Vignale spyder #504 restoration | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Vignale spyder #504 restoration

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by thecarnut, Jul 13, 2009.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
    Owner Project Master

    May 10, 2006
    17,776
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    John!
    8 main bearing journals! That bottom end must be indestructable.
     
  2. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    And one very,very heavy crank !

    Ivan
     
  3. 3500 GT

    3500 GT Formula 3

    Nov 2, 2008
    1,471
    USA
    Full Name:
    Gentleman Racer
    7 main bearings!!! FYI!!
     
  4. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Mar 4, 2005
    8,971
    one of the typical Maserati-mistakes!

    Ciao!
    Walter
     
  5. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Watching with interest.

    Pete
     
  6. alberto

    alberto Formula 3

    Aug 25, 2001
    2,404
    San Diego
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    any updates?
     
  7. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #57 thecarnut, Nov 23, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    All the chrome is now done, except the wire wheels.

    The engine should be going to the machine shop soon. We wanted to do quite a bit of research and not rush into this step.

    The wire wheels are with Cork Adams and should be ready by the beginning of next year. The wire wheels were shipped to Cork in July. It will take longer to redo the wires than what it took to build the car in 1959! Luckily I am in no hurry.

    I had the steering wheel restored by Gary's Steering Wheel. My wheel was cracked and missing one of the white ivory dots. The black plastic ring on the horn button, which is used to flash the high beams, was also cracked. He also polished the horn center and restored the white 4 speed shift knob. Looks good now.

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  8. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ

    Nov 4, 2006
    11,364
    opposite lock
    Full Name:
    Marc Sonnery
    Looking good Ivan!

    Just make sure that when you finish it you don't get the "I-put-in-too-much-work-in-this-car-to-dare-drive-it- syndrome" but you've done enough of them to know better,-)!
     
  9. mfletch

    mfletch Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2008
    480
    Ivan, I am following the progress on your car...it is amazing. I am preserving a 59 3500GT that will need the same work on the steering wheel. Do you mind disclosing how much the steering wheel restoration cost? Thanks, Mark.
     
  10. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    I paid $650 to restore all the pieces. Gary's Steering Wheel in Carlisle, PA 717-243-5646.

    http://www.garyssteeringwheel.com/

    Ivan
     
  11. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    I am already getting much more into it that I had expected. I am going to have to get the car repainted. It is a shame but the car has been spot painted several times and what is left of the original paint is old and faded. Also the seat leather is in bad condition and just replacing the bad panels I do not think will look good. My objective is not to do a bolts and nuts restoration, but to refurbish only those things that need attention. Unfortunately after 50 years the list of things that needs attention is getting rather long.

    Not to worry, it will be a driver when I'm done.

    Ivan
     
  12. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ

    Nov 4, 2006
    11,364
    opposite lock
    Full Name:
    Marc Sonnery
    Yes 50 years takes its toll...but I am sure it will be stunning when you finish.

    I am glad Adolfo got you that additional info as I don't think the other person we discussed was going to come up with anything.

    Keep up the good work and keep us informed!

    best regards,

    Marc
     
  13. technom3

    technom3 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 29, 2007
    18,143
    Phoenix AZ
    Full Name:
    Justin
    marvel mystery oil is your friend. pour it into the spark plug hole give it some time to soak in and see what happens...
     
  14. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    We are pass that point as the engine is now all apart. I tried soaking the cylinders in Mystery Oil for several weeks, then tried PB Blaster. We put an incredible amount of torque on the crank nut in both directions; not even the slightest movement. We even chained the car and pulled it with a truck while in gear ... all it did was drag the rear tires.

    I had expected a failed head gasket and water inside the cylinders, creating a big mess. What was surprising is that no catastrophic failure was found and the engine really isn't that bad. Maserati engines simply do not like sitting around unused for 30 years.

    Ivan
     
  15. mfletch

    mfletch Formula Junior

    Nov 3, 2008
    480
    Ivan, thanks for the response. That was $650 well spent...the steering wheel looks fantastic. I spent a few hours today rebuilding the first of my Webers. These really are fun cars to work on. Thanks for posting your project.
     
  16. 3500 GT

    3500 GT Formula 3

    Nov 2, 2008
    1,471
    USA
    Full Name:
    Gentleman Racer
    Hi Ivan,...did you ever have a chance to get in touch with Gary Martin of Webber carb rebuild fame?

    Best regards,..
     
  17. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    Not yet. I have three brand new 42 DCOE carbs for about 20 years, still in their original boxes. I have been waiting for the right car to put them on. I need to verify they are indeed identical, and jetted the same.

    Ivan
     
  18. David Jarrett

    David Jarrett Karting

    Sep 21, 2006
    240
    Chatham Kent
    Full Name:
    David Jarrett
    What a brilliant thread.

    The 1991 C&SC photo is taken at Sissinghurst Castle Gardens Kent (the home of Vita Sackville West and Harold Nicholson and now owned by The National Trust). I know, because I surveyed the building in the picture in September.
     
  19. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #69 thecarnut, Feb 12, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I have not posted in some time since the work that has been going on has been mainly researching engine specs and obtaining parts. The engine is now at the machine shop and all the engine parts have been acquired. I will start posting info and photos of the engine as it completed.

    I started work on cleaning and inspecting the floors. I am still amazed this car survived with very minor rust since the sound proofing used when built was a recipe for rust.

    The floors were originally coated with heavy paint. Over that foam was glued ALL over the tub. I do mean all over, even inside the doors was foam. On the floors the foam would then be covered with vinyl. Over the vinyl the carpet would then be held with snaps. In the bulkhead areas, in front of the driver's and passenger feet, heat insulation was held with screwed on aluminum panels. I am leaving those untouched since it all appears to be in good condition.

    These photos show as I am removing the dried up foam. Another photo shows the floors after the foam was vacuumed. The tub is in great condition! What looks like surface rust is actually dried up glue. I will clean the floors with a wire brush and then apply POR15.

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  20. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
    Owner Project Master

    May 10, 2006
    17,776
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    John!
    great work in there. using orig carpet or no?
     
  21. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #71 thecarnut, Feb 15, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I will mostly re-use the original carpet. There are one or two pieces that will have to be done new.

    I need advice as to what to use to dye the carpet. Luckily the carpet is black therefore color matching is not an issue. The carpet has white edges therefore I would be easier to sponge in the dye instead of spraying it on.

    The vinyl/carpet spray cans sold at discount parts stores leave a very stiff feeling on carpets; I do not want to use that stuff. Any suggestions on what to use ??

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  22. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #72 thecarnut, Feb 15, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The wire wheels were restored by Cork Adams and look great. For originality I opted for the chrome spokes. A little piece of trivia; the early cars had wire wheels with Carlo Borrani stickers and two eared knock offs, also labeled Carlo Borrani. Later wire wheels were labeled Route Borrani and had the three eared knock offs.

    Borrani still makes new knock offs therefore it is much easier (and less expensive) to purchase a new set of knock offs instead of restoring the old ones. The new knock offs are on order (Ted Waibel) and I should get them in about a month.

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  23. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #73 thecarnut, Feb 22, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Before I could start working on this car I had to get it down to my extra garage, which is located in the basement. The car had no brakes or clutch hydraulics, plus the engine was frozen. Luckily the wheels would spin easily so at least the brake calipers were not frozen to the rotors. The driveway to the basement is rather steep in one spot therefore some method to stop rolling momentum was needed.

    The solution turned out to be quick simple ... use the clutch to stop the car. With the frozen engine I knew the car was no going anywhere with the clutch engaged.

    This meant fixing the clutch hydraulics (master and slave cylinders, plus flex hose) as my first task. On a 3500GT the complete pedal assembly has to be removed from the car to get to the brake and clutch master cylinders.

    The clutch master is a very common 3/4 inch Girling cylinder and readily available new. New cylinders come with a modern looking reservoir cap but the original metal caps are also available new. The clutch slave is the same as just about any other Maserati GT car and I already had a new one in my parts stock. Clutch flex hose is the same as a Jaguar e-type.

    I purchased the clutch master and the kit to rebuild the brake master from Pegasus Auto Racing. They also carry the original metal caps.

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  24. thecarnut

    thecarnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 22, 2006
    3,198
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    The Car Nut
    #74 thecarnut, Feb 22, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The brake master cylinder is very simple. It looks like a clutch master cylinder with a remote reservoir; only difference is that it has a larger bore. I had problems locating a new master cylinder with the 7/8 inch bore but luckily mine was not in bad condition and Pegasus Racing had the repair kit ($22).

    The brake calipers are in good condition and new stainless steel pistons will be fitted. Jacques and MIE both carry the pistons and caliper rebuilt kits. Brake flex hoses are same as a Jaguar e-type and easy to obtain. The brake booster is rather tricky to rebuild. I have an extra rebuild kit and will attempt to do it myself. If I fail, MIE sells rebuilt boosters on an exchange basis, but if I recall it is rather pricey.

    For the rear drum brake pistons, I matched the rebuild kit to a 1953 Austin Healey 100-4 (BN1). My rear pistons are in good condition but, if needed, new ones are available.

    I am removing the brake lines so I can clean them and to be able to more easily paint the undercarriage and inside the engine compartment. The original brake lines are in good condition and I plan to re-use them.

    Ivan
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. ColdWater

    ColdWater Formula Junior

    Aug 19, 2006
    621
    bicoastal USA
    #75 ColdWater, Feb 22, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Ivan,

    On another 3500 restoration thread you were searching for a good photo of an early non-embossed lubrication plaque. I just noticed that E. Thiesen in Berlin is offering an 'early prototype' Vignale spider that seems quite well preserved. The plaque looks a bit worn in the photo from their site, but it might be good enough to develop a reproduction.

    The contact there is Karl-Helmut Larkamp, [email protected]. Seems like a nice guy when I've communicated with him in the past, so maybe he would provide a good photo.

    Enjoying the thread,

    Don
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     

Share This Page