Heard a crunching sound and now im waiting for roadside assist.

A little welding and she will be as good as new. Why not, some meat head did it to the carbed engine I bought to replace the dropped valve engine in my 77GTB. What some consider acceptable these days is mind numbing.

""Mark, why is the engine toast if all you did is drop one valve?""

Because broken parts have to go somewhere....... there is debris spread throughout the engine. Aluminum engines do not take kindly to severe trauma... they bend. When used engines are as cheap as they are now, its far better not to be Penny Wise and build the replacement from a virgin platform, regardless of the direction headed.

I have some pretty wild plans being worked through for my wifes 77GTB.... budget will define the direction on this project.
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"Which would you rather have for $65k?
350 hp euro 308 (souped up 328 engine) with a flawless paint job
375 hp 355?"

I'd buy the 355 - it was made for the HP level.

 

I like the idea of the 350hp 308. That just sounds like a fun ride to me!!!




PDG

 

Mark, I have to ask. If you droped a valve does this have anything to do with Dave doing the major service?

 

Touchy...touchy...topic. Hope there's a discount there somewhere.

Ace

 

Touchy subject? Not hardly, warnings were given to limit it to 5K RPM for this very reason.

Getting the car running and making it drivable led to the car actually being driven thus subjecting it to the hazards warned about.... its always the mechanic's fault.... but everyone knows that already. The fact it was 2500 trouble free miles after the major that it decides to drop a valve...... Who needs facts to get in the way of a perfectly good argument.

 

Dave,

Even though the picture quality is poor, those are some pretty telling pictures and a great demonstration of what can happen... valve head buried in piston and no valve stem in the guide.

But... how did you get the look back at the guide?? I've tried some of the attachments for my scope and just can't get that view.

Rick

 

As far as I know a major service has nothing to do with valves other than adjustment. It seems that sodium filled valves have a known history of letting go. It makes sense - the sodium is there to cool the valve but its presence in place of a solid stem means its a weaker piece. I don't know if its feasable or reasonable to magnaflux a sodium valve engine searching for hairline fractures but even if you did that and the results were perfect that won't guarantee it's failure proof. Ferrari engines are known to be extremely strong and reliable but its inevitable that some will fail. Its just plain da*m bad luck that it happened to you Mark - but you'll recover, and so will the car!

Best Wishes,

Steve

 

How does a dropped valve raise suspicion that Dave did something untoward? Dropped valves are random, and unrelated to a major. Now, if you had said the belt failed, that might be a different issue...

 

While Chris could have been a bit more tactful, I don't think he was actually blaming you. I think he was just asking a question.

 

Sorry to hear about your loss. Heartbreaking.

 

Almost....

Hole in the piston top and you are looking at the top of the Con Rod and the wrist pin oil hole. With a valve head separated.... there is no room yet it made room.

All you have to do is convince the Medical Board that you have no intension of sticking medical instruments where you have no business sticking them. Once that is accomplished you then order a Bronchoscope made for sinus surgery, a video interface and a medical grade monitor and if you are still standing after that expenditure... have Gog take a picture of the monitor. My knees were too weak after writing that check to buy the digital photo capture.... one day... Mine has 180 degree articulation of the lens, light and flexible forcepts. By far the most valuable tool I own both in cost and usefulness.

 

Nor was it taken as such.

Talk about discounts without questions answered or even asked, that is another matter.

 

Yes, I hear you there.

I didn't really understand what I was looking at until you gave that description. Now I see it. Wow, that hurts!

 

355s have their own set of issues.

Surely your engine is rebuildable??

Although going down that road you will see the value in the $12K used engine....Dave will know.

 

Surely not...there's engines lying around everywhere....

 

If you have one in your hand for inspection the next step is to throw it away!

It's age and corrosion getting to the stem weld, at this point in time, IMO....so we have to turn the cars off and make them a bird bath???

Better to start tearing them down for preventative maintenance, and get a Boutique Foundry started on a run of new blocks....was at the NHRA Finals and IF ONLY we could get DART and MSD interested in supporting our little dark corner of the world....

John Force nearly ran over me on his scooter, with that darned Big Grin of his....LOL!

 

Knowing that the engine had 2500 miles since the major, any re-assembly issue seems highly unlikely. That wasn't clear in the OP; it read as if the failure was immediately after CT began driving the car again.

 

Does anyone know whether other sodium-filled valves are problematic? I believe they were adopted by Alfa Romeo in the 60s but I never had nor heard of any issues with them in many years of Alfa ownership.

 

Lots of engines use them in the past and currently, but not too many of them last for 30 years.

The other issue I think is the light use of Ferraris actually can increase the corrosion and failure, (lack of oiling) but that's just a hunch with absolutely no data to support it.

 

Thanks for the explanation and pictures. When the timing belt broke on my BMW, several valves made piston contact but no penetration. The dealer rebuilt the head only. That car continued as my daily driver for a long time. Hence, my question.

 

Assumptions often lead to a guilty verdict. It's all good, we are all friends here and misunderstanding typed words is very easy. I for one scan read and make the same mistake often.

I can remember doing a number of 190 MB's that dropped sodium valves back in the late 70's, early 80's but that is about it.

I am going to lean Mark towards a 2V engine design I have been working on for my wife's car, built to optimize the fuel we are stuck with now. One thing for certain, one day we will look back on this crap we are burning today and wish it were still available. Now... to make power while using it... that's the trick.

 

do 89 328 s have sodium filled valves....???

 

No, Ferrari stopped using them with 308 QV engines onwards!


P

 

Sodium valves were an unsuccessful experiment...just like timing belts.

Sadly, although they fixed the sodium valves in time for the later 308/28's, they didn't fix the belt problem for quite a few more years.