to ABS or not ABS? Ah, that is the question!!

Note: this is a preliminary FAQ for the prospective 328 owner. Comments and corrections are appreciated

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Ferrari 328 primer, version 0.1 (a work in progress)


Congratulations! You've decided you want a Ferrari, and have decided that the 328 is your style.

Now you have questions, right? Believe it or not, there's a ton of previously-posted information here on Ferrarichat that might help you. All you have to do is use the search function. See the "search" in the blue bar on the upper left? Click there, and type in the following:

328 maintenance

328 buying advice

328 major service

328 performance


You'll see there's a ton of threads on the 328. Let's try to narrow down some of the collected wisdom on 328s.

Section 1: The basic car

Q: What are the differences in the year models?

A: Between the 86-88 models, there's not really a major difference. There are running changes as shown below. The major update came in mid 88 with suspension changes that preceeded the installation of antilock braking systems in the 89 models. With the new suspension came convex wheels, replacing the previous concave ones.

Q. What about this 88.5 model year, and the premium for 1989 model year cars?

A: There seems to be a slight premium for post 88.5 cars. Part of this is likely due to the perceived advantages of the ABS system. Another part is simply the fact that newer cars carry a price advantage against older cars regardless of the brand. A third part of the premium is due to a number of very-low mileage 1989 328s that are on the market. These cars were set aside during the Ferrari boom on the late 80s as an investment, and tend to be priced much higher.


Q. But the ABS -- is it worth that much more?

A: This will be a personal decision. It is a very early system. Here's a couple of reviews/comments from owners of ABS-equipped cars

Q: What kind of performance does the 328 offer? Will it keep up with today's sportscars?

A: The 328 is equipped with a 3.2 litre all-aluminum V8 that puts out either 260 HP in US trim, or 270 HP in euro trim with the higher compression pistons. That was a lot of power 19 years ago, but there are now minivans that have equivalent horsepower ratings. Still, the Ferrari will take about 6 seconds to reach 60 MPH, and will run happily over 100 all day long. To get the best performance out of the 3.2 motor you really need to keep it above 5000 RPM. Luckily, that's where it sounds best!

For a discussion of the 328 and more modern cars, see "Has my dream of 308/328 ownership become irrelevant?" and "Performance difference in a 308/328 and a 350Z..."

Q: I've heard about this strange seating position. I'm a tall guy, can I fit in one?

A: See "How tall is too tall?"

Q: Ok, what about those of us with a few extra pounds?

A: The author of this document is 5'9" and weighs 290 lbs. If I can get in, you probably can too...

(edit several years later: it fits fine at 5'9" and 180 too. WOOT!)


Section 2: Mechanical

Q: What does it cost to run one of these?

A: "It depends."

Ok, that's a bit of a cop-out, but it really is going to depend on a few things: initial condition of the car, your driving habits, the environment you're in, etc. The key thing is to remember that the youngest 328 is still 16 years old, so as on any older car things are going to need repair. Even if the car has been stored and has almost no miles on it, rubber ages and seals dry out. There is a canard that is thrown around "A Ferrari costs $1/mile to run." While not necessarily true, some people use that as a quick guide.

Q: What about these minor and major services?

A: In brief, a minor service is one in which the fluids are changed, the car is given a good look-over, and the valves are adjusted. A major service includes all of that, plus changing the camshaft belts and tensioners. Many people also rebuild the waterpump during a major service. The specific list of required maintenance is included in the owner's manual. A copy of the owner's manual is available in pdf format at http://ferrari.jenkins.org/books/328_owners.pdf

See also How much do you spend each year?

Q: And the mileage/time requirments for these services?

A: This is almost a religious/political argument. The big problem is that Ferrari has published conflicting information about the cambelt replacement schedule over the years, despite the fact that the same belt is used. The rule of thumb in the States seems to be 30,000 miles/5 years, while in the UK dealers are quoting every 2 years. Ferrari's manual for the States clearly shows 52,500 miles for a cambelt replacement.

The reason this is such a hot button is that the labor costs of replacing those belts are high (much higher here in the States than abroad), and that the effects are so catastrophic if they fail. Because the Ferrari V8 motor is an "interference" motor, the valves and the pistons actually share space, cycling out of each others' way. If the timing belt breaks or skips teeth, the valves and pistons will meet and result in broken and bent parts. This is a very expensive repair.

See "CAMBELT REPLACEMENT EXPOSED" for a rather lengthy discussion of cambelt replacement.

Q: What does a major service cost?

A: Once again, "it depends". The cost will vary depending on whether you take your car to a Ferrari dealer, or to an independent mechanic. It will also depend on what else you do while it's in the shop. It's very easy to get into the "might as well" mode and spend much more than the service alone would require. Also, the definition of a major service may vary from shop to shop. For some, it's just a matter of changing the belts, adjusting the valves, changing the fluid and buttoning it back up. Other shops might take a more extensive approach it the maintenance.

This post from a shop principal gives a great perspective:

Q: What is this talk about test pipes?

A: The 328 has a dual ignition system, which means that each bank of the motor acts as a separate 4 cylinder engine. It is possible to have an ignition failure on just one bank. If this happens, raw fuel can be pumped through the bad bank and end up in the catalytic converter.

The catalytic converter runs much much hotter than the rest of the exhaust system, and so the fuel can ignite inside the cat. There is a warning light in the cockpit if the temperature gets too high, known as the "slow-down light." Operation of the light is described in the owner's manual.

Some people wish to reduce the threat of cat fires and replace the cat with a piece of plain tubing or sometimes a resonator. Because these pipes are technically illegal, they are sold for "testing purposes" and are thus known as "test pipes." Many of the installations also result in a louder or deeper exhaust note.

Q: What is a Tubi?

A: A Tubi is one brand of aftermarket exhaust for the 328. Many like the sound of the Tubi exhaust, others like competitors such as Ansa, Stebro, Quicksilver, and many more.

Q; Are they reliable?

A: If well maintained, the 328 is a mechanically reliable car. Some auxillary systems such as the A/C, accessories, window lifts are sometimes problematic. The waterpump on the car also tends to need close monitoring.

See 328 XC x 2 for an account of a 328 owner who drove across Canada -- twice!

Q: What about high mileage cars?

A: The Ferrari world is a strange place. Here, a car that has travelled 2500 miles a year is considered high mileage, while any other brand would consider it low mileage. The undeniable fact is that Ferraris average much lower mileage than normal cars, and that plays into the purchasing decision. It is harder to sell a higher mileage car, and resale will usually be lower. That may be offset by a lower purchase price when you get the car.

Higher mileage cars will tend to show more wear in the interior and may need suspension refreshes earlier than low mileage cars. On the positive side, the motor in the 328 is very robust, and many have been reported over 100,000 miles with out rebuilds.

For a spirited debate on this topic, see Why is 56,600 miles considered high mileage?

Q: What about low mileage cars?

A: The other side of the coin. Low mileage is desireable to some, to a point. Very low mileage cars should look almost new, with no wear on the interior, no evidence of being taken apart, and little to no paint problems. Beware, however, the no-mile and no-maintenance "Garage Queen". There are those who believe that because their car hasn't reached the mileages listed in the maintenance schedule, the maintenance isn't due. As mentioned earlier, rubber and such deteriorates even when not in use -- rubber such as timing belts. It is highly likely that the buyer of an extremely low mileage car will spend a great deal in the early months of ownership replacing seals, belts and such.

Another point to consider is that the odometer on the 308/328 is very easy to disconnect and the speedometers have been known to fail. Always compare the condition of the car to the listed mileage, and check the records to confirm mileage between services.

Again, see Are High Miles or Low Miles Better on a 328?

Q: These records you speak of, what are they?

A: Most owners maintain precise records of repairs, services and expenditures. These records can be useful in determining what has been done to the car, and what is due to be repaired. Some cars have records back to the original delivery, and others have gaps. In general, what you are looking for is proof of the most recent major service and records during the current owner's tenure. A complete record set offers ease of mind and may make a car easier to sell, but a missing oil change record from 1992 usually won't be a deal killer.


Section 3: Buyer's Guides

Q: Any buyer guides out there?

A: This post probably sums it up best

TO BE CONTINUED

 

It's usually a safe bet that the newest model year of any car brings more than an earlier model. In this case, the ABS version is the late '88/89 model of the 328 so in addition to being the newest 328 model, the ABS is also the rarest model since they only made it for essentially a year.

 

The purists may tell you one thing, but the market quite another. Prices indicate that 89's are the most sought after with good reason IMO and I am most certainly a purist. However, all years are great and I would never try to argue with someone preferring an earlier year.

Dave

 

I know Dave always prefers the ABS car and I do not.

The vote is even

1-1


The market does prefer them though.

 

Anyone knows how many '89 328 were made?

 

I have an '88.5 (i.e., post-76626) which is the best of both worlds in a sense.

All the improvements of the '89s minus ABS complexity.

And from a styling standpoint I prefer the later convex wheels over the earlier sunken ones.

 

ABS spells U-G-L-Y!
Flame suit on and duck.

 

Hard to count. The US is the only country I am aware of the has an assigned model year. Some base model year on when the car was imported or first sold. Ferrari themselves really don't even go by model year. They go by VIN or Assy #. The US has a model year designator in the VIN. Other countries do not. Makes an exact count impossible.

For US cars 89 started around 78335 built in late Sep 88.

About 1500 cars and one year later 83136, the last car was built.

But ABS had been around as an option since 76626, a European car that was built around May 88.

 

Whoa, nice work

 

Get the best car you can find. Overall, the 328s are great cars no matter what year you go for. I have an '89 and I love it. As for the wheels, I am so used to them I don't give them a second thought and I like them. Initially, I prefered the early 328 wheels, but then again when the 328 came out I much prefered the wheels of the 308QV to the wheels of the 328...so maybe that just says I am not a fan of change.

Best regards,
Dino

 

My 328 is a US model s/n 76713 and the door plate says it was built in March 88. The original owner took delivery on June 27, 1988 from Cavallino Classics in Scottsdale, AZ.

 

I'm with Dave (5 percenters stick together). So it's 2-1. We win!

 

Thanks. You're correct it is March, records show that pretty clearly. Brain fade on my part.

 

As far as ABS is concerned, I could take it or leave it but I do greatly prefer the feel of the later suspension. There are not very many "88.5's" out there as you know, especially in GTB form.

dave

 

I would not buy an ABS car. The system works well and it is pretty durable, but they do fail. The price and availability of the major components will make an owner long for a good 'ole fashioned master cylinder and vacuum booster.

Another problem that I have encountered only once, is that the steering rack is mounted differently in the ABS cars. Instead of through bolts with a nut on the end, the ABS steering racks are mounted by a bolt threaded into a captive nut. The bolts have threads at the mating surface of the rack and the car frame and the back and forth thrust of the rack fractured the bolts at the join. I could not get the broken piece of bolt out because of restriced access, so I had to take some meassurements and drill a small hole in the floorboard in order to drill and "Easy-Out" the broken piece from the back end.

If you have an ABS car, it might be worth your time to check the tightness of these mounting bolts, or just replace them with new.

 

My advice, and I think Winston Goodfellow said the same in an old Forza buyer's guide on the 328s, is that the best value is with a pre-'89 car. Is old ABS better than no ABS? Probably. Is it worth a ~$10K premium? Probably not.

It depends on your taste, but to my eyes the convex 328 wheels seriously detract from the looks of the car -- to the extent that I would probably swap them for some aftermarket Speedlines (and I generally don't like aftermarket wheels on 328s.) I did consider a late 328 a few years back, but only because it was blu sera/crema and in super nice condition -- a hard color combination to find, especially as nice as this car was.

But the important thing is to get a really good, well-maintained, properly driven 328. Many more '89 328s seem to have been preserved as "investment cars". If you look at the population of great surviving 328s, you're just going to have an easier time if you like red and want an '89. If it comes down to a beat up '87 and a really good '89, then maybe that's the right move for you.

+1

2-2

I wouldn't pay more for an ABS car. I admit it's mostly aesthetics - the Mondial-style wheels just don't look good. But there are other aspects of the original 328 design that I like better as well.

Also, more philosophically, I think 328s are borderline classics, in the same vein as Jag E-Types, Lotus Turbo Esprit, etc., and the whole package just isn't going to compare to a modern Porsche Boxster S, for example, when you push it hard. Just keep it properly maintained and enjoy it for what it is. You won't be setting any lap records or winning any races in a 328 in 2009.

 

Interesting but I personally prefer the ABS convex wheels, I thought the regular concave wheels look flat and boring...But that's me.

 

Yes, it's a matter of beauty and the beholder, but the concave wheels are descended from the Daytona and racing 512s, IIRC.

Kind of like the old Fuchs alloys on Porsche 911s or 914s, they're one of the classic sports car wheels of the post-wire wheel era. And cleaner in design than the 308 OEM wheels.

 

Funny enough, I am always amazed how close the 328 is to a Boxster given that it is 20+ years old. That being said the Boxster still leaves the 328 in the dust if need be.

Thomas

 

I agree.

I heard that red Ferraris are better than those that are other colors because racing Ferraris have historically been almost exclusively red. I'm pretty certain that there haven't been any that were black.

Just bustin' on you Jon, your car is beautiful but I couldn't let that goofy statement about the wheels go unmet

 

Goofy? I did my PhD thesis on 328 wheels.

 

Not to stray too far off topic but I've had a few PhD job applicants that did their thesis on dumber stuff than that, and I know you are joking.

 

Check out this white 328 with convex wheels, the curves of the wheels complements the curves on the car, it looks awesome imo:

http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showpost.php?p=138757066&postcount=835