Shift speed | FerrariChat

Shift speed

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by solowmodel, May 18, 2010.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. solowmodel

    solowmodel Formula Junior

    Jul 31, 2009
    433
    Seoul, London, VA
    Full Name:
    WK
    I forget..what is the shift speed of the new gearboxes in the 458 and California? Is it 50ms? I remember reading that figure somewhere but not sure if it's accurate.

    And whilst we're on the subject, are all the other DSG (the VW, BMW, Porsche etc.) similar?
     
  2. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,681
    Its down in the range where it really doesn't mater.

    The DCT boxes are disengauging one clutch from the gear you are in and engauging the other clutch to the gear you are going to simultaneously.
     
  3. solowmodel

    solowmodel Formula Junior

    Jul 31, 2009
    433
    Seoul, London, VA
    Full Name:
    WK
    I was just wondering how they were in relation to the latest iteration of the F1 gearboxes (60ms).
     
  4. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,183
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    35 to 40 m?
     
  5. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    105,367
    Vegas baby
    You know, this weekend I did something for the first time in the F430. I took it to the redline in first and shifted into 2nd in race mode.

    That darn gearbox just SLAMS the gears in place. I thought someone hit me from behind.

    If the 458 is anything like that or even faster, it's going to be amazing.
     
  6. Lesia44

    Lesia44 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 5, 2009
    17,814
    Why have you never done that before? Is there any other way to shift from first to second? :)
     
  7. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    105,367
    Vegas baby
    I freely admit it... I'm a WIMP. But, I do like driving this car!
     
  8. ChalStrad

    ChalStrad Formula 3

    Jan 22, 2004
    2,249
    Lausanne Switzerland
    Full Name:
    Peter Mann
    The 458 is faster and has no "slam" so you don't suffer for the mechanical components! The system is also known as "zerlift" as there is no interruption in torque delivery.
     
  9. Lesia44

    Lesia44 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 5, 2009
    17,814
    :)
     
  10. Hawkeye

    Hawkeye F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Sep 20, 2009
    8,148
    I loved that about the F430, it's like being kicked by a horse. The 458 should be amazing fun.
     
  11. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    13,352
    Sunbelt
    Full Name:
    Bro
    I'm actually looking forward to the smoother shifting 458
    I found the 430 slam action a bit annoying
     
  12. SCantera

    SCantera F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 4, 2004
    5,830
    Living Falls NC
    Jazzie,
    Unfortunately I did not get to drive the 458 in anger while in Maranello for a test drive. But when I did get to put some foot into it the shifting was incredibly quick and very smooth. Between engine controls and the dual clutch system the gear transition was all but unnoticable w/ the exception of a minor kick between 1st and 2nd. And it was minor.

    I think there are two opposing schools of thought on the slam action of the 430 and Scud. I know of at least two Scud owners that are hesitant of acquiring a 458 and losing that slam. On the other side the speed of the shift in the 458 all but eliminates any unbalancing of a car going created by the on-off-on the power. I would venture to guess this helps lap times for the skilled driver.
     
  13. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    13,352
    Sunbelt
    Full Name:
    Bro
    Thanks for the insight I'm really looking forward to the quick and smooth shift action of the 458.
    I've always found the slam action a bit unsettling it seems to momentarily take your focus away from the car.
     
  14. lung7707

    lung7707 F1 World Champ

    Jan 13, 2002
    15,967
    Honolulu, Hawaii
    Full Name:
    Rupert 9.0
    Its interesting that you say that... there are many who like it.. esp on the Scuderia.
     
  15. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    13,352
    Sunbelt
    Full Name:
    Bro
    Everyone has there own peculiar preferences mine is smooth shifting others like the big bang.
    For the last 30 years of driving manual shift cars I always preferred to shift in a manner which does not upset the balance of the car and is not jarring to any passengers.So I have gotten accustomed to a smooth shift pattern
     
  16. Integra

    Integra Karting

    Mar 24, 2010
    183
    Monaco
    Full Name:
    Federico
    Exactly! a friend just picked up its new 458 today,and i could test the car... amazing! But i really miss that bang of my Scud, i'd never change that!! and the speed is very similar.. very different from 430 standard.
     
  17. jcavalie

    jcavalie Formula Junior
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 4, 2005
    660
    Oakland, CA
    Full Name:
    Jim
    IIRC it is around 20ms, some 40ms faster than the fastest F1 boxes in the production cars. I also recall that with the dual clutch, they could dial it to basically 0ms, but then it feels like a CVT, so they added a small amount of delay so you could feel the shift. It is fast enough though, that you don't get the kick in the back like the F1 in the F430. In my California, I hear a loud pop and feel a constant rush of torque accelerating the car. In my F430, the transmission feels comparatively slow...something that seemed impossible until I owned both and could drive them back to back.
     
  18. shawsan

    shawsan Formula 3

    Jul 2, 2004
    1,090
    Vancouver, Canada
    I'm suprised to hear you say you were able to 'test the car' because, if new, the owner should be allowing for at least a 1000 km to break in the engine, not exceeding around 5500 rpms.
     
  19. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,681
    Big Bang is fine for drag racing, smooth and quick is better for road racing. A big Bang shift in the middle of a long sweeper is a recipie for the rear end stepping out big time.
     
  20. F2003-GA

    F2003-GA F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    13,352
    Sunbelt
    Full Name:
    Bro
    Thanks Mitch, Finally someone on the same page as me :)
     
  21. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

    Nov 11, 2003
    13,183
    Orange County
    Full Name:
    Anthony T
    Don't pick on Bob or else!
     
  22. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    105,367
    Vegas baby
    Or else... they'll die laughing!
     
  23. krzys@earthlink.net

    [email protected] Formula Junior

    Oct 9, 2007
    785
    Darien, ct
    Full Name:
    Krzysztof
    No, it's not. The shift is too fast to cause any problems. Just the opposite, in fact. I started shifting while coming into Big Bend at lime rock. In the regular 430, this would be a recipe for a rear lock-up and a spin, but in the scud, the shifts are so fast that the net effect is actually beneficial: the car gets slightly unsettled helping it turn in.
     
  24. Phenom

    Phenom Karting

    Dec 30, 2009
    206
    DCT boxes basically are seamless, with no real shifttime.

    Lexus LFA: 200 ms
    Enzo: 120ms
    599 GTB: 100
    BMW M5: 65ms
    430 Scud: 60

    458 Italia: ~0ms
    BMW M3: ~0ms
    Veyron: ~8ms
    The time it takes for your brain to register someones facial expression: 200ms
     
  25. Scuderia980

    Scuderia980 F1 Rookie

    Aug 12, 2006
    3,636
    Mountains--Colorado
    Full Name:
    Dave S. V
    quotes by the brand PR folks mean squat:) each has their own 'interpretation' of how to measure the shifts...ie, when the shift actually starts and when it is entirely completed..
     

Share This Page