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F355 University

Discussion in '348/355' started by Sandy Eggo, Sep 20, 2010.

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  1. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
    Full Name:
    Dave Helms
    #76 davehelms, Oct 22, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2010
    Ports for hyd. fluid transfer, make sure they are loctited to seal the threads! The holes in the photo are for the F1 TOB position sensor.
     
  2. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
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    Rick
    Indeed it was Loctited.

    In the words of the shop looking at my alternator... "it's completely melted". :( Good news is that it should be good as new by end of day and the flywheel is on it's way back too.

    Silver lining for m5guy is that while we've been essentially at a stand-still for the past couple days, John has been making progress on your engine. Valve covers are off, plugs are out, my guess is by now he's degreeing the cams. If you want the gold connector kit done, LMK, I could do it for a small fee... :D I am going to need some extra cash to pay my bill anyway.
     
  3. m5guy

    m5guy Formula 3

    Aug 17, 2008
    1,627
    Ventura, CA.
    Full Name:
    Greg
    #78 m5guy, Oct 22, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2010
    Thanks for the update Rick. The rebuilt manifolds arrived there from Ricambi today too, so progress is being made on both of our cars. Stephen also said that the sticky switches were being pulled out and sent off for refinishing. Got my fingers crossed that everything goes smoothly next week.

    My nephew is a freshman in high school and they live off of Del Mar Heights Road. I told him I'd swing by his school and give him a ride home when I come down to pick up the car. That should count as his early Christmas present!
     
  4. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
    Full Name:
    Rick
    Hi Everyone - sorry for no updates in a while. I was travelling the past week and busy, busy, busy at work.

    Good news: The car is done, I picked it up Friday evening. Whoo-hoo. I really missed this car!

    Bad news: It was Friday evening and not an open road to be found anywhere!! After taking the long road home and being frustrated every inch of the way, I parked it. However, I woke up early to post this up and get some seat time in my 'new' car.

    Some initial impressions:

    - What little opportunity I did have last night, I could tell that the car drives like it just took a double-shot of espresso. The car feels sharper, more responsive, and eager...chomping at the bit with a menacing snarl in it's throat. It really deserves the name I gave it on the license plate "RMPANTE"...it certainly is a *rampant*, wild beast of a horse now!!

    - Oh, and the noises she makes now...I cannot even describe it...it's really rather frightening. Best I can do is "ear splitting trumpet of god". I'm running test pipes now until I can be sure whatever was causing the damage to the Cats is rectified...no sense melting another pair of expensive cats until I can be sure. Ran the gas analyzer on the car and everything looked as expected.

    - Clutch pedal was light, much easier to actuate than before. Clutch seems to 'bite' earlier and is a bit more sensitive to stalling out. I suspect this behavior will moderate as the completely new clutch system 'beds' itself in over the next 50 miles or so.

    - So far, no warning lights, oddball behaviors or anything troubling. I guess I scored 100% on my Gold Connector upgrade project. :D

    - Since I was out of town, the Tech did the Helms O2 sensor harness upgrade and noted to me that the connectors were not gold. Dave Helms, could you please comment on the upgrade/benefit of the new harness/connectors? Also, the Tech also gave me feedback that we didn't have the right tool to pop the old connectors out.

    - I asked the shop to perform a leakdown test as I had some concern that whatever was eating the Cats could have lead to engine wear (or vice versa, I suppose). The motor is very strong and leakdown was 2-4% across the board. Given that 2% is pretty much where the motor is at when it leaves the factory, I'm VERY satisfied.

    - The alternator was completely rebuilt and main contact cable/wire had to be overhauled due to about 2-3 inches worth of oxidization.

    - The targa panel looks awesome. I'm afraid to take it off and stow it now ... almost want to line the leather pouch/panel cover with microfiber or felt or something. Has anyone done this?

    - Although the gear oil was not changed (I have been happy with how it shifts, even cold), I swear it is even smoother than before. How can this be, I dunno...

    When I have all the invoices and parts sorted out, I'll post all of that info too. Sneak preview...all of this happiness has a price tag and it's worth every penny as near as I can tell so far.

    Well, that's it for now. It'll be light soon here so I'm going to fire up the wild beast and head out for a drive!!!!!
     
  5. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
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    Dave Helms
    Not Gold by design for reasons far to involved to get into here.

    The benefit is you are restarting the clock 10-15 years back on these connections. New plugs were supplied so no tool is required, that too was by design. The O2 sensors are considered a service part that has a finite life span. As these new fuels hit us full force they will be replaced far more often that they have been in the past.

    In a short time these O2 sensors will be outdated with new designs coming. Until that time the new contacts serve the purpose well.

    Now I need to know what seat of the pants changes can be felt.
     
  6. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
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    Rick
    Thanks for the clarifications Dave. Regarding seat-of-the-pants assessment, here's what I would say (a bit of a repeat from earlier post):

    Car drives like it just took a double-shot of espresso. The car feels sharper, more responsive, and eager...chomping at the bit with a menacing snarl in it's throat. I'd also add that it feels like it is racing more freely up through the revs.

    On the down side, 2 things are causing concern at the moment.
    1) Car is difficult to start when bone-cold. This makes no sense to me, I re-conditioned the starter a few months ago, have a new battery, and just re-conditioned the alternator. Why is it being such a PITA to start??

    2) On a drive yesterday, the steering got very heavy in the twisties (felt like steering a bobsled) and at the end of the 'run' I looked up to see smoke emanating from the engine bay...NOT GOOD!!! This is a real butt-clencher of a moment for any Ferrari owner. I pulled over within a couple hundred yards and shut her down. Best I can tell, I have a PS fluid leak that was generating the smoke and causing it to steer very heavy. The part that doesn't add up though is that the PS fluid level was fine. Could such a small leak creat that much smoke and horrible steering dynamics??

    I'm taking it to the shop this morning to get it fixed.
     
  7. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
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    Dave Helms
    Run results are as expected then.

    1) Doesnt want to crank problem or cranking a lot?

    2) Restriction in the HP PS line causing a pump overheat
     
  8. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
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    Rick
    1) cranking but not firing. Twist the key again and it fires immediately. Suspects are DME relay or fuel pump.

    2) PS belt came off. Not sure if pump seized or if belt was installed incorrectly. Smoke was likely a result of pieces of belt laying on hot engine. Sure was spooky to have zero power assist though.
     
  9. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    Felt like a real man in a 348, I'd guess. ;)
     
  10. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
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    Rick
    More like a member of Jamaican bobsled team but yeah...same thing. :D
     
  11. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
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    Rick
    Ok, got the car back last night...whew...for a little while it was looking like the engine was going to have to come out again.

    1) Shop observed same behavior. Only happens on a bone-cold start. Cleaned all the relays, replaced a couple fuses ... we'll see if it behaves any better.

    2) Some kind of spacer was 'missing' and a pivot bolt came loose...over about 50 miles of driving, the whole thing worked itself apart and tossed the belt off the rails. Thankfully, they were able to put it all back together with the engine still in the car and validate that no other damage was done. Still a mystery how this even happened since the pivot bolt is not something to fiddle with when doing the belt service in the first place.
     
  12. AceMaster

    AceMaster Three Time F1 World Champ

    Feb 6, 2009
    34,785
    Ontario, Canada
    Full Name:
    Mike
    :)
     
  13. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
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    Rick
    I almost feel like I should start a new thread for this info but since it all has to do with my "major" major...I figured this is where it all belongs.

    Let me also start by saying, my car was in good/great shape before I did all this work - strong motor, excellent cosmetically, all known issues addressed (headers, worn cylinder liners, valve guides, sticky dash, etc). What I believe I have now is a car better than factory fresh...

    LABOR:
    Shop Labor charges for standard 30k Service - $3,910
    -- Remove engine and transmission
    -- Replace timing belts and camshaft seals
    -- Time camshafts to factory spec
    -- Change all filters, fluids and spark plugs
    -- Replace the front main seal
    -- Flush the brake system
    -- Charge the A/C system
    -- Adjust the handbrake
    Labor, strip and repaint valve covers in red wrinkle paint - $250
    Labor, inspect and rebuild clutch and flywheel - $517.50
    -- Uneven wear on disc and flywheel
    -- Pressure plate spring rivets too close to clutch contact surface, not enough material to resurface and re-install safely
    -- Flywheel sublet to be machined
    -- New clutch pack ordered
    -- Throw out bearing found to be worn and noisy
    -- Hill Engineering Throw Out bearing and sleeve ordered and installed
    -- Replace input shaft seals and throw out bearing and flange assembly
    -- Re-assemble unit to complete
    Labor, assist with Gold Connector upgrade - $690
    Labor, assist with Coolant hose upgrade - $460
    Labor, inspect and replace water pump bearing and seal - $287.50
    Labor, inspect Cats, remove cats, re-install new cats - $345
    Labor, diagnose and repair alternator and burned plastic terminal / main contact wire - $172.50
    Labor, test exhaust emissions on gas analyzer - $57.50
    Labor, final safety check - $57.50
    -- Tire pressures
    -- Torquing wheels
    -- Check lights
    -- Check fluid levels
    -- Test drive
    -- Detail vehicle
    Labor, install fuel block recall - $57.50
    Labor, leak down test (results 2-4% across all 8 cylinders) - $172.50

    PARTS:
    Tire Rack - 2 x Rear Michelin PS2s - $743.93
    Scuderia Rampante 2.7 Motronic Gold Connector Kit - $729.95
    Scuderia Rampante Coolant Hoses - $951.99
    Scuderia Rampante O2 Sensor Option - $86.60
    Fuel block kit - $128.65
    Hill Engineering cam belt pulleys (2) - $424
    Cam cover gaskets (4) - $68.39
    Camshaft seal o-rings (2) - $11.94
    Cam o-ring (4) - $9.20
    Camshaft seals (4) - $131.68
    Seal rings (8) - $8.40
    Cam End Plate Gasket (2) - $27.04
    Seal Rings (4) - $7.16
    Seal Ring - $2.20
    Timing Belt (2) - $271.58
    Spark Plugs (NGK x 8) - $197.84
    Fuel Filter - $46.97
    Air Filter (2) - $91.08
    Oil Filter - $31.30
    P/S Belt - $19.20
    Alternator Belt - $33.90
    Alt Belt - $26.28
    RH Belt Cover - $225
    Clutch Kit - $925.86
    Seal Ring - $47.95
    Bearing and shaft - $239.95
    Water Pump O-Ring - $13.53
    O-Ring - $1.73
    Crankshaft Seal - $57.07
    Bushings (4) - $9.96
    Screw - $3.49
    ATE Super Blue Brake Fluid - $29.53
    Hill Engineering Throw Out Bearing - $542
    Hill Engineering Flange - $636
    Seal Ring - $59.85
    O Ring (3) - $75
    O Ring - $1.80
    Clutch reline - $250
    Hyperflow Cats - $1,525
    Engine Oil - $107.91
    Coolant - $29.98
    Hondabond sealant - $14.50
    Brake cleaner (2) - $10.16
    Wrinkle paint (2) - $23.98

    MISC/SUBLET:
    Refinish / paint targa top - $640
    Machine flywheel - $160
    Rebuilt alternator - $295
    Various shipping charges - ~300

    Sales Tax: $557.09

    Grand Total: Approximately $17,800

    ...whew...

    I should be good for 5 years ...heck, there's nothing left to replace!!! :D

    PS I already told the wife...so none of you jokers get any funny ideas about blackmailing me. lol.
     
  14. yronZFF

    yronZFF Formula Junior
    Owner

    Dec 21, 2009
    749
    FIVE-O
    Full Name:
    Ron
    WOW! :eek: and DOUBLE WOW!! :eek: :eek:
     
  15. wazie7262

    wazie7262 Formula 3

    Feb 13, 2008
    2,357
    Temecula, CA
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Good. Sweet. Jesus. You must REALLY love that car, Rick! Glad you got her all done and that it won't (better not!) need ANYTHING other than an oil change for the next five years!
     
  16. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
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    Rick
    Guilty as charged...I plan to be buried in this car with various body parts stuffed in the Schedoni luggage. The Challenge wheels are in the will...kidding.

    Let it never be said that I skimped on maintenance...However, I was very disappointed when a new Hyundai was not included for the price. :D

    Scott...we have to swap keys next time we meet up for a drive. I want to drive that 308 of yours and you can get a sense of why I just poured a ton of cash into this beauty!
     
  17. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    29,252
    socal
    Rick,

    Some would call you crazy but IMO for 355 university that total was way cheaper than a semester at USC. So for all you get out of it you have paid your dues. Good for you. I think we can call you truely devoted to the hobby. You got some street cred with me putting his money where his mouth is.
     
  18. m5guy

    m5guy Formula 3

    Aug 17, 2008
    1,627
    Ventura, CA.
    Full Name:
    Greg
    #93 m5guy, Nov 5, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2010
    Rick, thank you for posting the detailed costs for your 30K. Saw your car on Wednesday when I came down to pick up mine. Your car looked beautiful parked in the front lot.

    You did a lot more service on your car (both voluntarily and out of necessity) than mine required. As a comparison, my 30K, serviced at the same shop (and a discount applied to my invoice since I purchased the car there), came to just under $10,000 including the price of the rebuilt exhaust manifolds from Ricambi.

    Some of the major differences between my car and Rick's contributing to the lower price tag are:
    - no clutch replacement
    - OEM cats retained and in good condition
    - no David Helms wiring kit
    - no need to replace tires
    - no targa top to repaint
    - no alternator issues to fix

    Due to the traffic gridlock in Orange County, I was *forced* to drive my 355 directly to Las Vegas to attend the SEMA/AAPEX show instead of returning home to grab my truck or my Miata. This was a great shakedown for the car and it ran nearly flawlessly for the entire trip (almost 800 miles in 2 days.) We are chasing down an intermittent CEL for the fuel pump, but other than that the car runs like a champ.
     
  19. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
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    Rick
    Thanks Fatso. Yeah, I nearly forgot why I went down this path in the first place...to learn a whole bunch along the way. I'm satisfied with how much I was able to do myself and learn about but I know I've barely scratched the surface. The costs were all part of the education process and the tuition was well worth it. When the invoice was tallied up, nothing phased me...I knew exactly why each and every thing was done.

    Here's a excerpt from Adam Carolla's new book that I thought was funny...I think I'm just a notch above the guy with the cigarette now...

    Chapter three: Where have all the fellas gone?
    Far too many guys in their forties can’t turn a wrench or swing a hammer nowadays. But they have tons of opinions about the new Silver Surfer movie. It’s a sure sign of the pu--ification of America. What happened?

    Forget about actually being a man’s man — guys don’t even bother to lie about being manly anymore. It used to be a fella would at least have enough dignity that when he was driving with the missus and the car wouldn’t start, even though he didn’t know what the f--- to look for, he’d say, “Pop the hood.” He’d stand there and stare at the engine for a while, set his cigarette on top of the air cleaner, and yell, “Try it now.” Of course the engine wouldn’t start, but at least he looked like a man. Now the guy says, “Call Triple-A. I don’t want to get my cuticles dirty.”

    Greg, great to hear the car is doing well. I hope you get that CEL sorted soon. Did you do hoses? That was another big cha-ching. :)
     
  20. 3forty8

    3forty8 F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 25, 2006
    2,713
    San Diego
    Full Name:
    Eric
    Rick, great to hear the PS issue was a (relatively) minor issue; kudos on going through every detail on your service, I bet your car is in better shape than the day it rolled off the showroom floor!
     
  21. Sandy Eggo

    Sandy Eggo F1 Rookie
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    Jun 4, 2009
    3,636
    Encinitas, CA
    Full Name:
    Rick
    Eric...you must drive this car now. I only wish you had driven it before the service to know the difference. Let me know when you want to burn up some dino juice.
     
  22. wazie7262

    wazie7262 Formula 3

    Feb 13, 2008
    2,357
    Temecula, CA
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Hey Rick,

    Lemme know when you wanna go out for a drive...and you, too, of course, Eric. M5 Guy...you stole that 355! I saw it there a number of times, always with a thought of "Hmm...should I?" LOL!
     
  23. roadracer311

    roadracer311 Formula 3

    May 6, 2009
    2,398
    San Francisco
    Full Name:
    Paul
    Hey Rick,

    Nice to see the whole thing done right. Excellent work. Both Enzo's would be proud.
    (previous owner's first name is Enzo).

    Makes me want to drive mine. We've had a couple unusual warm nights in San Francisco lately, but I've been too sick to enjoy the car. Soon though, and hopefully the weather will cooperate.

    Enjoy!
     
  24. Monteman

    Monteman Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2006
    2,348
    Santa Barbara, CA
    Full Name:
    Monte
    Well done! Thanks for sharing the story along the way. Now when are you taking the wife on that trip up to Santa Barbara to test out the luggage? Maybe you can join us on one of our Cars and Coffee events?
     
  25. m5guy

    m5guy Formula 3

    Aug 17, 2008
    1,627
    Ventura, CA.
    Full Name:
    Greg
    #100 m5guy, Nov 6, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
    Rick, just looked through the service invoice. No, hoses were apparently okay so none were replaced. So there's another $1400 in parts and labor invested in your car. I have to trust Chris and Jeff at the shop to know whether they should have been replaced on mine. In retrospect I probably should have done the same as you and just asked them specifically to replace all of them.

    From wazie7262, "M5 Guy...you stole that 355! I saw it there a number of times, always with a thought of "Hmm...should I?" LOL!" Yes Scott, the low advertised selling price on the car was well thought out by the shop. They fully disclosed to me the deferred maintenance that needed to be caught up on. The money saved on the vehicle purchase was invested into the 30K Major, something we both agreed on when I purchased the car. If you combine the purchase price + service + parts (including the new manifolds) I'm all-in at close to $49K for a car with 39K miles on it. I still have some small paint work and the notorious shrinking dash to attend to over the next couple of months.

    F-Chat could use my car as a case study on the hidden value buying a properly maintained 355 (one that is current on all its maintenance.) I would say that in the end, I'm easily into the car for $4-5K more than what it could be re-sold for. But that's okay because I don't plan on selling it anytime soon (knock on wood!)

    -m5guy (Greg)
     

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