PO disconnected the AC hoses

The previous owner left the AC hoses disconnected after the major service because it was inop due to hoses gone bad. So my question is, did long term (1 yr) exposure to the atmosphere cause permanent damage to the components?

 

Were the ends covered with anything? (tape, etc) If not, there will be a potential for a lot of issues. Short of replacing all of the components, I would blast everything out with nitrogen, replace the hoses and vacuum the hell out of the system.

I'm curious why the PO didn't just replace the hose? Is it that expensive or hard to do?

 

What PRS said!

The compressor will be the big issue - the other stuff (exp valve, drier) should be replaced anyway.

 

Wont hurt most of the parts but they are not meant to take moisture. The receiver/dryer will definitely need to be replaced after being exposed for so long. If you replace the bad hoses and replace the receiver dryer, flush the system, add new AC oil and pull a good vacuum before refilling, the rest should okay.

Not using the system for so long isn't the best for the pump seals etc as the oil is not being circulated when its not being run but if it was stored indoors and heated its probably fine.

 

those hoses are hard to replace because they disappear into the body from the back to the front. And they are likely $500 a set if you get them made.

 

No plugs or tape on the hoses or ports. The car was beautifully maintained so I assume he planned to replaced the hoses but died first and his wife parked the car for 4 years with them loose. She had a $5K major done to prep the car for sale but didn't want to spend another grand on replacing the hoses and servicing/repairing the system. It was reflected in the price but I'd like to get the AC back in service at some point. Luckily, I live on the coast and really don't need it. I don't relish pulling those hoses through the chassis.

 

So are the old hoses missing completely? IT would make it a lot easier to be able to use them to pull new hose. You can buy Aeroquip hose fittings and ac hose and make your own hose a lot cheaper than buying "AC Hose for a Ferrari."

But, as has been pointed out here before, a local ac shop could probably make the hoses up at a reasonable price if you know the lengths.

Now you can get involved in the AC threads which are almost as entertaining as the belt threads, the oil threads (which subdivide into viscosity, dino vs Syn, and ZDDP), and the bleeding the cooling system threads!

 

HAHA.... LOL

 

The old hoses are in place, but from what I've read about pulling the new hoses it seems to be like passing kidney stones; it eventually makes it but the process is not appealing.

 

DW,

If you dont have any reason to believe your hoses are bad/cracked/crimped/rotted, leaking, why yank them? No need!

An 85 308 had R12 I figure, and yes, they are old, but if you stay with r12, shouldnt be a problem IF you test first for integrity (evacuate and test for vac leakage). Of course, Im sure you know about using all new O rings.......(right?)

Evacuate for 10-15 vminutes, stop, watch guage for 5-10 minutes, and if the needle does not drop, your oK, according to some shop methods. Now, if youre switching to r134a, molecule is smaller, theoretically, and youll need "barrier hoses" but word on the street is it dont matter. better still, if youre going with Duracool or other HC type, better yet, as propane molecule is bigger than any Freon out there, so leakage should not be a problem.

Good luck, Man./

 

Not necessary if youre going to charge with propane.

 

"If you dont have any reason to believe your hoses are bad/cracked/crimped/rotted, leaking, why yank them? No need!"

I don't know about that...I think I'd replace them. It would be a real PITA to leave them, service the system and THEN find they needed to be replaced.

"Not necessary if youre going to charge with propane."

How do you figure that? Vacuuming the system is a critical step in the re-charging/servicing process.

 

The shop that did the major tested the hoses and found they are indeed leakers and 26 years old. Will I have to pull the R gas tank out to replace them?

 

You shouldn't have to remove the tank. I seem to remember on my 328 that the hoses work around the tank.

 

Using vacuum to leak check is not proper procedure. If you vacuum down a system, blank off the pump and the gauge (micrometer, not manifold gauges) starts to rise, it can mean many things. It doesn't mean there's a leak in the system. Leaks need to be checked for using pressure. I use nitrogen. On a car, I'd run it up to 250-300psi and wait a while to see if there's the slightest of needle movement. I usually wait an hour to rule out any slow leak. Once the pressure test is passed, the pressure is relieved and the vacuum is started. A good vacuum will depend on the pump, hose type on the manifold gauges and ambient temperature (the warmer the better). A short vacuum on a new system is doable, but most likely won't fly on used and replaced parts. Regardless, a micrometer is your friend and it will tell you when the vacuum is complete.

 

GREAT advice and what I would do also!

Vacuum, vacuum and vacuum some more.

 

I've replaced all hoses on my 328. I had to remove the fuel tank and the front wheel arch to be able to pull the hose. There are brackets that secure the hoses in place. I only have a picture for the front but you get the idea ...
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I have a 1975 308GT4 that I'm just about to start a major set of 30kish maintenance. Knowing me, I won't get something right, and havng the AC out of the way would be very helpful. Living in the Pacific Northwest (if someone tells you to stick it where the sun don't shine, PM me, I think they mean up here) I can live w/o the air for a long time. But I want the car original eventually.

So how should you remove the compressor and "cap-off" the lines to minimize problems. Once out, I bet the compressor wouldn't go back in for a couple of years.

Gregg

 

HAHAHA, good one! This summer has been quite interesting. You might need your heat if you go out too early in the morning.

Is your system already discharged? You're in my neck of the woods, I'd be more than happy to meet up with you and see it in person and go from there.

Pete

 

The primary purpose of vacuum is not leak checking though it is usually used for that, it is to ensure there is no moisture in the system prior to charging.

 

Mike, Mike....... there is a difference in having a halogenated hydrocarbon as a refrigerant and a non halogenated one such as propane based. You do not need to evac with propane, period.

Also, much hysteria with leaving old hoses in place- just was trying to ease that "sky falling" mentality with that- thats all. Yes, vac test is not the holy grail of a true leak test, just a good part of it. One should actually charge first with PARTIAL charge, usually, only about a 1/2 to a pound of gas, then check for leakage with many methods out there. Dont want to beat this to death. very little gamble with leaving old hoses in place, especially a 308 that required much hassle removing/replacing hoses (no, I have never done that, but understand its not "fun", eh??) Everything is a cost/benefit analysis, and in this case, In just recomending to the OP he takes that chance, Then, its up to him. Again, the good thing is if you use propane, molecule is bigger, so less chance for leakage. Like I said, if the hoses are bad, CHANGE THEM.

Even with a good integrity system, you WILL loose refrigerant, so no need to expect perfection. (you can loose up to 4 oz/year and never detect it...too small for detection limits)

 

Moisture is not a problem with propane. But Im sure you meant to imply it is a problem with halogenated refrigerants, which is correct and prudent.

 

I am not an ac expert with years of experience, as I have said here before. I became a reluctant ac tech because ac shops were unable to achieve satisfactory results with my 328.

I don't know anything about the chemical reaction of water with refrigerants; my understanding is that moisture in the system occupies space that refrigerant is supposed to. If you charge a system by weight, and there is any moisture in it, the system pressure will be too high. If you charge based on pressure/temp readings, you will have insufficient fridge for effective operation.

I'm happy to learn more and I'd like to understand why propane would be immune to this issue. Fwiw, duracool instructions are to pull the same vac you would with 12/134.

 

That and moisture also corrodes/damages the alloy compressor internals over time. Which is why vaccing down is EXTREMELY important. The longer the better in my book.

 

Exactly. A micron gauge is a must to doing things right. (I said micrometer in a previous post, oops) You won't know when the vacuum is complete without one. The longer the vac, the better. That is of course after pressure testing for leaks Moisture doesn't care what refrigerant is being used.