What should I offer 09 Scud 1k miles

That car is known to have issues and was discussed in another thread. At the time, the price paid was below normal wholesale... Now, not so much...

 

Well said. This logic should be utilized more often with car sales. FChat certainly seems to have some depressed prices sometimes.

 

Excellent post, the only issue with Ferrari Chat is the fact that a lot of non owners or individuals not able to buy keep posting a lot of Bull **** on here.

 

+1 Ditto

 

What a dumb thing for them to say. Doesn't make me wanna buy one now. I'll just wait 30 days.

 

The fact is Scuds aren't moving off the showroom floors. The market value is what a buyer is willing to pay. I'm not saying anything new In the meantime, cars that are consigned sit unused and not enjoyed. It's a real shame because these cars are meant to be driven.

 

"In the meantime, and despite of what Ferrari says on the advertised lap times around Fiorano, the fastest cars around a racetrack from Ferrari are the Enzo and the Scuderia (properly setup in both cases), the F458 and 599 GTO don't stand a chance at a road course against these two"

Of course, you know this to be fact...btw: which 458 and/or 599 GTO have you driven lately at a road course ...I'd be very interested to also know "what you consider a proper set up"...and what that would include for the 458 and 599 GTO?

This forum should be beyond too many without specific knowledge spouting too much bs and calling it fact....this string is, as a prior poster has said, full of both.

 

Trojan, I have not driven the F458 and 599 GTO yet. However, I read the Michelin press release about the tires supplied to Ferrari for these two cars, and about to become available to the general public in a few months in many sizes. You should already know that the compound used in the 599 GTO and F458 is from the Michelin Pilot Sport Cups.

I have too many technical info on all these cars to share. But let's keep it simple.

Bring your favorite pro-driver (unless you can drive) and GTO or F458 to Homestead or PBIR, I'll bring my Scuderia without the pro-driver ( I'll do my own driving). I have the data acquisition equipment, we plug it to the 2 or 3 cars and obtain results just to show you what I already know.

The Enzo, is a massively better track car than the Scuderia, F458, GTO, it has massive downforce and a push rod suspension, a stiffer chassis than all these road cars. The only problem with the Enzo was the intended owners, and how Ferrari had to de-tune it to make it street friendly.

Properly setup (Enzo or Scuderia) means proper wheel/tire sizes and proper alignment, not the excessive promoting understeer stock stuff. F458 got better but they added 400 lbs, they killed it with the extra weight. The GTO is a marketing flop, and lot of people are falling for it, another overweight pig (lots heavier than a F458, 700 lbs heavier than a Scuderia, put it on the scales and check it out), but at least they put the proper front fat tire.

Now, in regards to drag racing, well that's another type of event, 1/4 mile and Texas mile kind of stuff, yes the GTO and F458 triumph over a properly setup Scuderia, but the Enzo still does better.

 

By the way, these are the Ferrari claimed lap times around Fiorano for the questioned cars.

Notice the vast disparity between the Challenge cars and their street counterparts.

F458 Challenge: 1:16.5
F430 Challenge: 1:18.5
599 GTO 1:24.0
Enzo 1:24.9
Scuderia 1:25.0
F458 1:25.0

 

This is so true. If they spread enough rumors, people might think it's true.

 

Right-O. Of course, its only the tires that "did it". And the drivers employed by Ferrari, of course, are NOT professionals.

Save the diatribe for fools that neither own nor have driven either 458 or GTO. Same old, same old...rework the engine to new specs, put a twin turbo it, whatever--all you have to do is "make it faster" to make it faster...

I like the scud, a lot for that matter--drives great, certainly better than a F430--which by itself is wonderful car in its own right.

But to actually suggest that somehow you "just" know better than those that have "professionally tested and driven" all these models many, many times simply borders on lunacy...

But then, that's really what this forum is about...wishes and dreams.

 

Sorry Paul, it's F430GT that knows his way around the Scuderia too well to be taken lightly...
CH

 

I'm not suggesting I'd beat him...and I'm not dissing his ability. But the with the obvious fact of stock production car to stock production car--like, serioius, well regarded professionals have driven them (at times back to back) many times...the numbers and reports speak for themselves.

And, just "saying" you know better--doesn't make it so, esp if you've not even driven the two you say aren't as fast irrespective of what the factory and professionals say is different.

 

F458 Challenge: 1:16.5
F430 Challenge: 1:18.5
599 GTO 1:24.0
Enzo 1:24.9
Scuderia 1:25.0
F458 1:25.0

There is no end to this type of arguments. Everyone speculates and make guesses. On different given day, a car's lap time can vary by 1-2 sec. R-compound along is about 1-4 secs and there are also slicks. Settings: toe, camber and ride heights is another 1-4 secs. The test drivers can vary another .5 sec. The tires used on the Enzo versus new tires over the years for newer models. It just goes on and on. There is also possibility of Ferrari promoting new cars and making them quicker or not. Be happy with the Ferrari you have and believe in it. These cars are within 1 sec of each other.

 

Well, He offered you a pretty simple challenge, though. Bring one of those cars with a professional driver against his scud (with better tires and alignment), and see who wins. I track my scud extensively and it is very badly set-up out of the box. It understeers everywhere and always. My e63 AMG is much more neutral on the track.

The only comparable result where 458 was really faster on the track was evo's Bedford. All the other (relatively) direct comparisons are all very close. So, I think that 430GT's arguments might not be out of the realm of possibility.

 

and all of this testosterone has what to do with the OPs query?

 

Lol!

 

Word!!!

 

Seems like 190K for a '09 Scuderia is not only possible, but generous. Here's a nice black 7K mile '09 Scuderia from LFSC asking $199K: http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listingId=54010467&listingRecNum=3&criteria=sf1Dir%3DASC%26mkId%3D20014%26stkTyp%3DU%26mdId%3D21119%26rd%3D100000%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId-yrId-trId%26zc%3D90265%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-2%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf1Nm%3Dprice%26yrId%3D20201%26yrId%3D20145%26trId%3D25236%26trId%3D36545%26rpp%3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=national

Cars.com has a total of 4 Scuderias listed for less than 200.

Not surprising when some 60+ Scuderias are listed on cars.com.

 

I sat in that black Scud last winter at LFSC; WOW what a car. I love the alcantara interior, absolutely unique and screams exotic (as if the rest of the car didn't already).

Sorry, I don't recall what they were asking for it then.

 

Below 200 seems to be the new asking price for sellers with an intent to move cars. Continental AutoSports just dropped two of their nice Scuderias to asking $199K:

Black '08:
http://www.dupontregistry.com/autos/Search/DRauSearchDetails.aspx?itemid=787031

Red '08:
http://www.dupontregistry.com/autos/Search/DRauSearchDetails.aspx?itemid=885589

They also have an red '09 asking 204.

 

This thread should be closed as it's driving Scud prices down. I fear for the welfare of all the sellers.

 

It was for sale last winter. It's still for sale.

This is the real world.