Low Compression, three cylinders | FerrariChat

Low Compression, three cylinders

Discussion in '348/355' started by Gary Logan, Sep 24, 2010.

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  1. Gary Logan

    Gary Logan Karting

    Dec 19, 2009
    54
    West Vancouver, BC
    Full Name:
    Gary Logan
    Hello: Still conducting the dd on the potential purchase of a 97 355. All looks good except low compression in three cylinders, all on one bank. The car has been sitting. Some are suggesting that with a good "hot" run the compression will improve. This makes sense to me to a degree, however I am still concerned. Thoughts appreciated.
     
  2. HernanTroya9

    HernanTroya9 Rookie
    BANNED

    Aug 26, 2010
    44
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Hernan Troya
    What do you mean by low? What are ALL the numbers?
     
  3. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,741
    Drop the compression test, go for the Leak-Down test. It will reveal all.

    If the PPI-er can't do it, find someone who can.
     
  4. FerrariDeeJay

    FerrariDeeJay Formula Junior

    Jun 2, 2009
    418
    Chino, CA
    Full Name:
    Michael
    Gary, remember that any issues with low compression will involve removing the engine and tearing it apart which will be expensive, so factor that into the price. Also, valve guides will need to be done if they haven't already as well as manifolds $$$. Good luck!
     
  5. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2004
    7,792
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Bruce Bogart
    #5 plugzit, Sep 24, 2010
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2010
    Yes, I would have them do an Italian tune-up before additional testing, so there's no doubt if it needs to be done. No need to jump to conclusions. The entire benefit of any doubt about that should be given. If the previous owner of the 355 was typical of many, the motor's never been over 3k rpm! (Now there's some words that'll be flamed!)
     
  6. enginefxr

    enginefxr Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2007
    1,753
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    Gary Sharpe
    Whaaaaaat???? :D
     
  7. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    13,662
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    My 328 saw north of 7K this morning.
    My 355 regularly sees 7K.
    My M3 visits the redline often and has a close relationship with a cousin named "governor"
     
  8. Gary Logan

    Gary Logan Karting

    Dec 19, 2009
    54
    West Vancouver, BC
    Full Name:
    Gary Logan
    Gentlemen: Thanks to all that have responded. Following are the compression readings for each cylinder:

    1 165

    2 170

    3 140

    4 165

    5 135

    6 110

    7 140

    8 165

    After a brief run, approximately 30 minutes, city boosts only, the compression in 6 rose to 120. Number 7, 145, number 5 140.

    The dealer is willing to give me letter stating that they would pay for the work if a valve job was required. I have developed the following formula to guide him. All low cylinder must rise to within 5% of the mean compression of the other 6.

    Thoughts, I think I am OK.
     
  9. Rob'Z

    Rob'Z Formula 3

    Mar 29, 2008
    1,024
    Tucson,AZ
    Full Name:
    Robert
    I'm no expert but I think your highest cylinders are borderline.
     
  10. jetfixr

    jetfixr Formula 3

    Jun 14, 2007
    1,016
    northeast
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    Gone
    Depends on the tester of course but ALL of my cylinders hit 190-200
     
  11. James-NZ

    James-NZ F1 Veteran

    Jun 26, 2007
    5,822
    Hamilton, NewZealand
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    James
    Leak down is the next step IMO.
     
  12. Rob'Z

    Rob'Z Formula 3

    Mar 29, 2008
    1,024
    Tucson,AZ
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    Robert
    Very true but either way the variation between them is a bad sign in itself.



    Rob
     
  13. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    All of them are low for a 355. If you've repeated the test and they're not even and a lot higher, it needs to come apart.
     
  14. enginefxr

    enginefxr Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2007
    1,753
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    Leakdown time!
    Investigate the history. If it's had header replacement somewhere down the line, I'd almost be willing to bet it's got a few bad liners..... but the leakdown will pin point it.....
    And sometimes it will leak past the valves enough and you won't discover the bad liner until the head is removed.
    Ask me how I know......
     
  15. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,055
    USA
    +1. Gary, I would pass on this car and move on. Not worth your time.
     
  16. niklas

    niklas Formula 3

    Apr 25, 2008
    1,535
    Chilliwack BC
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    N. Olafsson
    Gary, I'm sorry to hear you're having problems with this car already. We talked briefly in your other thread.

    I believe you said this was the Siyam car, correct? Go have a wander over to Auto One and check out their 355. I know you said it had extensive repairs to it, but like I said earlier, if everything is all in line, then go for it. Have it checked out fully, and go from there. It's a beautiful example - I'll just be bummed because you'd beat me to it :p

    One other thing -- Joseph from Prancing Horse is familiar with Auto One's 355 (I THINK). He's a good man, I've known him for a long time. Talk to him and see what's up with the car, if anything.

    Good luck.
     
  17. notbostrom

    notbostrom Formula Junior

    May 8, 2006
    957
    Orlando, FL
    Full Name:
    Ben
    way to many "good" cars out there to play with this one...............
     
  18. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
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    Dec 1, 2004
    7,792
    Redondo Beach, CA
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    Bruce Bogart
    Serious problem. Very serious. This car needs to be fixed first.
     
  19. enginefxr

    enginefxr Formula 3

    Aug 20, 2007
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    Cmon! Somebody needs to buy it, pull the engine and ship it to the midwest!!! :D
     
  20. jevs

    jevs Formula Junior

    Oct 13, 2010
    477
    Missouri
    I would try another compression tester just to be sure (especially if your going to test it again anyway). Could you be chasing a bad O-ring, crappy gauge or fitting on their tester? How does it feel when you drive it? I would think you could feel those numbers if you have driven another 355 to compare to? Does it smoke on cold startup, during high revs, or consume oil abnormaly etc.?

    I second the leakdown check.

    I'm new to Ferrari's so my opinion is just from the other zillion cars I have built and worked on, so take it with a grain of salt.

    I should get my 355 next week if all goes well. The compression checks 1500 miles ago on this car were all over 200 psi except one I beleive. He was saying them over the phone while I was driving, so I did not write them down.
     
  21. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
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    Dave Helms
    Tests taken at what altitude? In BC?

    A drive and a warm engine will increase Overall numbers but wont fix dead holes.
     
  22. Monteman

    Monteman Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2006
    2,348
    Santa Barbara, CA
    Full Name:
    Monte
    +1

    We jump to the conclusion that it's always the valves but if the car had a bad header and drove it that way for a long time I'd be willing to bet that the cylinder liners are shot. That's a lot more extensive of a repair than simply pulling the heads.
     
  23. SKUSA

    SKUSA Formula Junior

    Dec 6, 2009
    476
    Norcal
    I have 47,000 miles on my '95 and a recent compression test showed all cylinders above 200. She runs like a banshee. Keep looking.
     
  24. Doctor7474

    Doctor7474 Formula Junior

    Jun 20, 2010
    367
    Hoover Al,former Atl
    Full Name:
    Doctor
    Like others have said, do a leak down test which is the same procedure as far as labor is concerned as a compression test.

    This will show where the air is going either the crank case, cooling system, exhaust, or intake manifold.

    Intake manifold or exhaust could be valve problems (cracked/burned/seat problems) or cracked head.

    Cooling system could be head gasket, liners, or cracked head.

    Crank case could be pistons/rings, head gasket, or cracked head.

    Do it both dry and wet (wet usually involves putting a small amount of ATF in the cylinders turning the engine over and then retesting). This will sometimes show the rings as being the issue among other things.
     
  25. FullChat

    FullChat Formula Junior

    Jan 1, 2007
    339
    San Antonio, Texas
    IIRC, the compression specs on the 355 is over 150 psi and all the cylinders within 10%. Not even close.

    Expensive problems lurk within...

    RUN! RUN! RUN!
     

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