Weber DCNF Problem | FerrariChat

Weber DCNF Problem

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by bigplinky, Feb 3, 2011.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. bigplinky

    bigplinky Rookie

    Feb 3, 2011
    5
    Hi, I'm new to this forum and to be honest don't have a Ferrari but I do have a Ducati 900SS with a Weber 44DCNF carb fitted which I believe is also fitted to the 308?

    Anyway I'm having big problems with this carb and can't find any answers on Ducati Forums so thought I would try here.

    For about the last 18 months the carb has been flooding the crank cases with fuel when the bike is turned off. I've fitted a full new service and gasket kit from Eurocarb and also set all the idle and balance screws to factory settings and this still hasn't helped. With the top off the carb and the float bowl full of fuel the level of the float bowl can be seen to drop by a couple off mm per day until only 3-4mm of fuel is left in the bottom, the fuel appears to be running quiet freely through the idle / low speed circuit and down over the butterflys.

    Has anybody had this problem? and if so how did you get rid of it. The bike is normally run on 95 octane unleaded fuel.

    Thanks in adavance

    Andy
     
  2. MiuraP400

    MiuraP400 Formula Junior

    Feb 3, 2008
    949
    Arizona
    Full Name:
    Jim
    Sorry I have not worked on a 44 DCNF. However, typically on Webers, it is caused by the float bowl over filling. Have you checked the petcock to see if it is leaking? Is the float level correct? The fuel level should be about 2mm below the spill over port in main jet cavity on a car, a bike may need to be lower to account for angle the carb sits at when it is parked.

    In the past I have found it benificial to take the carb off and put it one the workbench where you can see it. Then connect a hose to it and use gravity to feed it. It is much easier to find the problem when you can get a good look at it.

    Cheers Jim
     
  3. bigplinky

    bigplinky Rookie

    Feb 3, 2011
    5
    Hi Jim, Thanks for the reply

    As far as I can see the float height is to the factory figure but I have had an issue with the fuel supply to the carb not shutting off ( the return line had a leak internal to the tank and was giving a constant supply). I normally prop the bike up straighter than it would be on the prop stand alone.

    I think I do need to put the carb on the bench and get a supply going to it but might put some food colour in the fuel to help see where it is coming out.

    Thanks for your input

    Andy
     
  4. dwil

    dwil Karting

    Nov 8, 2003
    114
    ozarks
    Full Name:
    Dave Wilson
    Once i had a maserati ghibli that had a defect in the dcnf body casting
    where the contents of the bowl was leaking out into the manifold. It ran
    perfect, but before i sorted it out, i started it one morning after the cylinder
    had a bit in it just before the compression cycle and it hydro locked the
    cylinder. It bent the rod and damaged the piston. I found a used dcnf
    and transfered all of the venturies, jets, ect. and was good to go (after
    fixing the mechanical damage) Hopefully this isn't the problem with
    your carb but it is not unheard of.
     
  5. JohnMH

    JohnMH Formula 3

    Jan 28, 2004
    1,780
    Dubai / Bologna
    The seal or seat on the float valve might be leaking, or the vacuum assisted petcock diaphragm is not shutting the fuel flow to the carbs when the engine is shut off. The weight of the gasmis pushing it through the carbs when sitting. My knowledge is based on new 1990+ 900ss versions, not the old ones with bevel gears.
     
  6. CliffBeer

    CliffBeer Formula 3

    Apr 3, 2005
    2,198
    Seattle, Washington
    Full Name:
    Cliff
    It's a 40 dcnf on a 308 rather than a 44 but, you're right, basically the same carb just with a different choke in the intake.

    Typically the float bowl level will go down over some days simply because of evaporation rather than leaks (that's why a carb'd car sitting in a garage in a hot climate will often make the garage smell a little like gas). I'm trying to picture the fuel flow from the bowl through the idle and mains and can't understand how it could be leaking into the throat without vacuum draw from the intake downstream of the chokes/butterfly in a running condition. Is your dcnf leaned over on your duc?
     
  7. bigplinky

    bigplinky Rookie

    Feb 3, 2011
    5
    dwil: I'll defo look for a fault in the casting but I'm gonna have to be careful in the future till I get this fixed not to hydro lock it

    JohnMH: My duke is a 89 version so has belt drive and basically the same as the one your talking about apart from the carbs which are Mikuni on the later bike. Unfortunately I can't retro fit Mikuni's, which I would love to do, because the battery position also changed preventing this.

    CliffBeer: It's more than evaporation as I've just let about 100ml of petrol out of the sump (I don't leave oil in the bike at the moment). The idle circuit from what I can see seems to rely on fuel surface tension to stop it leaking out and I was wondering if the new 10% ethanol fuel had a lower surface tension (this problem started about 18 months ago which I think is about when this was introduced?) and this was now causing a common problem. At the moment the bike is level on it's paddock stand.

    Looks like my best route now is to get the carb off the bike again and hook it up on the bench and make 100% sure where the fuel is coming from (incase of a casting fault). I think my main question has been answered on here that this isn't a common fault and I need to do some further investigation my self on the bench.

    Thanks for your replys guys it's great to find a friendly forum.
     
  8. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    13,394
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    get the carb off the bike first.
    Did you change the float valve?
     
  9. bigplinky

    bigplinky Rookie

    Feb 3, 2011
    5
    Yeh carb has had a complete recon kit including float valve. Didn't run any fuel through the carb when it was off last time but I think that's got to be the next step.
     
  10. FiatRN

    FiatRN Formula Junior

    Nov 21, 2008
    316
    Denver, CO
    Full Name:
    Jonathan Drout
    #10 FiatRN, Feb 4, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  11. bigplinky

    bigplinky Rookie

    Feb 3, 2011
    5
    Thanks Jonathan they are more detailed than the drawings I currently have and should be a great help. I'll let you know how I get on this week.
     
  12. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 13, 2005
    95,356
    Fuggetaboutitland
    Full Name:
    Bob
    Thanks for posting those.

    Do you have any more like that?

    Bob S.
     
  13. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
    Owner Project Master

    May 10, 2006
    17,756
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    John!
    The only way raw fuel is going to dump into the manifold is if the bowl is being overfilled. Check the needle valve and float.
     
  14. ladiesman217

    ladiesman217 Rookie

    Feb 20, 2009
    25
    Frenchtown, NJ
    Full Name:
    Alex de Groot
    The weber carb is very sensitive to fuel pressure. Anything over 1.5 to 2 psi may push the needle off the seat.
     
  15. flyngti

    flyngti Formula 3

    Jul 16, 2009
    1,237
    Snohomish, WA
    Full Name:
    Eric L
    Where do you get these numbers from? We carb 308 folks run about 3.5 psi.
     
  16. ladiesman217

    ladiesman217 Rookie

    Feb 20, 2009
    25
    Frenchtown, NJ
    Full Name:
    Alex de Groot
    Just years of experience with webers. Sometimes you can run higher pressure but 2 psi is all you need and some DCNF's will push fuel past the needle and seat when you start getting up to 3 or 4 psi.
     

Share This Page