OMG CEL on 2003 360 Spider $9K ???

Jeff, are your headers legal for use on pollution-controlled highway-driven motor vehicles?

(That, BTW - is a "yes" or "no" answer)

 

Yes. Adding our headers will continue to allow you pass your local emission/smog test. In comparison to the primary cats, the pre-cats in the stock headers are not that important. If you remove the primary cats, you will most likely not be in compliance of emissions laws.... however, many people still do it.

Jeff
[email protected]

 

Jeff, "passing emissions" is not the problem.

The problem is that removing pre-cats is a violation of the laws of this country.

Federal and State.

It's called "emissions TAMPERING"

A quick JFGI of "emissions tampering" shows that CA, OH, MA, TX, UT, and WI all have emissions tampering laws. I'll bet you that nearly every state has similar laws - even if they don't have emissions TESTING.

If you install a set and that car drives out of your facility - and the EPA finds out - you will discover what the initials BUFU stand for.

Think I'm kidding?

Read: http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resources/decrees/civil/caa/casper-cd.pdf

Imagine having to "buy back" at retail every set of headers you ever made - then having the EPA also impose a huge fine - and if you miss one payment - one dollar - WHAM it's federal prosecution and FPMITAP time. (Federal Pound-Me-In-The-Ass Prison)

If a customer buys them and a shop installs them - same problem - the SHOP is now on the hook for emissions tampering - and most shops are smart enough to NOT want to deal with it. If they're stupid - they WILL eventually get caught. Usually by their state.

If a customer buys them and self installs - then THEY are on the hook. Unless you told them that they are emissions legal (which includes the nebulous "They will 'pass emissions'") in which case the onus is back on you as well.

The EPA shows NO mercy.

I can tell you that the DEQE in Utah also shows NO mercy.

Local shops get "rewards" for turning in tampered cars.

They get fines if they don't turn them in (yes, the powers-that-be DO send in test cars to judge the "motives" of muffler/etc shops)

Jim

 

Jim, I have no disagreement with you. Even back in the early '70s when cars ran terribly with the archaic (compared to today) emissions controls, I would not ever disconnect one.

But Ferrari owners are caught between a rock and a hard place in that by following the law strictly, they risk huge consequential damages to the engine. I'm not condoning replacing OEM with pre-catless headers nor am I commenting on the law, but doing so motivated by the need to avoid replacing what is essentially not only a defective part but one that could cause catastrophic engine loss, with another of the same defective design, to me is much different than the O2 emulator case you linked us to, where the main point of doing so, if not sole goal, was to profit from removing key emissions controls that had a direct, substantial impact on increased emissions in all modes.

I don't know if a pre-catless car will pass the EPA cycle (does it include a cold start?), but it seems to me that productive energy could be spent convincing EPA and CARB (and other states) that the cost/benefits of strict pre-cat compliance here are out of line with enforcement goals and to grant an exemption to allow pre-catless replacements. It's not like we're talking about hundreds of thousands of cars here. I'll bet the incremental increase in cold start pollution from pre-cat vs. pre-catless for all cars so affected is less than the entire annual pollution output of a single Prius.

 

Allow me to say as nicely as possible...

You'd have as much chance of convincing the EPA or CARB to allow pre-cats to be removed as you would pole-vaulting across the grand canyon

What would make sense would be for someone to make a "better" set of headers with a metal-matrix catalyst as a "pre-cat".

It would be both emissions legal and safer for the car.

 

I figured as much re EPA/CARB. Probably odds for canyon jump would be better. I'd easily go for a quality set of headers with a "safe" pre-cat if they were available. They would still need to be approved by EPA and CARB, though, to be strictly legal in California.

 

Mine is like that, too, but it still seals. I don't see why gluing the sealing portion back onto the metal portion would make a difference in sealing the filler. Keeping the two portions together is more for convenience and damage avoidance, isn't it, since if they fall apart the seal can drop to the ground? That, could result in a bad seal.

If you find a good way to glue it together, please do tell, however.

 

If they had decent pre-cats they could pass the necessary tests (FTP-75, etc) to be certified by CARB - which EPA will then accept.

It's just a matter of paperwork, an independent emissions lab, and money.

Been there, done that.

 

Just happened to spot this as a possible alternative today........

http://www.superformance.co.uk/a-360/eg.htm

At Stg£46.95 I can't imagine it's a genuine article if the normal price is $500 to $700 but maybe the price you quoted above is for something else or gas cap complete with replacement filler neck or something?
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Speeding is against the law also, do you never go above the speed limit?

 

I once purchased a pillow from Macy's. When I got home, to my dismay someone had already taken the tag off my pillow. As it's unlawful to remove the tag prior to the sale and delivery of a pillow to the final consumer, I quickly returned to the store and told them this is a violation of Title 15 - Commerce and Trade, Chapter 2, Subchapter V - Textile Fiber Products Identification, Section 70c. Naturally, I put Macy's on notice and if I see any further violations I would take my greivance up with the FTC.

 

OMG, I am rolling on the floor right now.

 

Crazy LOL

 

Go easy with the bead of "what ever you use". Maybe just a few strategically placed dabs. All those tiny holes are there for a reason.

 

Good advice but I think our OP has already been busy. Hopefully without being too liberal with the glue!

 

Jim,

You make some great performance chips for the Bimmers. When first saw your name on this forum a while back I saw your name I was wondering if you were "the" Jim Conforti and obviously u r. (I've had Bimmers in the past and often added things like super charger etc).

Did the EPA regs impact how you had to design your Jim Conforti Chips? Reason I ask is first I thought you were going a little overboard about the emissions speech however with your business being the science of changing fuel/air ratio's, timing, etc you probably do have quite a bit of first hand business experience on this subject (EPA and manufacturers of aftermarket parts that effect emissions).

And as a disclosure, do aftermarket exhausts (such as the removal of precats), affect the way your chips perform?

 

+1, very good point!