Hi gang... Was under the 355 today. Took off the diffusers to try and get to the water pump stepper hose and having a general sniff around and i came across this!! The drivers side bolt on the steering rack was loose...??!!! I realy give my car a pounding and i shudder to think what wouldve hapenned at 100mph if it came off? Any ideas as to what could have caused this?? As far as i know the service records show no one has messed with the rack.. Also the rust on the pass side? from water stepper pump leaking? I havent tried to tighten it yet but just looking at it i think the bolt has been threaded... Is there another bolt on the top side of the rack that i cant see nor get too on the P clamp? And if so how the hell do i get to it? Rack out job? regards pk Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Interesting... Last month I also had to tighten a bolt on my 355s steering rack. Happened exactly the same, I took out the front under panel to do some work and found I had a loose bolt. I track the car and when on open road I drive it hard, don´t know if this could be related. By the way, to get to those bolts you have to access through the trunk.
The 355 had at least a couple of recalls on steering rack/column tightness. Here's one http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/apps/recalls/searches/expand.asp?uniqueID=2512E18FC45BEEF180256BB90026920F&freeText=Blank&tx= Hopefully I managed to cut & paste the link successfully with my iPhone. Bob.
According to that webpage my car is out of all those recalls, but as I said I had a loose bolt. May be worth checking it out just in case fchatters. When I saw it my first impression was HOLY S&%T!!!!! But being just one bolt I think it isn´t that dangerous (not that it isn´t dangerous at all) the clamp still holds with the upper bolt.
Thanks for the collective input guys..i just posted this to warn other F chatters in case they might have a similar problem.. Arturin.. to access the bolts i removed the TOP carpet liner in the trunk but i cant remove the lower trunk lining.. Do i have to do this to access the bolts or just fold it back at the firewall section?
Being the lower bolt I just tightened it with a spanner from below. To be honest I was concentrating on other things and didn´t realize the normal access was through the trunk until I finished tightening it. You have to take out the rubbers that cover the access holes (you can see them in your pictures). I don´t know if by removing the top carpet you can access them. You can tell us now that youre at it Image Unavailable, Please Login
Yikes..!! The p clamp holding the rack on the drivers side here in AUS RHD was COMPLETELY LOOSE!! Iinstalled a screwdiver between the back of the rack and the firewall and it rocked the distance of about 3-4cm back and forwards..The bottom bolt was only 1/4 of its thread in.!!. The top bolt 1/2 way in..!! And to think i was driving the car with the gay abandon of someone who had just been granted eternal life!! NO car ive ever had has had this sort of life threatening problem!!! Furthermore this must be a recurring problem with the car because the PLASTIC INSPECTION PLUG was MISSING!! And im the 3rd owner and i know that the first 2 owners didnt work on their cars.. so conclusion... DEALER service RELATED? The bolts are easy to get to just peel away the lower liner from the firewall and remove the plastic plug and u need a 13mm socket... The problem i had was that they take a lot of turns to tighten... at first i thought the bolts were threaded but after a while they started to grip.. Now how much to tighten??!! Im sure weve all snapped off bolts in the past and to snap one off here would be a disaster!! And in the back of my mind is DO IT TIGHT!! or else it will happen again... DILEMMA BIG TIME!!! LOCKTITE??!! hmm then maybe i cant get it off again or worse it snaps off on removal? Heres some pics and thanks once again to everyone for their input.. I urge all owners to do a quick check of their steering rack... for youre own peaqce of mind..!! regards pk.. PS Should i locktite the bolts? Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Thanks for the post, just shows how important this website is. I should spend more time here...... Things like this should be noted and made sticky for future members. So nothing is missed.
How do i start... My guts told me something was wrong here so i pulled the bolts to investigate... As i was pulling them out the drivers side Upper bolt felt like it was grabbing and releasing as it came out.. like it was under tension throught about halfway through a full turn and then went loose for the other half of the turn.. The lower bolt on the p clamp was similar but not as pronounced.. I took out the lower bolt on the pass side for comparison.,. came out easlily.. Then i inspected the bolts.. SONAFAB@#%... Some CLOWN CROSSTHREADED THE BOLTS ON THE DRIVERS SIDE!! The First pic is of the bolts as removed..The 2 on the LHS are from the drivers side. The other the pass side.. Notice the drivers side ones have BLACK SH!TE on them? THREAD REPAIR? THe second photo is after i cleaned them.. When you run your finger down the bolts The drivers top bolt feels BLUNTED.. The drivers bottom bolt is blunted but not as much..fURTHERMORE the drivers bolts are more threaded in the last 3-4mm closest to the head of the bolt.. The pass bolt feels crisp and BITEY and is the way it should be... WHAT NOW??!! Retap the thread and new bolts? Retap thread with oversize bolts? Use same bolts with just threadlocker Use same bolts with thread repair? Arturin... Please check out your bolts Ill bet this is what has happened to your car... comments please anyone...!! Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Mine felt tight when I tightened them, but after seeing your pics I think I´ll take your advice and check them when I have some time to work on the car.
If I were in your position (and I have been in similar predicaments in the past, beleive me) I'd helicoil it in a heartbeat and it would never worry me ever again. With a helicoil you'll be able to stay with the standard bolt size and they are STRONG.
Helicoil, timesert,gernsert... you are right But how the hell do you drill straight at a 90 degree angle from the trunk?!! How do you drill the shoulder for the timesert... youl be drilling the p clamp what if i just god hardened steel bolt replica of the original and just grind it in...then if u stuff it up then try thr timesert?? regards pk
Just checked mine, I couldn´t wait I´ll just won´t eat today The bolt I tightened with a spanner last time was still tight. I have tightened it through the access in the trunk with proper tools and it was really tight, as much as both of the passenger side. On the other hand, the upper bolt which I expected to be ok was just a tiny bit loose. I´ve tried to tighten it like the other ones but happened the same as to you, it started like jumping. I could tighten it but not as hard as the other ones. Took the bolt out and it is exactly the same as the ones in your pics. I have rethreaded the bolt like "stock" ( M8 x 1.25) and this time I could tighten it a bit harder but still it ended up "jumping" I feel like if I retap the hole with the same meassure it will fix. The problem is how to reach the hole perfectly. I will have to fabricate something. Anybody knows at how much torque should these bolts be tightened???
Yeah, could be worthwhile just to try that first. The threaded hole *might* be in reasonable shape, but I would always run a thread chaser or tap in there first to clean up the thread. If the thread is clogged all you will do by ramming a bolt in there is to push the debris along stripping out all the remaining thread. Ask me how I know!! So, I would use plenty of lube, a thread chaser, and go half a turn forward, quarter turn back and every few turns take the chaser out and blow out the swarf until you go right through. To be fair the bolts don't look too bad so you might get away with it. Good luck mate.
Ok, If I´m not wrong according to the servive manual (page F52 of the service manuals second volume), the tightening torque of the m8 bolts of the steering box (this is supposed to be the steering rack right???) to the chassis is 20Nm which in my opinion is not that much, so I think that all this problems we are experiencing have to do more with overtightening than crossthreading. I´ll check mine again and if its at 20 Nm I´ll just leave it there.
Arturin... You need to take the bottom bolt out to check it.. Why? Because when i tightened my bolts they were the same as your lower one..ie same tightness as the pass side... nice and tight yes...BUT! I knew the simple fact that bolts just dont come loose for no reason.. there is an underlying problem there so just tightening them wont fix the issue THEY WILL COME LOOSE AGAIN!!! There was just far too many turns before the bolt became very tight.. And you cant afford to take that chance... In the months prior to this i always felt the car a bit jumpy.. i hammered it onto the freeway entry ramp one day and the car hit a tyre sized scoop on the road... THE CAR JUMPED UP in the air and when i landed i was in another lane... Not even my ****BOX Valiant does this... I reckon the way to go was as said... Rethread with stock bolt size and thread and try this with new bolts and threadlocker.. If it fails at least you can go up in size or time insert but better still gernsert.. WE HAVE BEEN SABOTAGED GENTLEMAN.. I looked through the service records NO record of a steering rack out ever done.. This was done by a dealer service mechanic .. no owner apart from me has ever touched the car.. And quite frankly afterwhat ive suferred at the hands of so called ferrari dealer experts none of them ever will.. Come hell or highwater ill be doing all the service work now.. They have scratched my car and even glued the paint chip back on to cover their tracks. They broke off anunderfloor pipe while doing a major ..again not telling me.. And as for the bills.. whatever resale value comes from stamped books is chewn upby them anyway.. I trust none of them... God i wish we had ferrari Mechanics like Dave Helms here.. I believe that because of the difficulty in getting the bolts in the thread hole the mechanics put them in them 5-10 degrees away from the horizontal plane... and thats why the threads nearest the hex head are stuffed more.. Why? because the angle of insertion is such that while the distal end of the bolt digs in the female thread of the firewall the thread nearest the hex head rubs on the P clamp and gets chewed out.. Any opinion as to the best solution would be appreciated.. regards pk
I use 90 degree air drills. Dotco are my faves, but they are not cheap, so a cheaper one may be ok if you are not going to use it very often. http://www.bestairdrill.info/?s=90+Degree+Air+Drill
Hmm.. Just read you post Arturin. 20NM huh? Maybe your right and its just a case of overtightening.. But realy thats stuff all.. isnt it? Im going to retap with m8 1.25.. Buy new bolts and try the 20Nm... of not then a bigger tap and if that fails gernsert.. A tap set with 2 spirit levels built in would work but where to find such an iten Let me know how you go.. Oh BTW Where in the manual does it state the torque figure of 20NM cheers pk
The bolts don't show any sign of cross threading - they show the effect of being loose (when loose, the bracket can wiggle around and blunt/wear on the the threads near the head). I would replace the bolts with new ones and use a removable locktite to avoid them coming loose again. While it is possible that the loose bolts have also worn the female part of the threads, as long as you can get full torque, you should be OK - else re-tap to a larger bolt/helicoil.
Radix.. imust say i completely agree with you and Arturin...Your combined input has cleared this matter in my mind for me.. God knows to what misguided steps it would have taken me were it not for both your help.. Another example of the value and teamwork that ferrari chat is based on.. THANKS AGAIN to everyones input cheers pk
