round motor question | FerrariChat

round motor question

Discussion in 'Aviation Chat' started by dbw, May 6, 2010.

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  1. dbw

    dbw Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
    897
    palo alto ca
    Full Name:
    dave
    what would happen if i were to remove 6 cylinders and piston/rod assys from an old lycoming r680...leaving the master rod and two adjacent cylinders and blanking off everything else...would this run in any way?? i am considering making a hillclimb car in the classic english tradition..i figured a W-3 engine with chain final drive.
    the lycoming has been in my garage and is a complete engine that was running till the time it was stored. my image is a car with three cylinders sticking out of the hood with an inertia starter and crank sticking out the front between the dumbirons.

    can this multi- cylinderectomy work???
     
  2. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
    10,213
    San Antonio
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    Russ Turner
    I think it might vibrate quite a bit. The typical firing order in a 7 cyl radial is 1 3 5 7 2 4 6, so yours would be 1 _ _ 7 2 _ _ ; with each cylinder being about 96 cid.

    I think your hp/weight of the engine would cancel many of the advantages (huge torque) that you're looking for.

    Reminds me of all of the airplane engined Brit cars, especially the V-12 Merlin rods - they had a penchant for those.
     
  3. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
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    Tim Keseluk
  4. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
    10,213
    San Antonio
    Full Name:
    Russ Turner
  5. GoFerrari28

    GoFerrari28 Formula 3

    Jun 16, 2004
    2,313
    Ridgemont, CA
    Full Name:
    Jeff Spicoli
    LOL When a chevy big block just isn't enough
     
  6. dbw

    dbw Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
    897
    palo alto ca
    Full Name:
    dave
    i think they ran the motor in the car but i never saw a driveline hooked up...

    snj5...we have a 9 cyl here.
     
  7. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
    10,213
    San Antonio
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    Russ Turner
    Sorry - it seemed small.
    The firing order is typically 1 3 5 7 9 2 4 6 8,
    so you are talking about 1 - - - 9 2 - - -

    Depending on condition and dash number, that engine might be worth some $
     
  8. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,003
    Austin TX
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    Brian Crall
  9. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,003
    Austin TX
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    I think it could run but it would need a big flywheel and it would be a tall motor putting the CG pretty high hurting the handling.
     
  10. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,214
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    Tim Keseluk
    Plenty warm in there as well.
     
  11. dbw

    dbw Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
    897
    palo alto ca
    Full Name:
    dave
    all that is good!! i'm picturing a teens vanderbilt cup/ british hillclimb type car..there is a guy in the uk running an ox5 in a pretty small chassis..the areo engined stuff seems tho be all inline [ i almost bought a hisso v8 with one bank removed and run as a big 4 in a mid 30's sprinter...this practice was called "half-a-hisso" and was seen a lot in the late 20's early 30's..]
     
  12. Tim Wells

    Tim Wells Formula Junior

    Dec 31, 2009
    393
    Dallas, GA
    Full Name:
    Tim Wells
    #12 Tim Wells, May 7, 2010
    Last edited: May 7, 2010
    I'd rather buy your engine and put it on a Stearman where it belongs than to see it destroyed doing something like that with it. It weighs too much for what you want to do anyway even if it would run at all, which it would not. What dash number is it?

    May I suggest going to an auto auction site or ebay and get a R1200GS BMW motorcycle engine? It's horizontally opposed and will climb if geared right.
     
  13. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2003
    7,912
    Shoreline,Washington
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    Robert Parks
    It hurts me to think of a beautiful R680 being chopped up to be used as a silly unique engine in a vehicle for which it was never intended and would not perform well. Sell the engine to someone who can use it for that which it was intended and retain it as a very nice aircraft engine. It seems to fall into the same category as the Model A and B autos that are chopped, channeled, and clipped into the California hot rods and thus destroyed. . There is an intrinsic value to some things that must be valued and kept. Why mutilate something just to be different?
    Switches
     
  14. dbw

    dbw Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
    897
    palo alto ca
    Full Name:
    dave
    ...all i really wanted to know was if it would run on three...:)

    i anticipated the bad guy thing..i won't try to justify it other than to say i have restored and raced grand prix bugattis and know all the rules..this engine [a -13 by the way] was run out and taken out of service.. it will run[ but only on the ground] it's gonna be mounted on my wall or someones..

    here you go..if someone can prove this thing will end up in the exact type of aircraft it was intended for[ and will fly it] they can come to my house and take it away..i'll throw in a couple hamilton standard props..both sae20's; one ground adjustable....

    i know it sounds too good to be true, but read the conditions.
     
  15. harmitc

    harmitc Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    207
    England
    Full Name:
    Bernard R
  16. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Terry H Phillips
    Dave- That is an air-cooled engine designed to have 100+ knot wind blowing over it when it is making hp. Close it in and it will overheat big-time and probably cause fires unless well insulated, and insulating will make the overheating worse. Not a good plan.

    If you want to cram an aircraft engine in a car, use a watercooled engine, like the Brits did with various RR aircraft engines. OX-5s were 90 hp and water-cooled and P/W sucked. How about a Falcon V12, not the WW-I RR version, but the version used in the subscale Mustangs?

    Taz
    Terry Phillips
     
  17. Spasso

    Spasso F1 World Champ

    Feb 16, 2003
    14,648
    Land of Slugs & Moss
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    Han Solo
    #17 Spasso, May 10, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    On a smaller scale, and it works,

    The Feuling W3.

    Jim Feuling, owner of Feuling R&D in Ventura, California (www.Feuling.com), realized that, while nothing exceeds like cubic inches, the current crop of big-bore kits for Harley-Davidson's V-twins were reaching the upper limits of practical power generation. Feuling decided that, in order to add a new wrinkle to the displacement wars, he wanted to build an engine with 50 percent more displacement than Harley's Twin Cam 88 with the 95-cubic-inch factory upgrade kit installed. The result of Feuling's idea takes the form of the working prototype shown here. Looking strangely familiar yet completely alien, the Feuling W3 may be the shape of things to come for those who fancy power cruisers.
    2000 Feuling W3

    Feuling's creation is at its core both incredibly simple and maddeningly complicated. Simply put, why not just graft an additional cylinder onto Harley's robust Twin Cam design? The result would be the desired 50 percent increase in displacement while utilizing parts that are widely available from either H-D or the aftermarket. The complicated part would be, well, actually acting on the idea. This stumbling block, however, wasn't a problem for Feuling.

    Get hard on the gas and the W3 delivers enough power to the drive belt to twist the modified Dyna frame. The Progressive Suspension handles the bump absorption duties well. The Dunlop K591 just doesn't offer enough grip to keep the rear tire from spinning up during high-rpm shifts in the lower gears.


    The full article here, http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/roadtests/feuling_w3/index.html
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  18. Tim Wells

    Tim Wells Formula Junior

    Dec 31, 2009
    393
    Dallas, GA
    Full Name:
    Tim Wells
    #18 Tim Wells, May 10, 2010
    Last edited: May 10, 2010
    It could possibly still be used as a core for rebuilding depending on its condition. It was run out of its TBO most likely which just means a recommended time between overhaul. Our Stearman has a -13 (300 HP) with a 2B20 Hamilton Standard. It would sure be nice to build that one of yours up for a spare.

    Unfortunately the plane is in Washington and I'm in Georgia. Crap.

    By the way, I never looked at it as a good guy/ bad guy thing, it would just be a shame to see that's all. If it were me doing what you want I think I'd find an old air boat and get an engine off one of those the right size. They use modified airplane flat engines which don't have to conform to FAA rules, making them cheaper since most don't have data plates anymore. They would be lighter and smaller than a big radial but you still would need good airflow accross the fins.
     

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