OFFICIAL: Flavio and Symonds out of Renault F1; team will not dispute charges

The real question is, how will this affect Alonso's reputation and career?

 

seriously F1 has turned into a circus!

 

It seems we don't agree... I think it is silly to think that we should be shocked by all of these transgressions and demand harsh penalties. It's racing. Pushing the rules and going over the line on occasion is just part of the game.

Fining McLaren $100 million was the most ridiculous penalty ever handed out that I can remember. Not fining Renault a higher amount would be equally ridiculous, since the precedent has been set.

Booting Flavio out of F1 is a shame. He has contributed a lot... a real lot. These things obviously happen all the time, they are not isolated incidents.

I'm just having a hard time getting all worked into a lather about Renault telling Piquet to crash so that Alonso would win. I just don't see it as much worse than a soccer player faking a fall after a tackle to try to get a penalty... which happens hundreds of times per game, it seems.

 

I don't think he had time... he was employed by Renault but the offer of immunity was from he FIA, so I don't think the two were related. I think Renault did a little investigation of their own and decided to axe them both... Pat taking the immunity wouldn't have made a difference on that front.

Symonds may still be banned for a time (like Stepney) from F1, but we shall see. I'm sure Flavio offered to hook him up with something to keep his mouth shut. Flavio has a lot of interests in racing and probably has tons of options in and outside of the racing world.

 

...crashing a high performance racing car is the same as faking a tackle in football...are you serious?? I suggest the possible consequences of one are far more serious than the other (..you know, little things like death, destruction..etc). Flavio has allowed himself to become a gross, debased and morally vacous individual. The sport has no place for people who think that NO rules apply...not even the moral ones. Arrivederci Flav.

ps. my guess is that Ghosn fired Flav and Simmonds immediately upon confirmation they were guilty. At least someone at Renault has a sense of shame.

 

1. If Symonds were to accept immunity in return for full cooperation doesn't mean that he is immune from Renault's wrath, or potential non-WMSC action.

2. Flavio and Symonds' departure does not mean that they, or Renault, will be spared the WMSC-rod (or Spanky Max's, as some would pun).

3. Although possible, it is hard to imagine that Alonso wasn't aware of his team's scheme. I believe that Flavio was still his manager. It will be interesting to see if the WMSC will press on against him. No need to give Alonso immunity this time.

 

There is a chance of death from crashing a car, but if we're honest with ourselves, putting that out there as a huge issue and saying we're shocked they would take the risk is a bit silly... it's very very uncommon for a driver to be killed in an F1 car crash, and even less likely for a fan to be injured. If you put a bad tackle on someone in a sport you can hurt or kill them too.

If it was really that dangerous, they wouldn't be racing at all and we wouldn't be watching such a blood sport.

I don't know about Flavio allowing himself to become anything... do you seriously think he has changed over the years? I think he is no different than before.

I certainly think it was wrong for Flav/Pat to tell PK to crash. It was only slightly less wrong for PK to agree to do it. And it would be further wrong to banish Renault from F1 over it... that would serve no real purpose and accomplish nothing.

It certainly appears it was Flav and Pat behind this, they are gone... what more needs done?

Then again, the same happened at McLaren, and when the guilty party was fired, they still got a $100mm fine. So now that the FIA has set a ridiculous precedent and now that Max has openly stated that what Renault did was certainly worse than what McLaren did, the FIA needs to issue a more harsh penalty, or they will (again) show themselves to be a corrupt organization of fools.

 

I hope you are joking about f1 not being dangerous...

Care to visit a so called felipe Massa ?

Security has been enforced through the years but they still can die in any race.
and even more on a urban track.

 

Right! We already know that FA will throw his employer under the bus and attempt to blackmail them. So if it turns out he's also guilty here, why would Ferrari (or any other team for that matter) *EVER* want to hire him??? He's as scummy as they come, if you ask me.

gp

 

Exactly. Something to do/watch when you've got nothing else pressing go on.

 

You didn't translate the Piquet Code:

Push=Crash

 

Definitely another dark day in the sport of F1.

 

Think about this.... radio transmissions are NOT the way to go, why? because they are too easy to monitor (as with appearing in the news, etc.) but an easy way to pretend that something happened (oh my, what a surprise (being cynical), that F----driver crashed into the wall, what the F----happened) so..... if your intent is for something to occur, you want to do it in the most descrete way -> face-to-face little chat with the driver before he goes out of the garage under the pretents that you are giving him the traditional "good luck" stuff; sign language (might work, however, too time consuming); here's a good one -> take hand hold thumb up palm facing inward, with other hand make fist, take fisted hand and hit palm of other hand (slightly cupped) and signal "thumbs-up" with a number (i.e. for lap 11, use both thumbs, lap 12 use both thumbs and both index fingers pointed outward, which could be interperted as a "go" sign).
Chances of being seen are fairly slim..........

oh well, guess the telemetry will be interesting

Carol

 

Granted but by taking the deal he would have cut his personal losses.

 

'Push' makes for a better euphemism for 'crash' than, say, 'walk the Appalachian Trail' for example. I suppose what Formula 1 needs now is a rule prohibiting crashing or forbidding human participation in team decision making.

 

Poor Romain Grosjean. He finally gets his big break and suddenly this

 

Unlike the old days when a driver out of contention and having a sweetie waiting in the pits might "accidentally" over rev an engine?

 

I understand ,but here we "hear" everybody, the engineers etc...

I mean, maybe all the team was aware of the planified crash, but damn, that's a F1 team crew we are talking about, it's not like they all come from actor studio ! :/

i don't know what to think.

 

I put as high a value on a sweetie waiting in the pits as the next man.

 

Might want to clear up the somewhat ambiguous syntax there

 

They'd be extremly stupid to talk about the crash on radio (directly or through obvious codewords), as the radio is monitored. It would be a big surprise if we read something like "Nelson, you hear me? Codeword swivel, codeword swivel! Now!!" - they are stupid, but they aren't that stupid!

 

I really doubt Flavio could loose this one, but it seems that someone at Renault didn´t want to take the risk. I understand the reasoning of the guys at Renault: a court set by Max Mosley can bring unpredictable results.

Sad.

 

At least Flavio is a stand up guy, in a way, to admit the foul play. Now that Flav and Symonds are gone from F1, Alonso should be banned from F1. Add to that a fine of AT LEAST $100 million to Renault and the business would be settled in a fair manner. If Renault ends up quitting because of this, too bad.

 

Alonso? Reputation?

HA, HA, HA!!

 

I cannot understand why Flav and other team bosses keep setting themselves up like lambs for slaughter at Max's preverted alter.
Was it because:
1.Flav thought or knew he could get away with it, like he did when caught with Mclaren data!.
2. Ghosn wanted results or else he was pulling Renault out of F1...that got solved
3. PK was hopeless he needed a use for him he was expected to crash anyway...result!
4.Alonso's stock was falling...in the headlines again with a win.
5.He couldn't care less he was going to get out of F1 anyway.
6.His friendship with Mosley was ok at the time thats until he started being a major player in FOTA.
7. He assumed PK would keep his trap shut because of shame and wouldn't ruin his career in F1.

Maybe a combination of all that.

Of course there is the FIA precedents as in 1995 Toyota was caught using illegal turbo restrictors on the Catalunya Rally in Spain. The team admitted the situation and argued that it had been done without the knowledge of the team management. In that case the FIA World Council rejected the pleas and banned Toyota from the World Rally Championship for 12 months.

Also a Mclaren 100 mil a ludicrous hate for Ron Dennis fine.

It's plain as day to me that Alonso was in on it, he will walk away though.

By the looks of it to me Renault wants to stay in F1 and is hoping that there admission and throwing FB and PS under the bus it will help them.