a compromise - FOTA's ideas were implemented, the FIA's were scrapped. On this point, FOTA won completely and without question.

As I said, it is about governance. And on this point, FOTA also won. Mosley is finished, he's gone. F1 will be run by the "F1 commission", and rules will be frozen for 3 years. So the ability of Max to implement rules as he sees fit was utterly destroyed. FOTA won this point completely and totally, and the FIA lost completely and totally.

The "reduce costs to 1990's levels" is a very nebulous statement... it isn't commital at all and leaves a lot of room for movement. Max *insisted* that there would be a budget cap. I'll post the quotes if you don't believe me. He said he was flexible on the amount, but it must be a cap. He lost. Plain and simple. Not only did he lose the argument, he lost his job.

And yes, I have hated Mosley for a long time. But if you look at my posts, I've supported and blasted Mosley on various things. I've supported and blasted Bernie too. I've supported and blasted Luca as well. So it's not about being unable to see reality because I just hate Max... I've been calling it like I see it all along.

You're spinning this like it's a 50/50 compromise. It's the furthest thing from! The FIA lost totally and completely. EVERY SINGLE ONE of FOTAs demands were granted, NONE of the FIAs were.

How is that anything other than a total win for FOTA? They won. Completely, decisively and overwhelmingly. FIA lost in the same manner, period.

 

I like that

for those that don't know... "I will gladly pay you Friday for a hamburger today..." LOL!

Mosley wanted to save face... the cost numbers are a nebulous non-commited goal that really doesn't even have a number affixed. Who spent the most in the 1999 season? Probably McLaren. What was their budget? IIRC a few hundred million.

And it's not even clear when/if that will come to pass and what the number will be.

"Buget cap" my ass!
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That's crazy talk, but thank you. I owe you a beer

 

Checkmate FOTA. Nuff said.