1995 355 smoking badly at 4,000 rpm | FerrariChat

1995 355 smoking badly at 4,000 rpm

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by elvisimitator, Aug 19, 2009.

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  1. elvisimitator

    elvisimitator Rookie

    Jun 17, 2009
    16
    Went for a country drive today on curvy roads, noticed the engine emitting lots of white smoke when in 2nd gear and 3rd gear, especially a lot of smoke if the tachometer was at about 40 or above. Also engine backfired when my foot came off the gas pedal, this happened in 2-6 gears. Looked under the hood, no oil residue or leak noted. Only noticed dry flakey/dusty stuff over the expansion tank, something new or not noticed before. Oil temp never about 200. No dash lights lit up. Any ideas of what caused the smoking and the backfiring? Thanks for any advice.
     
  2. JoeZaff

    JoeZaff F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Aug 5, 2007
    5,459
    Philly suburbs
    Full Name:
    Joe
    The smoke was probably caused by exceeding the redline by approximately 31K RPM ;)
     
  3. enginefxr

    enginefxr Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2007
    1,753
    S&R Exotics
    Full Name:
    Gary Sharpe
    #3 enginefxr, Aug 19, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2009
    Dry flakey/dusty stuff may be the packing inside the exhaust heat shields blown out by a bad header. Backfiring sounds like a symptom of air reversion into the engine too. And if it was driven very long with a bad header, the smoke could be worn liners/valve guides. Hopefully not but.....
    Rebuilt a bunch of them in the last year with the same problems....
     
  4. elvisimitator

    elvisimitator Rookie

    Jun 17, 2009
    16
    #4 elvisimitator, Aug 19, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2009
    Thanks for your reply. I went over the records and see that last year, or about 2000 miles ago, two cam gaskets, two "O" rings and two end cover gaskets were replaced. The engine was out at that time, timing belts changed, new clutch, new potentiometer, all fluids changed. The car ran fine (we think) on the freeway, no problems or strange sounds from the engine except when the foot came off the gas pedal . We have only driven it 800 miles, bought at 33000 miles 3 months ago. Does any of this info make a difference in your idea of what is wrong with the car?
     
  5. James-NZ

    James-NZ F1 Veteran

    Jun 26, 2007
    5,822
    Hamilton, NewZealand
    Full Name:
    James
    Have you topped up the oil lately?

    If you are not familiar with topping up a dry sump engine with oil then you may have overfilled the tank, this can cause the excess oil to be burned and result in smoke.

    This is where I would start.
     
  6. finnerty

    finnerty F1 World Champ

    May 18, 2004
    10,406
    #6 finnerty, Aug 19, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2009
    What is the nature (composition) of the "smoke"? Is it oil, coolant, or fuel (i.e., "rich" mixture exhaust).

    Without that info, all I can tell you is that something is wrong --- which is neither new nor useful information for you.

    "White" smoke is usually coolant --- but the "description" is always in the eye of the beholder. If you can, get the car to smoke by revving it up in neutral, and hold a clean, white rag over one of the tailpipes. This will collect a sample of whatever is being spewed, and the color / odor / taste (yes, it's okay to touch your tongue to it briefly, then spit / rinse) of this residue will tell you what the nature of the smoke is.

    Once that is known, we can start to converge on a diagnosis ---- otherwise, we're throwing darts at a board, my friend :)
     
  7. finnerty

    finnerty F1 World Champ

    May 18, 2004
    10,406
    #7 finnerty, Aug 20, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
    BTW, based on the info provided so far...I agree ---- Sounds a lot like a failed header (plus possible "collateral" damage). The incidence and pre-disposition of 355 header failures is well documented.

    But, "let's see what we see when we see it" :)
     
  8. Ed_Long

    Ed_Long Formula Junior

    Nov 11, 2003
    686
    Salem, Oregon USA
    Full Name:
    Ed Long
    You are revving this Fiat engine to 40,000 rpm? Holy Hannah! It must be an engine now in lots of little bitty pieces!
     
  9. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
    Twin Cities
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    Tim Keseluk
    Post of the month! :D
     
  10. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
    Full Name:
    Dave Helms
    I second that!
     
  11. cridom60

    cridom60 Formula Junior

    Feb 2, 2007
    823
    France
    Full Name:
    dominique
    please contact the scuderia immediatly, if you can rev your 355 at 40 000 rpm your fortune is done!
     
  12. elvisimitator

    elvisimitator Rookie

    Jun 17, 2009
    16
    Oops, one too many zeros. Thanks for all the info.
     
  13. Steveny360

    Steveny360 F1 Veteran

    Sep 5, 2007
    7,070
    At 40,000 RPM I guess it should be doing a little bit more than smoking. You should feel lucky that's all it's doing.
     
  14. jm3

    jm3 F1 Rookie

    Oct 3, 2002
    4,364
    United States
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    JM3
    #14 jm3, Aug 20, 2009
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
    I agree that you should check the oil.

    Drive car until very warm, turn off engine with key in right hand and rag in left hand.

    Pop hood and immediately unscrew and check oil at right front of motor, the knob with the little horsie has a dipstick on the end of it.
     
  15. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
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    Twin Cities
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    Tim Keseluk
    Someone wrecked the title. :(
     
  16. elvisimitator

    elvisimitator Rookie

    Jun 17, 2009
    16
    OK, so here's a question: since I can't find out what kind of oil is already in the car (asked the dealer twice, he didn't know or say. He said just to use any synthetic oil if it is low (??)), what should I do if it IS low? I read in the info section about oil that it wasn't a good idea to mix synthetic oil brands. True or not? Maybe just get it towed to a repair shop? I have an original receipt from 1996 when they used Shell Helix 5/40, useful info or not? Thanks for any replies.
     
  17. cockrill

    cockrill Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 23, 2008
    1,086
    Columbia, MO
    Full Name:
    Jeremy Cockrill
    You're looking (hoping) for too much oil, not too little. If you are low on oil and the smoke is really oil related then you should probably get your car to a shop. Again, the hope is that you have too much oil...
     
  18. Serpent Driver

    Serpent Driver Formula Junior

    Jul 4, 2004
    324
    Norway
    Lots of white smoke and "stuff" outside of the expansion tank for the coolant? Sounds like bad head gasket(s).
     
  19. Modeler

    Modeler F1 Veteran

    May 19, 2008
    7,330
    State of confusion
    Full Name:
    a.n.other
    Have you recently bought this car?
    If so is there any form of warranty involved in the deal and was there any prepurchase inspection by a Ferrari specialist? Do you have any service record of maintenance done on the car particularly recently?
    Since you haven't filled out your profile we lack much of the background required to advise you well, such as your location.
    I'd advise you to post in the relevant regional section asking for a recommended independent Ferrari shop near you. Then have the car taken to them for inspection.
     
  20. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2006
    15,541
    Cerritos, CA.
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    Mike
    Usually if it is:
    White smoke= water getting inside combustion chambers cause by bad head gasket.
    Blue smoke = too much oil burning
    Black smoke= too rich or too much fuel means fuel/air ratio not balance
     
  21. finnerty

    finnerty F1 World Champ

    May 18, 2004
    10,406
    If you are not sure what oil is already in there, and you want to just top it off, use a synthetic. Pick one that is okay to mix with conventional oil (some can and some cannot) ---- consult the manufacturer for this info. For example, all of RedLine's synths are okay to mix with conventional oil.

    This way, you're covered without having to know what's already in there.

    Adding conventional oil is not a good idea since there may be a synthetic already in there that can't be mixed with conventional.
     
  22. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
    1,535
    Simi Valley
    Full Name:
    David
    Before sending the car to Gary for an engine rebuild (enginefxr) double check the oil is not OVERFILLED. There is a correct procedure for checking the level in a dry sump car and if you get it wrong, it'll give you a false low level. I have seen what happens when a 430 was overfilled by some well meaning Jiffy-Lube dude. Well, I saw what happened until the car vanished like Bond's Aston Martin in a dense cloud of white smoke :)

    In all seriousness though, I think this is going to be expensive and unpleasant. I hate to say it but this is an all too familiar story. I hope for your sake and sanity that the oil level is too high...

    Dave
     
  23. tbakowsky

    tbakowsky F1 World Champ
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Sep 18, 2002
    19,387
    The Cold North
    Full Name:
    Tom
    check number 2 cylinder for compression and leak down. Don't know why, but thats the cylinder that fails the most.
     
  24. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    17,940
    USA
    +1....my read from the description by the OP too.
     
  25. elvisimitator

    elvisimitator Rookie

    Jun 17, 2009
    16
    Thanks for all the info, really appreciate it and the forum, a huh huh.
     

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