Does my idle sound normal? 85 QV video

+1. That is pretty critical information right there regarding the smell. Steve is right on with the advice.

 

I would also add that you need to check to see if your CAT is functioning... often times its disconnected and you can end up with a rich mix when its warm out.

as for the idle it seemed normal to me, 2000 rpm on warm up is also in range... i would not start to adjust the idle mixture... it is sensitive to CO, and then that just starts a whole range of issues if you dont have the skill - meters to check the K jet...

if you have anything wrong, I would look for a cracked vaccum hose to and from the WUR and the thermo time switch / Aux air valve under the catch tank. also the small L shaped hose that goes up to the cold start injector can get a crack in it...

 

I dont have a lot of the shop manuals...

Can somone post the location of the warm up reg and the thermo time switch ?

Thanks so much.

I've been reading posts non stop. I have lot to check.

 

**The easiest 02 sensor wire access on my 85'qv, was on the outside edge of my air cleaner box, against the RR fender area. (I think I extended the wire for easier access).
I've also read(article by JRV) that the 02 voltage with a warm engine and 02 "disconnected", should read a steady, approx .7v from the sensor. I verified it with my car as well.

 

Wow, I have read that when o2 sensor disconnected it should be a steady .5 volts, is this only for Ferraris and who is JRV. I could never get a steady .5 volts, but I could get it at .7 volts which is where my car felt happiest but was afraid I might be too rich.

 

I believe you might be mixing two measurments here -- when the O2 sensor is unplugged at warm idle, the voltage on the (unplugged) wire from the O2 sensor would be in the 0.7V ballpark (i.e., a little richer than stoichiometric); the voltage on the (unplugged) wire from the Jetronic ECU will be at 0.5V.

 

Didn;t have time to play with the car today so i'll have to run the tests tomorrow. Does my 85 have an electro valve? I couldn't find it where it should be under the hood.

following these posts.

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=261833&page=2

 

Is your '85 QV a US version (has electrovalve and FV) or euro version (no electrovalve nor FV)?

 

Its a US Steve

 

I just did my injectors and the difference is amazing ! What should be mentioned when doing injectors is the rubber seals that seal the injector in the inlet and also position the injector in the right spot.
Only after replacing them did I realise how wrong mine were. Somebody must have detected the seals were leaking so they had gone to great lengths to add a rubber sealant around the top of the injectors under the plug with the hex hole in it. They had injectors at all different positions in and out of the inlets.

Air leaks at these positions can produce all sorts of problems ...... The benefit of new seals (and injectors) is the smoother idle and much more top end power. It used to fade away when the tacho got near 7,000 , , , , now it rapidly climbs past 8,000 and I took my foot off the gas at that point.

 

Are the other componets of the air injection system present or missing?
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all other components seem to be there. Is it somewhere else on a late production 85?

So, the FV is working and buzzing just as it should. Wires look good but i need new plugs. Cold start injector is operating as it should as well. No leaks in the hoses that I could find. Still have to check the O2 sensor.

Here are some photos...am i missing any parts?

last shot is of the mixtue screw

the car has a cat but i wonder if it's toast.
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i followed the line rom the cut off valve and found all of the equiptment hidden under the overflow tank. It's all there

 

Sure looks like you are missing:

1. the differential pressure switch -- which is used to briefly fire the cold start injector during cold-running throttle blips (like an accelerator pump on a carburettor), and

2. the electrovalve -- which is used to open the cutoff valve when cold (turning "on" the air injection) and close the cutoff valve when warm (turning "off" the air injection)

Where is the small vacuum hose labeled in the diagram connected? If it is just left open to the atmosphere that would leave the air injection system always "off" -- which would be OK for warm-running, but not the greatest for the cat during cold-running.
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i followed the line from the cut off valve and found all of the equiptment hidden under the overflow tank. It's all there

i take it that that is not the typical location...

i can remove the tank and photgraph it if you like

 

Glad to hear that you've got the stuff (it's important IMO). Usually the OM figures are fairly accurate in terms of that physical placement, but maybe yours is as should be -- I don't have access to a '84-'85 US 308QV SPC (or car) to check. Anyway, now that you've found the electrovalve, you can confirm/deny proper operation.

 

Follow these instructions Steve?

Measure the voltage between the two terminals on the electrovalve when at warm idle -- if it is (wrongly) +12V, you most likely have the wrong logic coolant thermoswitch installed, or the coolant thermoswitch has failed and is just always stuck "closed". If it is 0V, and vacuum is still present on the small vacuum line going to the cutoff valve then the electrovalve itself has failed. Also confirm that the small vacuum lines are connected correctly to the electrovalve (as mixing these up can change the functional logic):

 

I believe so -- the desired bottom line is:

1. when cold = vacuum is present on the small vacuum line going to the top of the cutoff valve, and

2. when warm = no vacuum present on the small vacuum line going to the top of the cutoff valve.

 

roger that,

O2 sensor question....measure at the sensor itself or from the ECU....which is better/easier?

If I ever get out to Texas Steve I owe you some beer and BBQ. This help is MUCH appreciated.

 

Can't really help with that -- see post #21.

 

On to check the AAV tonight.

The change in warm idle whenn i close the air bypass screw is negligible...maybe 200 rpm at most. is that normal? I though ti should drop from 1000 rpm at idle to 500ish not 800-850?

 

AAv is working as should. It's open enough at room temp and closes when hot. Fridge to oven test. oven was set to 300

I wonder if it's bad gas or a burned out cat causing the richness smell. the last owner put less than 1000 miles on the car in the past 2 years and I know that it was sitting with a half tank for a few months before I bought it.

 

I would have though it should drop more than that as you say so that can only be because the engine is getting its air someplace else. Either a leak or the idle screw is set pretty wide open. The idle screw should be set so that it is just touching the arm (so it just snags a piece of paper when you put one in between) and then plus half a turn.

Set that correctly and then set the warm idle with the air screw again & See what you have got.

Also check that the throttle butterfly is closing properly - they get a build up of crap round the edge. Let the idle screw right off & then see if you can gently push the butterfly any further closed. If you can then remove the throttle body & clean it with some carb cleaner.

Once you are happy that the TB is set up correctly then I can only suggest you continue looking for air leaks. Take every hose off one at a time & and check it for holes & splits. If they are all sound then if it is over-fuelling then maybe the Warm up reg and/or cold start injector are misbehaving.

Did you check the continuity on the electrical connection in the AAV? I believe there is some kind of heater element in there & I recall Rifledriver saying the things don't work properly if it is broken - regardless of what the fridge/oven test says.

Also once you have set the TB up then you need to check the CO on a gas analyser.
As a rough guide, have you pulled any of the spark plugs? What do they look like?

 

noy yet, shoult it be reading 12v? If so, cold or warm?

The plugs looked ok but they wer gapped incorrectly so I cleaned and gapped them. Some were finger tight or less.

 

Not normal...and what I was eluding to in our emails (that the base throttle angle setting has been tampered with by the "unknowing"....)

And yes, the warm idle should drop slightly below 500 rpm, with the air bypass closed.

Neither the AAV or the base throttle angle setting have really anything (relevant) to do with your rich running. Do you know with certainly that your car really has a (functioning) converter on her?

Getting back to basics, have you measured/taken a sample of the exhaust with an analyzer? This test in itself would reveal what state of tune the engine is really in.

Best,
David