The look on Chuck Berry's face is priceless! Trust me I understand the aggravation...my Cirrus is still under warranty (till February 2010) and they have yet to fix any of the complaints since I bought it despite numerous trips to differing shops...of course this is my 5th Cirrus and I only paid for one so that should tell you something.
So I got the Baron back. Total bill over 30k, which included taking one engine off, and getting it gone through, it had some metal in the filter, so we took it apart, fixed everything that was wrong, and put it back on. There are a couple of items that need to be corrected: 1. The rate of climb reads +500. They worked on the alternate air, and I suspect that is the problem. Still works, but is 500 off. No big deal, doesn't affect the autopilot. 2. The passenger's seat in the front doesn't lock in place, I can fix that, they left the spring off. 3. They replaced the EFIS, and the autopilot doesn't track the GPS. My avionics guy says that it is probably not seated, and he can fix it quickly. I don't use the autopilot that way anyway, generally use the heading bug and that is still working. So, after 2.5 months, finally back, the engines are working well, and the last dyno on the repaired engine was 315 HP. Not bad out of a motor rated at 285 (engines are very trick, but legal). Non turbo, getting an indicated 170 kts at 10.5 at 0 degrees, which is over 200 kts true, at 2400 rpm, which is about 70% power. Not bad. Plane will exceed 200 kts at 65% at altitude, on a 30 gal per hour burn rich of peak, will do 190 kts, on a 22 gal per hour burn, lean of peak. Not bad. Art Art
No...good memory though. When we got down to it the load/range just wasn't what we want or need. In all reality the Lancair Evolution would do everything we need...if only it were certified. For now we are sticking with the Cirrus and using a friends Cheyenne from time to time.
A lot better to determine the aircraft doesn't work for the needs before buyer than afterwards. If you are looking at a turboprop with range and payload check the Cessna Conquest II. Way faster than a King Air too. Not as sexy as a real jet but it does burn Jet A fuel. Jeff
I think the best A and P's gravitate towards the highest paying jobs. Makes sense ? That usually is in commercial aviation. SWA, Northwest, etc. When I was an newbie at Braniff we did C checks on 727's in 5 days. Basically a mini overhaul. Every inspection panel off, interior out, inspection top to bottom, put togeather, and reinspected. Pretty much anyone could ground the plane but you had better be right. The OBF's (Old Braniff F**ks) were amazing to watch and knew these planes like the back of their hands. The best sheet metal guy I ever knew used a hodgepodge of dented crap old tools in a homemade tool box. Some hand made. All in need of their own maintenance program. One welder in the shop could LITERALLY weld an aluminum beer can after it was cut in half. He had one displayed on top of his box welded with the top half and bottom half facing oppositely. A weld and scorch marks in the middle. That said one of my favorite quotes was from a foreman dressing down a mechanic who clearly was not getting the picture. He said in a serious and fatherly tone "Shouldn't you be working on lawn mowers ?".
At the risk of thread jacking this one more time... Bought first Cirrus new in 2007 (custom ordered)...it was bought back 8 months later, stuck throttle on final, doors opening in flight, PFD failure 3 times, MFD failure 4 times, paint flaking away, headliner falling out, dash cracked (I could keep going). Not to mention the "coveted Cirrus delivery" was absolutely the worst experience of my life when purchasing something. I actually just asked for my money back several times during the process and training as I had the "gut" feeling this was a harbinger of things to come...I should have listened. So, my new custom ordered plane gets bought back and replaced with a slightly higher hour more option same year bird that begins using copious amounts of oil...to the tune of a quart every 1/2 hour of flight time. The bird is taken to a service center for diagnosis/repairs, and I do not see it again. I am given a "loaner" while we are sorting the diagnosis...all seems okay with this one except it does not have AC, which makes for sweaty flights in the south. I take the family to see the Blue Angels at Cherry Point and the engine quits without warning about 1200 agl on short final. We land without incident and it restarts (running very rough) on the taxi way. As I pull up to the FBO the line guy is shaking his head, I pop the door and can smell the oil. The belly of the plane is covered as if someone threw a 5 gallon bucket of oil at the aircraft. I call the Cirrus sales guy and he comes to get my family and me so we can get home. I am given another "loaner" aircraft which has zero options (including no traffic system). The lack of options (most specifically the missing traffic system) and the history has no made the wife afraid of the plane (she has her private). So I end up flying alone mostly while we wait for the repairs to the oil burning bird. I am promised a "zero time factory reman"; however, when the engine comes back 8 months later it is a top end overhaul with "time continued" lower end...I threaten legal action as I have documentation of the “zero time reman” promise. To make matters worse there are parts missing and it takes almost two months to get everything in the right place and reassemble. We find out that there are NO “factory remans of the platinum engine package only overhauls or new. During this time I write the CEO of Cirrus outlining my experiences with his company and how I feel I am being forced into legal alternatives. I am called two weeks later and asked if I would accept another aircraft with much lower hours and every option (no turbo) in exchange. I agree and here we are. It has been almost a year with this aircraft now and while she is far from perfect we are closer than we have ever been...the warranty expires in February and I shudder to think what lies ahead. There is more to this…but I’m sure you get the gist of it. I could tell you about when the second plane had an idle stalling problem and the service center used my wife as the test pilot while they “adjusted the fuel system”. She was forced to declare an emergency when the fuel pressure dropped into the red. Or the time when the throttle stuck I landed and by coincidence I landed at a Cirrus service center. They repaired the throttle and we refueled and departed 4 hours later. Upon rotation the “power” started dropping until it reached 70%...the plane was not gaining altitude but we were out of runway. There were trees at the departure end and my wife started saying “trees, trees, trees” I told her I know and to be quite…we flew between two groups of trees over the house and I began a slow arc to the runway. I called in and advised of the situation and we landed safely. The A/I and the A&P had stayed to watch us depart. When I taxied back over to them I said “hey the throttle isn’t stuck anymore…but the damn plane won’t fly now”. They took it back apart and found they had missed a linkage pivot point when reassembling…the throttle and prop governor would open but could creep closed with no resistance. Like I said I could go on and on…there are other Cirrus loaners in this story that fail us but like I said this represents the majority of the experience. There is the Cirrus that failed the roll trim cartridge on the take off roll at KTYS...the side stick went dead in my hands, thank god I hadn't rotated the plane. I spent three days in a hotel (my dime) waiting for parts...but I digress.
Thanks...I think? Just kidding, I guess I never drank the Cirrus kool-aid so my paradigm doesn't match what in my experience they sell. To me $600,000+ should buy something trust worthy & comfortable...instead it buys a lot of neat expensive avionic toys that have a hard time living in the real world. It's no ones fault but my own...I looked at COPA and everyone loved their plane, I test flew them and they were fun/easy to fly. But I should have looked harder and deeper...my mistake. Hey look at it this way...I should have all my "aircraft" bad luck out of the way...right? Who wants to go flying with me?
We are not without our own "stories" but they don't seem to compound like the way you were describing. I have been amazed at how well the 350/400 series Cessna's have been from a reliability stand point. We operate 15 172s, 3 182s, 5 Turbo 206s and 7 400s at Addison Texas and the 400s have by far the best launch reliability. Keeping in mind that they are also flown by our most experienced pilots (sometimes that helps). I hope your aviation experience takes a turn for the better.
Bob- I always wondered why I enjoyed Spasso so much. Now that I know he is your son, it makes perfect sense. Taz Terry Phillips
Neither of us have any , well, some, I guess but it is mostly nonsense. He's been a lot of fun and we've done a lot of things together. All of my boys are different and that is what keeps things interesting. We have done trains, planes, autos, and sailboats in which each has a specialty.Thanks, Switches
This thread is really solidifying my love of simple airplanes. My story is I paid for a PPi by the supposed best T-28 guy in the country and he missed every cylinder was glazed, which showed up on the ferry flight home with an oil burn of 4 gallons per hour. He did find some position lights were not working, though...
I hate to hear things like that. It happened to us when we bought an old house 10 years ago. As far as airplanes go , I, too, prefer the simplest of machines but I don't deny the wonders of the new aerodynamics and systems. I suppose that it boils down to what pleases the operator and to what level he/she wants to go in flying. I enjoy flying IMC with my son and marvel at it and how good he is at it but I have no desire to get my ticket in it. I admire those who attain the highest level of the skills in flight maneuvers and instrument work but for me an old biplane is just fine...or anything that allows me just to fly.
I don't mind saying it, and if you read through some of these threads I have advised others of the same..."I should have bought a Cessna" Columbia was going through their problems and no solution was in sight when I bought. I have flown the 400 a couple times and wish it was sitting in my hanger.
I hear that a lot. The Columbia and the Cirrus were certified on the same day. Had Columbia had the type of funding that Cirrus had to start the whole landscape would be different right now. It is amazing the design differences between the airplanes for looking so similar. As for getting a 400 in the hangar.... I can help with that... Jim
Plane Guy, What is the story with the 350 and 400? I heard that they had stopped production. Is that true?
It's all in the spin. Technically production stopped while the factory was relocated to Independence, KS and integrated with the 172/182/206 and Mustang production facility. So from June of 2009 until October 2009 there were no 350/400s produced. Production has begun again (now in KS) and the first Independence built 400s should start delivering in March of 2010. They (Cessna) are not building 350s in 2010. They have not decided if they will in 2011 yet. For the last 2 years the 400 outsold the 350 6 to 1. Anyone want the last 350 built by serial number? Could be a collector's item. Jim
