Cracked the oil pan... | FerrariChat

Cracked the oil pan...

Discussion in '308/328' started by montreal328, May 19, 2010.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Very Very bad day!
    Having changed car oil on all my cars for years, I thought I'll do the Ferrari... No big deal, follow DIY info on this site. Even got torque wrench for the event! That actually was my mistake. I always went by feel to put screw on. Used the torque wrench ( Used other years ago with no problem) and did not hear the ''click'' so kept on tightening... way too much... And so the result: Anybody know how much these things go for these days? And where to get them... Still debating if I'll DIY...
     
  2. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    #2 montreal328, May 19, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  3. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    #3 montreal328, May 19, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  4. PhilB

    PhilB Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 17, 2004
    2,177
    NYC, USA
    Full Name:
    Phil
    #4 PhilB, May 19, 2010
    Last edited: May 19, 2010
    It's aluminum, I would imagine the crack could be welded closed and then the treads re-tapped. (At least, that's what I did when the same thing happened to me on an aftermarket Boss 302 intake manifold....no need for torque wrenches then, just 17 year old thick head-en-ness).

    Phil
     
  5. Kevin Rev'n

    Kevin Rev'n Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Nov 29, 2009
    23,081
    Honolulu
    Full Name:
    Kevin
    #5 Kevin Rev'n, May 19, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    If the replacement pan is hard to find and you may be able to salvage part with this stuff. Devcon Aluminum Putty. Used in field repairs for military aircraft. I would say this is a second choice to welding though. To do it right you would need to open the crack up and fill and build the boss up a bit to be on the safe side. Then retap the hole.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  6. JohnnyS

    JohnnyS F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 19, 2006
    15,138
    Illinois
    Full Name:
    John
    Oh, that even makes me sad. I'll bet you said "damit" really, really loud!

    Can that aluminum be welded? It might be by a good welder that knows how to work aluminum. The threads may need to be retapped but that is an easy job.

    I am sure this has happened before and someone on this site has a fit that worked for them.
     
  7. copterjon

    copterjon Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 11, 2005
    1,536
    Mesa, Az.
    When I had my Mondial 3.2 I noticed in the records from the previous owner that the drain plug had to be welded. I would assume it was the same situation as yours. Don't worry, this kinda stuff happens.

    If your not comfortable with repairing it you might be able to find one at GT Parts in Phoenix, Az. 623-780-2200

    Best of luck!
     
  8. JOEL D.

    JOEL D. Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    222
    Boston, MA
    Full Name:
    Joel DeLuca
    PM me when you can, I think I have a spare around here somewhere, I did the same thing years ago and had it heli-arc welded.
     
  9. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    The language used was not suitable for this web site!!! PG 13 stuff...
     
  10. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Assuming I decide to take oil pan out by myself... What should I know first. ( yes I will think to drain the oil first) then what?
     
  11. BRADAN

    BRADAN Two Time F1 World Champ
    BANNED

    Aug 29, 2009
    22,661
    West Babylon, NY
    Full Name:
    BRADAN
    You can weld and re-tap the pan.

    -Clamp the pan to a steel table
    -Tape all edges
    -Fill the pan with argon gas
    -Tig weld your crack shut
    -Tap the thread
    -Have the pan gasket surface milled flat by a engine machine shop
     
  12. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,218
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Not sure that's a good idea, there's pressure balls and springs the regulate the oil pump, that will fly everywhere!

    Maybe find a new part and have a shop change it then repair your old one as a "spare"....
     
  13. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    That's the type of knowledge I'm looking for... So there is more to unscrewing all the bolts around the pan to take it off, i.e. pieces falling off etc...
     
  14. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Also, what type of gasket does it require to put it back together?
     
  15. PhilB

    PhilB Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 17, 2004
    2,177
    NYC, USA
    Full Name:
    Phil
    #15 PhilB, May 19, 2010
    Last edited: May 19, 2010
    I'm pretty certain anyone who mentioned above that welding the pan would solve this, presumed you would be removing the pan from the car first.

    Try this link:

    http://www.ricambiamerica.com/

    Look up your car, and then the correct parts diagram or table for that area of the car, I think you need to check Table #25 if your car is non-ABS, or Table #27 if your car is an ABS version. Then contact Daniel at Ricambi, he'll set you up with the right gasket.

    Also, I don't know how the oil sump cover is on a 328, but your photos appear to show the plug at a right angle to the base of the pan, maybe it's just the perspective of the photos, but are you sure you cracked the oil sump bolt hole, and not the gear box sump bolt hole?

    I'm not familiar with the 328's setup, but thought it was similar to a 308QV, which I am familiar with. Someone else with more experience should be along shortly to verify.

    Only other advice I have is to be careful not to snap any of the pan studs when removing the bolts and pan. If you're laying on your back under the car, make sure your ratchet handle is set correctly, as your orientation is upside down and you may tighten the bolt instead of loosening it.

    Good luck,
    Phil
     
  16. alfa-guy

    alfa-guy Rookie

    Jan 27, 2004
    42
    Going through this on my QV right now.

    A small crack in the lower sump radiating out from the drain hole, although from your photos it looks like the drain plug is in the side of the sump, where on the QV it's in the bottom.

    Brought mine to a local tool & die shop that I use for odd jobs, they are going weld the crack from the inside and then re-drill the hole, and replace the heli-coil.

    This last part is turning out to be difficult, as I have had difficulty finding a 22mm x 1.5 helicoil kit. No place seems to stock it, and everyplace I've called can't get it although Helicoil does offer one in that size. I think I've located two possible sources and will be ordering one tomorrow.

    From what I understand this is a pretty common problem. Funny, I was thinking that perhaps it's time to start using a torque wrench on that as I figured I must have over tightened it to cause the crack. Perhaps I should re-think that ...

    There are several threads (search for shift shaft seal replacement since this requires removal of the sump) that cover the removal process.

    Jeff
     
  17. PhilB

    PhilB Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 17, 2004
    2,177
    NYC, USA
    Full Name:
    Phil
    I've never used a torque wrench here, but I always use a new copper crush washer, and there is a "feel" when the washer "gives" and you've tightened the plug enough.

    Phil
     
  18. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

    Oct 31, 2003
    12,916
    The twilight zone
    Full Name:
    The Butcher
    You can have the thread CNC milled too.
     
  19. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    On the 328 the oil plug is on side of oil pan... i.e. the torque wrench is perpendicular to the ground (DIY section as good pics from Carl Rose). Mike, you should know, when removing the pan, is it strait forward...bolts out, pan off... or will a bunch of pieces fall out!!!
     
  20. JOEL D.

    JOEL D. Karting

    Nov 2, 2003
    222
    Boston, MA
    Full Name:
    Joel DeLuca
    I don't know about that,my 328 is very early, #60563, Oct. 1985 production and my drain plug is in the bottom of the pan. Also is this the pan or the "sump cover" or are they one and the same?
     
  21. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    #21 montreal328, May 20, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  22. chris marsh

    chris marsh F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 30, 2005
    5,568
    Detroit
    Full Name:
    Chris Marsh
    That devcon epoxy will be fine and will last for years and year.

    I have fixed automatic transmission housings with the stuff. Actually built up and cut new channles in transmiision housings that were cast wrong.

    But if you feel you want to take it apart and weld it that'll work too.
     
  23. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,145
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #23 Steve Magnusson, May 20, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The newer style engine oil pan (that allows the oil pickup to be more submerged and minimize starvation under hard cornering) was introduced on the 328 in SB 10-16 (so there are 328 with both types of engine oil pans):
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  24. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Ha HA!!! Yes, mine looks like the newer type (with bolt on side) Very informative!
    So... Still the haunting question::: Just a cover or not?
     
  25. montreal328

    montreal328 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2009
    428
    Qué
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Chris, how exactly is the devcon epoxy applied on a small crack like that? Have'nt look at it from close-up but the crack must go through the bolt opening...
     

Share This Page