Thanks for the input guys. So I'm back in biz with Wilwood ... their offsets did not include the thickness of the rotor so I have many options. I would really like to know if the Superformance are full floating. Paul ... are your Coleman pieces full floating? cheers
No, the calipers are dual pistons fixed as per what you did with your setup. The hats "float" on the lub bolts. Coleman cut their rotors to my exact size. Part of their offerings. Part number D30-137-150. Directional vane solid rotors solid mount. Thickness 1.25"; Diameter 12.8125". FYI, lug bolts - M14 x 1.5 70mm (I shortened the front lub bolts a touch for the Gorilla brand acorn lug nuts. - Use regular lug nuts on the track). P.S. Now that I think about it, the setup does not float. I recall shimming the calipers... it's been awhile since I touched them.
Thanks for the input and details. Just to clarify, when I'm asking about "floating" I'm talking about the disc relative to the hat. There are several different methods I've seen to accomplish this, and then there are some that don't float at all. If the discs are just bolted to the hats they're not floating ... appreciate you checking that out if possible ... and you guys with the Superformance kit . I just ordered some pretty high quality 1.25" thick rotors that I can shoe horn into these calipers. I also ordered a cheap non floating style hat for mock up and then will order the floaters once I know it'll all work ... that is if the belief is that I need to go with a floating style rotor??? ... pretty sure that's necessary for any kind of real heat application vs. drag racing etc. cheers
I was just looking over the Coleman website. They have a floating rotor/hat line. Looks good. Of course, there is more that one way to skin the cat... Keep us posted.
I'm over here too! I just haven't gotten around to posting my long-winded, endless rebuild thread on FChat as well. As soon as I finish my darn apartment renovation / garage-mahal build I'll get back into the 308 and eventually post the thread over here as well to add to the FChat archives. Back to brakes though... I'm like a kid waiting for Christmas right now. I bought a set of late model Ferrari brakes off of ebay last week and they're supposed to arrive tomorrow. I'll post some pics (assuming that I don't receive two boxes full of bricks). I'm still probably a year away from installing them, but it was too good of a price to pass up.
This is our track brake set, full floating and no e-brake. Three times the braking force and the entire set up is one pound lighter than stock. six piston front four piston rear 12.25 front rotors 12.0 rear rotors. 16" wheels only, compete with all hardware made in canada/usa. track proven. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Finished doing a mod on a S/C NSX that I did a full brake system for. These came off a Winston Cup car that I made the mounts for. I used the regular Brembo e-brake kit. The rotors are RB's full floating. Peel the skin right off your face. John Image Unavailable, Please Login
Nice gents! ... thanks for sharing! If my "sponsor" (Registgt4 ... long banned) wouldn't have sent me these calipers I would've done something with aftermarket calipers, and as I was wrapping up my game plan for this project yesterday I did some additional research on calipers. I was very happy to find that any decent radial caliper capable of accepting a 1.25" rotor would be around $500/pc, so any additional pain I'm going thru to make these Brembos work is worth it. Also, to mess with my head just a little bit more, I discovered that Regis had sent me two different widths of calipers ... a bit more research I think what I have is a pair of 964 fronts and a pair of 993 rears which will not take a 1.25" rotor. They will take a 1" and that would be a huge improvement. The only bummer was I couldn't find an "off the shelf" rotor with the 8 x 7" hole pattern the hats have. There are plenty of guys (inlcuding myself) that will machine blanks but I'm trying to use "wearing" parts that are readily available. Also, the pads for these calipers are the same as 348's. I'm really shocked that all the Porsche's up until 1989 had the same size front pads as our 308's, yet I don't recall the constant complaining about weak brakes from the P crowd. My 911s has full floating aluminum hats from the factory which I think many P cars came with from the factory ... would this alone create much better heat transfer away from the rotor or is it a ducting issue? ... the cars were not much lighter in the 80's ... my "S" only weight 2200#'s so its obvious why it "pulls the skin" off my face ... how do the later P cars do it with these little pads like what is on the 308? ... just larger rotors? BTW, my stock 308 brakes are completely adequate for even aggressive street driving ... decending down a 5000 foot grade "on the pipe" at every opportunity is completely different ... my point being when guys talk about the 308's having weak brakes for typical driving they need to have them properly serviced before contemplating such a massive upgrade (see my comments about Porcsche brakes above) ... there is only about 2-3 seconds before each corner and I would estimate there is 40 total ... any brake engineer would cringe at such a duty cycle . cheers
Air flow / ducting plays a major part in keeping the brakes working properly - pads are designed to work in a specific heat range - something to keep in mind while you go though your various combinations. I know when I was tracking an old E-type Jag (many years ago), the installation of ducting alone made a world of difference in the car's braking ability.
You'll need to run a bigger master cylinder; consider my modified one for sale on Ebay or Tilton (bigger bucks) Ferrari 308 brake pedal assembly & master cylinder http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3984Q2em1555Q2el2649QQitemZ280725845592QQsspagenameZSTRKQ3aMESELXQ3aIT Image Unavailable, Please Login
UPS man came today... Take-offs from a 430 that the owner was swapping a big brake kit onto. This is what I'll run when I get done with the engine rebuild and do the brakes, suspension, and wheels. I picked up a set of 360 wheels on the cheap off of ebay a few months ago, which should provide enough clearance. All four corners are identical. Same brakes were used on the 360 as well from what I understand. The 430 is the last V8 to use the 108mm bolt pattern. 330mm x 28mm 4 piston calipers - 38/42mm pistons Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
You are correct. The math is: Pressure output of master cylinder = Force output of the pedal assembly / effective area of master cylinder piston. So, as the MC piston area increases, the pressure output of the MC decreases, assuming that the force applied to the pedal and the pedal leverage ratio are held as constants.
i used a (manual) proportioning valve and different pads for front and rear. Getting it to work was not that hard. Furthermore i used a bigger mastercilinder to decrease force and increase displacement of fluids the disks of the 430 seems about the same as of the 360? I initially planned to use the 360 disks but found them way too heavy. My current setup weights about 3 pound less than stock, per corner!
Bert, Were you able to reuse the factory fluid reservoir with this master cylinder? Have any pictures? Thanks, Rick
My rotors will be on UPS today . I'm not seeing the need for the larger master cylinder on my setup ... am I missing something? I have one, but I'm not understanding the need for it with just the front caliper upgrade. cheers
my choice for a bigger bore MC was given by a wish to reduce some on the clampingforce AND increase a little on the pumped quantity as obviously the 360 calipers use quite some more fluid to get the same movement. It turned out pretty well. With only the fronts ( but why not do the rears as well?) you will probably won't need both that much.
If I read this correctly, you are changing the fronts but leaving the rear brakes stock? I would seriously rethink this. To work properly, the entire system has be designed as a whole. Otherwise, I my opinion, you are wasting time and money. Regarding the master, please do the math. I can not see how a single stock master can be the most efficient way to handle the new calipers. For instance, I have dual masters - rear master 1" and front 1 1/8". Moderate pressure (20lbs) brings the car down quickly (I have 2 brake pressure guages mounted in the car to monitor braking pressures and bias). Please note there are others out there with more theory and real time knowledge than me. I'm just passing on what I know really works with my car and setup.
Yep, if anything the line connectors are slightly further apart but the original lines can be connected without a problem. Though it would be a good time to renew if still original. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Good to know. Thanks, Steven. Right now I'm leaning towards a dual tilton setup, but it's still at least a year until I install all of this. So, plenty of time to plan. I think the 430 and 360 brakes are identical. The discs are pretty heavy - I'm not even sure that I'll be able to use them as the offset is most likely quite different vs. the 308. But, they are good for reference when setting everything up, and not hard to replace with aftermarket since they are relatively common 13" (330mm).
Btw, these look like a pretty good deal. No affiliation, but I deliberated between them and the 430s. They're larger front to rear, so even easier to setup with a single MC. Just a thought. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Ferrari-F355-Brake-Calipers-pads-and-misc-parts-/320746636458?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4aadfd44aa
Awesome, thank you. One more question and I'll shut up and order one. Are rebuild parts readily available for these master cylinders? Rick
